Trading Cousins? - Poll. | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Trading Cousins? - Poll.

Would you trade Cousins for a 2nd round draft pick?


  • Total voters
    303
  • Poll closed .
rosy23 said:
Got tickets on yourself or what Bob. As if I'd spend 2 hours reading your profile...I'm busy with btoz's. :rofl

::)

Amazing selective post then. Quite brilliant. I don't even remember posting that, maybe I have made an impression!

No tickets on myself, just had access to that amazing tool "Users Online". Let's you see where everyone is..... ;)

Alas, I cannot prove it so carry on with it anyway. ::)
 
btoz_01 said:
TOO I never said to bin this thread.
Im the one doing the % and page updates.
Its Cuz's 250th game this week. :clap :clap :clap :clap
Im hoping thisthread reaches 250 pages by Sunday. Just keep posting people
You can do it! ;)

Fair enough botox. ;D

BTW good luck to Benny for his 250th this weekend. 11 great games for the Tiges.
 
Tigers of Old said:
I've already answered that or don't you read? ;)

Brown has more currency for another club than what Cuz has.

Brown joined us because of our high-profile with the large crowds which would have been an exciting experience to play in the finals as is with the other big 3 teams. I reckon he has been laconic with us because he knew that we were a hopeless team and has just cruised along at our mediocre level, whereas, Cuz had no intention of finals (he's done it all at WC) and just joined us to play footy. He has mentioned that he enjoys teaching the kids (as they call him 'grandpa') and wants to help our club build to success. Given our lack of true leadership in many years, it's quite obvious that Cuz would be best to keep for a couple of years (even better if he retires and maybe becomes a skills coach).

In summary, Brown wants finals, whereas Cuz doesn't. So I think Brown would be a better offer to join a team bound for a possible flag.
 
what has Brown done in the past 2 years on field to indicate he has more currency that Cousins?
 
TigerForce said:
In summary, Brown wants finals, whereas Cuz doesn't.

Huh? Why doesn't he want finals. I would have thought every player would want to play finals footy.
 
rosy23 said:
I've seen enough misinterpreting others' words here to last a lifetime. If you show me the comments I'll see if I have an opinion. I don't know who or what you're referring to and I don't know the context so I don't feel able to answer your question sorry. Why do you ask me that when it's not a discussion I've been involved in anyway? If I had an opinion I wanted to share I probably would have responded when/if I read the comments.

Never mind Rosy. I thought if you were going to post throughout the thread and present a case you were a part of the overall discussion and following it. I'm not going to go through umpteen pages and find reference points to bring you up to speed if you are not. I was merely interested in your opinion, I don't want to have to work for it at this time of night. ;D

rosy23 said:
I have commented on past claims about Wallace coming to the club and I have commented on claims about Cousins legacy at the club in the future. I don't agree they're apples and oranges. They are both speculative in regard to what people think will happen rather than concrete evidence.

Disagree with you. It's easy to say you can't predict the future. I'm sure we are all aware of this. However, the difference between speculating on a coach who hasn't even arrived at the club yet, and the future influence of a player already at the club making an impact, is a very different kettle of fish. We have things we can quantify already that are real and in the past or present tense with Ben. Wallace hadn't even had his first encounter with a possum at time of the quotes you have referred to of others.

Go and talk to players and coaches and find out the affect Cousins has had on them and there training, preparation, match day approach etc. Then tell me if you seriously think they will not retain that just because he has left the club. In exceptional cases you get athletes who cannot learn from elite mentors, however they are few and uncommon compared to the multitude who do.

I don't understand how people think Cousins influence will be lost on the players magically once he is gone. It's like saying once your business mentor, friend or relative you learned a lot from ceases to have any influence on you after they die. I'm trying to understand the logic behind people questioning his future influence.

These players are talking work ethic, fitness and conditioning, recovery, preparation, onfield experience tips from Cousins. You don't loose that stuff within a year or two because the player is no longer at the club.

If Cousins gets to do his first full pre-season with the club now he is a true member of the team and the ice is broken so to speak, he will be imparting a wealth of influence into their training, preparation and work ethic. You don't loose that stuff, which is why you have leaders/mentors. To ensure environments conducive to fostering success now AND in the future, not just the present.

People like to go on about our poor drafting and trading, sure, but we have also been poor in leadership and development. Two things Cousins assists greatly with.
 
Freezer said:
Interesting to hear Ross Lyon say Leigh Montagna has been trying to model his game on Benny this year.


Sssh, don't start even hinting Cousins might be influencing or inspiring players outside the club, this thread will go on for 80 pages then dissecting the quality of influence he could have over players not even at the club training with him. :hihi
 
Tiger74 said:
what has Brown done in the past 2 years on field to indicate he has more currency that Cousins?

He's been laconic with us for the reason I mentioned but if we became a top side or if he joined a top side, I'm sure he'd go up a few notches. He doesn't look spent and still looks fit enough to play in attack.

rosy23 said:
Huh? Why doesn't he want finals. I would have thought every player would want to play finals footy.

What I meant is that it's not his first priority as it would be for Brown. Cuz is a workhorse and just loves playing footy and not high-profiling himself as Brown does.

These are just perceptions of mine. Cuz was lucky to join any club, so I don't think he'd refuse to play with us if he knew we weren't a club ready for the finals.
 
Tigerbob said:
::)

Amazing selective post then. Quite brilliant. I don't even remember posting that, maybe I have made an impression!

No tickets on myself, just had access to that amazing tool "Users Online". Let's you see where everyone is..... ;)

Alas, I cannot prove it so carry on with it anyway. ::)

Why the bitterness. As if anybody would believe I have a spare couple of hours to study your profile. What rubbish. I looked up the Wallace views of a few who've posted on this thread. I mentioned btozs as well but I don't see him having a :dummyspit Unreal.
 
Dyer Disciple said:
Never mind Rosy. I thought if you were going to post throughout the thread and present a case you were a part of the overall discussion and following it.

What case have I presented? I've questioned some comments but I don't have an opinion overall other than what I've already said that every player has a price and we'd be silly not to weigh up options for any of them.
 
Dyer Disciple said:
I don't understand how people think Cousins influence will be lost on the players magically once he is gone.

Has anyone claimed that would be the case?
 
Dyer Disciple said:
Go and talk to players and coaches and find out the affect Cousins has had on them and there training, preparation, match day approach etc. Then tell me if you seriously think they will not retain that just because he has left the club. In exceptional cases you get athletes who cannot learn from elite mentors, however they are few and uncommon compared to the multitude who do.

I don't understand how people think Cousins influence will be lost on the players magically once he is gone. It's like saying once your business mentor, friend or relative you learned a lot from ceases to have any influence on you after they die. I'm trying to understand the logic behind people questioning his future influence.

These players are talking work ethic, fitness and conditioning, recovery, preparation, onfield experience tips from Cousins. You don't loose that stuff within a year or two because the player is no longer at the club.

If Cousins gets to do his first full pre-season with the club now he is a true member of the team and the ice is broken so to speak, he will be imparting a wealth of influence into their training, preparation and work ethic. You don't loose that stuff, which is why you have leaders/mentors. To ensure environments conducive to fostering success now AND in the future, not just the present.

People like to go on about our poor drafting and trading, sure, but we have also been poor in leadership and development. Two things Cousins assists greatly with.

Pre-season will be good to see.

rosy23 said:
Has anyone claimed that would be the case?

Yes. Disco08 thought that.
 
TigerForce said:
He's been laconic with us for the reason I mentioned but if we became a top side or if he joined a top side, I'm sure he'd go up a few notches. He doesn't look spent and still looks fit enough to play in attack.

so Brown is worth more because he MIGHT deliver more in a better environment?

everyone has been saying we should keep Cousins because he is worth more than a speculative second round pick. Isn't Cousins worth more than speculation Nathan Brown MIGHT improve?

They are similar age, yet IMO Cousins is fitter, Cousins has better recent form, and Cousins is more skilled
 
rosy23 said:
What case have I presented? I've questioned some comments but I don't have an opinion overall other than what I've already said that every player has a price and we'd be silly not to weigh up options for any of them.

Sheesh even when I use your own terminology I run afoul of you. :p

rosy23 said:
Indeed. I rest my case in regard to people's claims about what his lasting legacy to the club will be. Any claims such as changing our culture etc are only hypothetical, as the Weagles situation you refer since Ben left shows. There is no FACT to them at all at this stage. It's something only time will tell.
 
Tiger74 said:
so Brown is worth more because he MIGHT deliver more in a better environment?

everyone has been saying we should keep Cousins because he is worth more than a speculative second round pick. Isn't Cousins worth more than speculation Nathan Brown MIGHT improve?

They are similar age, yet IMO Cousins is fitter, Cousins has better recent form, and Cousins is more skilled

I know what you mean T74, but as I mentioned in previous posts, if we balance Cuz and Brown, we have to assess who's more important for us not for the other team? Why give away a player who is better than the other option (Brown)??
 
TigerForce said:
I know what you mean T74, but as I mentioned in previous posts, if we balance Cuz and Brown, we have to assess who's more important for us not for the other team? Why give away a player who is better than the other option (Brown)??

that wasn't your point though - you said Brown had more currency

personally brown has more value for us to off-load, that is obvious (I for one would be delisting him, so anything gained in a trade is gravy)

I'm looking at this from a perspective of what would I pay for these players. Cuz I'm likely to get a year. I wouldn't pay 2nd (which is why I would take it if offered), but if he's fit I'll get something. Brown is getting injuries too, but is lacking pace when fit, and his old brilliance is fading. Its a gamble to think he'll get it back, so any pick I trade would be one my speculative picks. As such, very VERY late ND pick, or PSD. Still think he's shot though, so I wouldn't say yes if its my call.
 
Dyer Disciple said:
Sheesh even when I use your own terminology I run afoul of you. :p

Asking what case I presented doesn't equate to running afoul. It was a genuine question. ::)

Taking into consideration the question you asked about my opinion on what others have said I still don't know what you are referring to by me presenting a case. Considering your recent comments I don't really care so won't bother answering your question.
 
Tiger74 said:
that wasn't your point though - you said Brown had more currency

That's what the other club has to be 'brainwashed' in believing. Sales tactics. ;D

IMO, I don't think we will delist Brown so there's nothing to lose if we can offer a trade to sell him.

I just hope we go 'full bore' with trading this year considering we've been so weak. I know most on here reckon no club would want our duds, but at least give it a go.
 
TigerForce said:
That's what the other club has to be 'brainwashed' in believing. Sales tactics. ;D

IMO, I don't think we will delist Brown so there's nothing to lose if we can offer a trade to sell him.

I just hope we go 'full bore' with trading this year considering we've been so weak. I know most on here reckon no club would want our duds, but at least give it a go.

No argument with any of that expect you rating Brown to play on next year. He's shot IMO, and should be given the farewell at round 20 or 21