Welcome to the Tigers Jacob Hopper

[Tortured Tiger]

I don’t think I ever read or heard GWS saying they were disappointed that Hopper wants out. It is a salary dump and GWS chose to let T&H go as they were the easiest to move. What normal club would allow 2 players of their abilities go in one off season??

Here you go. Tim Taranto and Jacob Hopper have been the subject of much speculation about their playing future amidst strong interest from three big Melbourne clubs.

The Giants are rumoured to be facing an "exodus" of players come trade period, with Taranto and Hopper among the names speculated to be heading towards the exit.

Just days after Adam Kingsley was announced as the Giants' new senior coach, GWS Giants' GM of Football Jason McCartney has stated that the club would be keen to see the duo remain in charcoal heading forward.

I think people are getting confused about what a salary dump actually is. Gold Coast didn't want Brodie or Bowes or their big contracts so they were willing to give clubs draft picks to take them and their over inflated salaries, this certainly isn't the case with Taranto and Hopper.

 

[waiting]

I share your concerns but if we don’t get Hopper in I reckon our midfield doesn’t bat deep enough for the Tiges to win another premiership with this playing group.

As Poshman stated whoever we pickup with next years picks will not impact on any near term premierships.

The cost is the cost.

No I agree with you, Poshman and others. Getting Hopper with Taranto and with our current group is an all assault at Flag 14.

I understand that. I truly do.

But I couldn’t stomach another period like I endured from 1983-2016. I’ve included our seasons of finals but ultimately it’s flags a club gets measured by not just making finals or being uncompetitive for long periods.

You want sustained success. Obviously. You want to give your players every possible chance every year. Obviously.

I don’t want to end up like Hawthorn. A recent case study!

With those two added gives us a huge opportunity.

Let’s hope we clean up those issues we had this year. It’s was brain fade stuff from mostly experienced players and also poor goal kicking.

 

[waiting]

Exactly. And people are worrying about what happens in 5 years time.

FFS in 5 year time we won’t have Martin Lynch Prestia Jack Cotchin Grimes Nank etc.

The time to strike is now.

In case people forget we are in the business of winning premierships.

Of course we are but you also got to develop the next gen of kids to keep giving sustained opportunity to put yourself in the best position to get 15, 16 etc..

Agree with you.

I look for now but I also forecast ahead.

 

[Tortured Tiger]

Of course we are but you also got to develop the next gen of kids to keep giving sustained opportunity to put yourself in the best position to get 15, 16 etc..

Agree with you.

I look for now but I also forecast ahead.

We need to remember that a successful team would get just one pick in the top 30, we had five last year so surely that has to give us some credits for a year or two. We all want our cake and eat it too but something has to give if you are bringing in established talent.

 

[Little Ziggyadee]

What's the hold up?

The flogs at GWS taking calls from Hocking

 

[Smoking Aces]

My error that post 1511 was wrongly sent and Ihave deleted it.

Thanks for your thoughts Posh.
We clearly don't agree.
As I see it you can call it a cash dump or a fire sale or whatever you wish but GWS are engaged in a sale of assets, which they would have preferred to avoid.
Their decisions turn not on the lack of quality of the players in question, but on the impact of getting rid of each of Bruhn, Hopper and Taranto will have on their TPP.

Hopper would be a great pick up but in my opinion he is not worth us trading into a position where we will have no trade picks to speak of over the next two seasons. Instead we should offer Soldo if he is agreeable, plus his salary x 2 years, plus pick 31 and a future 2nd. If GWS refuse that offer, they would be left to their own devices and we should inform Hopper of our intent to offer an enhanced contract from season 2024, and ask him to see out his contract and come to us as a free agent.

We would then get to keep our future1st, 31 and Soldo.

The same thing happened to Dunkley. He wanted to go to the Essendon. A trade was not done. He is now out of contract. Guess what he has now chosen Brisbane. There is no guarantees that Hopper will choose us again in 12 months time.

Plus you lose face with the player and also any future player we want to trade in.

 

[Smoking Aces]

Of course we are but you also got to develop the next gen of kids to keep giving sustained opportunity to put yourself in the best position to get 15, 16 etc..

Agree with you.

I look for now but I also forecast ahead.

We did that last year by picking 5 kids in the draft and 1 in the mid season draft. That’s not neglecting the future.

Constantly going to the draft and not utilising trade period or FA is not a sound list management strategy.

 

[waiting]

The same thing happened to Dunkley. He wanted to go to the Essendon. A trade was not done. He is now out of contract. Guess what he has now chosen Brisbane. There is no guarantees that Hopper will choose us again in 12 months time.

Plus you lose face with the player and also any future player we want to trade in.

That’s the big thing isn’t it?

A player wants to come to you. You somehow got to try and get it done.

Dunkley though ( his manager ) didn’t do proper due diligence to see how this trade could be done as he chose Brisbane with everyone knowing they had two very good kids ( 2 top round picks ) in Ashcroft & Fletcher and points required after bids????

Was Ill advised I feel.

 

[BillyJean17]

We did that last year by picking 5 kids in the draft and 1 in the mid season draft. That’s not neglecting the future.

Constantly going to the draft and not utilising trade period or FA is not a sound list management strategy.

Exactly , 6 talented kids in , 2 mid20s guns to replace outgoing. Next year we bring in more talented kids , list strategy going nicely . Seriously you could have 5 picks and still not get2 of TT and JH qty , look at our last 10 r1 pics

 

[daniel30]

How ironic they take 18 from the cats , but want 31 a player and future first I would tell them to screw it.

 

[BrisTiger24]

The same thing happened to Dunkley. He wanted to go to the Essendon. A trade was not done. He is now out of contract. Guess what he has now chosen Brisbane. There is no guarantees that Hopper will choose us again in 12 months time.

Plus you lose face with the player and also any future player we want to trade in.

Bobby Hill the same. Chose Essendon last year, traded to Collingwood this year.

We need to do all we can do to facilitate Hopper but can't sell the farm to appease GWS being *smile*.

 

[Smoking Aces]

It staggers me in general how some of the AFL pundits are so scared about ‘buying’ a premiership. Let’s not overpay because the kid who we don’t even know will play for us might not get picked or the 23rd player on our list might get traded.

Sport is a ruthless business. It’s what you need to win the ultimate prize.

Look at other sporting models. For example Man City. Have more trophies that you can poke a stick at but are never satisfied. This is because succsss generates $$$$. It’s that simple. Bottoming out or being a middle of the road team kills your club.

You take every opportunity granted to you.

 

[King Kong]

How ironic they take 18 from the cats , but want 31 a player and future first I would tell them to screw it.

Bruhn hasnt got 15 Brownlow votes in a season. Dennis has.

Bruhn will be lucky to get 15 votes in his career

 

[Smoking Aces]

Bobby Hill the same. Chose Essendon last year, traded to Collingwood this year.

We need to do all we can do to facilitate Hopper but can't sell the farm to appease GWS being *smile*.

Yep true.
But we aren’t selling the farm. Selling the farm would be trading Bolton or Rioli.

We are trading out an unknown commodity (the draft pick) and a fringe player.

 

[Smoking Aces]

Bruhn hasnt got 15 Brownlow votes in a season. Dennis has.

Bruhn will be lucky to get 15 votes in his career

Don’t tell the media that.

They making out like Geelong has just got Judd, Martin and Franklin.

 

[keepa lids onit]

Agree with going for a flag in 23 and/or 24. We have the strike now 100%!!!!
Who knows what will happen in 25 and beyond? What we don know now is that we have a neucleus of players who won us 3 flags and most of those are still there (yea albeit older, but if we beat norf and GC we would have finished top 4 again in 22 and had a good shot at it again). So yes we should try and get both TT and JH. That will put us in prime position for 1-2 more shots at it!
Problem I have is that we already paid 2 x first Rd picks for TT. And now we have to pay another First 31 and a player for JH. Two of the 3 ok but they r pushing us for ALOT!!
When u compare that to what all the other teams are paying we will be paying overs on BOTH, not 1 but both, and to the same club. Why us and why on both trades???? Instead of GWS coming to the party they go the other way and want MORE and MORE!

 

[Ricemagic]

In the 2019 Finals Series $700,000 a year Tim Taranto finished 2nd in the AFL Coaches Gary Ayres Finals MVP Voting behind some D Martin bloke

In the Giants first finals game vs the Dogs, Taranto was voted BOG by the coaches - 10 votes, some bloke Jacob Hopper was 2nd best on ground - 7 votes
(How many teams are trading/drafting in two players in the same year and who will or who have finished the best two on the ground in a finals game?)
In the Giants Preliminary Final win versus the Pies, Taranto was 4th best on ground for 3 votes..

Taranto's Grand Final game versus us wasn't too bad, he finished with 30 touches, 5 marks, 7 tackles, 5 clearances, 15 contested possessions, 18 uncontested possessions so he came to play on the big stage. It's also highly likely if he got a couple more touches to have 32-34 for the day and kicked a goal or two, he could have got 6-7 votes to equal Dusty on 19 or edge him at 20 votes and won the Finals MVP!! (Hopper's GF 19 disposals, 1 goal, 9 tackles, 4 clearances, 8 contested, 11 uncontested).

What's your confidence levels pick 12, 19, next years First, or pick 31 will go to this level?
What's your confidence level two of the above four picks are going to be BOG and 2nd BOG in a Finals game within their first 4 years on the list? (Taranto did in his 3rd year, Hopper did in his 4th year)

I'm still looking for $700,000 per year Jack Bowes on the FInals MVP voting for the period 2018-2022, but no luck yet
Tanner Bruhn a pick 12 but lost 50% of his value now down to a pick 18 in just two years is also M.I.A. from Finals voting.

 

[momentai]

The same thing happened to Dunkley. He wanted to go to the Essendon. A trade was not done. He is now out of contract. Guess what he has now chosen Brisbane. There is no guarantees that Hopper will choose us again in 12 months time.

Plus you lose face with the player and also any future player we want to trade in.

Right. He wanted to go to Essendon and has now had second thoughts.

 

[BrisTiger24]

Yep true.
But we aren’t selling the farm. Selling the farm would be trading Bolton or Rioli.

We are trading out an unknown commodity (the draft pick) and a fringe player.

A future 1st and pick 31 are good enough picks to pick up a Bolton. Adding Soldo with nothing coming back. Might not be the farm but it's some pretty high grade studs that could contribute to the future of the farm

 

[Ricemagic]

Their four finals games in 2019

Hopper – 30 disposals, 4 tackles, 4 inside 50’s, 7 clearances, 19 contested, 12 uncontested
25 disposals, 3 marks, 3 tackles, 2 rebounds, 2 inside 50’s, 5 clearances, 13 contested, 13 uncontested
22 disposals, 3 tackles, 5 rebounds, 5 clearances, 15 contested, 8 uncontested possessions
19 disposals, 1 goal, 2 marks, 9 tackles, 4 inside 50’s, 4 clearances, 8 contested, 11 uncontested

Taranto –
28 disposals, 7 marks, 5 tackles, 1 rebound, 11 inside 50’s, 7 clearances, 11 contested, 18 uncontested
17 disposals, 1 goal, 2 marks, 5 tackles, 3 rebounds, 3 inside 50’s, 2 clearances, 8 contested, 11 uncontested
26 disposals, 1 goal, 5 marks, 6 tackles, 7 rebounds, 5 inside 50’s, 8 clearances, 11 contested, 12 uncontested
30 disposals, 5 marks, 7 tackles, 3 rebounds, 4 inside 50’s, 5 clearances, 15 contested, 18 uncontested

Finals Series Averages -
Hopper – 24 disposals, 2 marks, 0.5 goals, 5 tackles, 2 rebound 50’s, 3 inside 50’s, 5 clearances, 14 contested, 11 uncontested
Taranto – 25 disposals, 4 marks, 0.5 goals, 6 tackles, 4 rebound 50’s, 6 inside 50’s, 6 clearances, 11 contested, 15 uncontested

Hopper went 56% contested possessions, 44% uncontested. He's a BULL!!
Taranto 42% contested, not too bad either.

All I can see is benefits of these two bulls in the team and players like Shai and Keyser Sonsie going another level up again next year with these two blokes alongside them.

I can see these two winning a contested ball and a clearance, Shai (and Dusty is likely to join the party as well) running alongside them and they give it off and they're drilling goals from 50 out!!