Trading Cousins? - Poll.

[agincourt]

For a lotto ticket

:clap :clap :clap :clap

Summed it up!

 

[Disco08]

Yes, the draft is like lotto. That's why clubs spend millions of dollars on recruiting. Honestly, if you think it's a lotto why would we use any picks at all. OK, maybe we could use our first rounder but everything else we'd be better off trading for known quantities, surely?

 

[TigerForce]

I think people need to lay off ToO.

I am definitely opposed to his view but I respect his angle and where it comes from.

He has a different view to some, that is all, no menace in what he puts forth.

I am adament that under no way do we trade Ben Cousins, I would not even contemplate it, but, I see where others are coming from in regards to it. A second round is nothing to sneeze at, it's just my opinion Ben Cousins brings so much more to our footy club.

Oldie's got his own opinion, like some others, about not wanting Cuz but from what a last pick is providing our kids at no cost is too hard to let go FOR NOW.

Everybody at the club speaks highly of him so why bother with an unknown kid now??

 

[meltiger]

I think people need to lay off ToO.

I am definitely opposed to his view but I respect his angle and where it comes from.

He has a different view to some, that is all, no menace in what he puts forth.

I am adament that under no way do we trade Ben Cousins, I would not even contemplate it, but, I see where others are coming from in regards to it. A second round is nothing to sneeze at, it's just my opinion Ben Cousins brings so much more to our footy club.

Good post. Agree 100%

 

[TigerForce]

How about in 6 years time when the 18 year old we could have picked at 25 turns out to be a 24 year old around the calibre of say, Sam Mitchell or Leigh Montagna?

I think IF is more appropriate than WHEN.

 

[Tigers of Old]

I think people need to lay off ToO.

Thanks for the support bobby but I'm a big boy.
Besides which no one's been ToO abusive. Opinions are just that, I'm not Craig Cameron.
At the very least this thread has got tongues wagging today. :hihi

Geez I have been one of Cousins must ardent admirers and supported him coming to the club from day dot but to knock back a second rounder for a 31 year old (hypothetically) is nonsense. The trade should be done in a heart beat.

I might not have had the good sense to take him in the PSD but I am glad you can see the sense in this if it was offered jack black.

 

[agincourt]

Yes, the draft is like lotto. That's why clubs spend millions of dollars on recruiting. Honestly, if you think it's a lotto why would we use any picks at all. OK, maybe we could use our first rounder but everything else we'd be better off trading for known quantities, surely?

They spend millions on recruiting in the belief that it improves their chances of winning the lotto!

Just as some people buy Pick 25's or whatever their called.

It's basically the same argument for getting an extra round 2 pick for Cuz. Yes there is a chance we might pick up a good young player, and yes there is a chance that he may be a complete dud, or injure himself, or flog himself off to the highest bidder after 2 good years, or be just average....or...or...

Judging by the results of this poll a CLEAR majority believe trading Cuz is not worth that chance.

 

[TigerForce]

There's more IFs on 2nd round pick than Cuz.

 

[Harry]

There's more IFs on 2nd round pick than Cuz.

5 years down the track there will be no ifs about cousins - he'll be gone. the pick 24 could well be hitting his straps and beginning to dominate the league.

If we were any chance of serious finals next year then you could mount an argument for not trading him. but seeing we need major reconstructive surgery you would be negligent in your duties if you didn't trade him away if the opportunity was there.

 

[kotzac]

cousins has cemented his spot. no trade no way.

 

[Chiang Mai Tiger]

Thanks for the support bobby but I'm a big boy.

No wonder considering all the Thai beer you sink

 

[Disco08]

I think IF is more appropriate than WHEN.

Of course it is. My post was in response to another hypothetical situation which I was trying to juxtapose with this one. The point is there really is no right or wrong here. If we could guarantee that the pick we get for Cuz would allow us to acquire a future 250 gamer then I think most would do the deal. By the same token if it was guaranteed that the pick would be wasted on a fringe player with no future then of course none of us would make the trade. The only real difference comes down to philosophy. Do you try and maximise your chances in the draft or do you hold onto a player because of the intangible benefits they provide. It's an interesting discussion if you try and see it from all angles.

They spend millions on recruiting in the belief that it improves their chances of winning the lotto!

Lotto is random. It's a completely non-sencical comparison to the draft. Can people give you a rough idea of which are the best 20 numbers every time a draw takes place?

 

[WesternTiger]

It can't have been that high if 1) it can be significantly lowered by two words and 2) you think I'd edit someone's posts because it hurt my argument on a footy forum. You made a little song and dance about me moving your article. Where I come from that's b!tching, but whatever.

Who said anything about it being "significantly" lowered?

And to accuse me of making a little "song and dance" when I started the post with a ha, ha. Gee will have to stick to the little yellow heads in future!

 

[TigerForce]

5 years down the track there will be no ifs about cousins - he'll be gone. the pick 24 could well be hitting his straps and beginning to dominate the league.

If we were any chance of serious finals next year then you could mount an argument for not trading him. but seeing we need major reconstructive surgery you would be negligent in your duties if you didn't trade him away if the opportunity was there.

What the hell has Cuz got to do with us playing finals next year? His main value is what he teaches our kids NOW whether he plays or not (injured).

Pick 24 could, could, could.........while heading in 2010 and 2011, our kids could 'develop' fast-tracked knowledge on skills and leadership from a premiership player.

We don't need Cuz for more than 2 years, so by 2012 our current crop of kids along with kids we draft in the next 2 years, would be enough to take us to finals.

 

[Disco08]

Who said anything about it being "significantly" lowered?

And to accuse me of making a little "song and dance" when I started the post with a ha, ha. Gee will have to stick to the little yellow heads in future!

I don't want to get into a thing here with you WT, quite happy to call it a misunderstanding and move on or carry on by PM.

 

[TigerForce]

Of course it is. My post was in response to another hypothetical situation which I was trying to juxtapose with this one. The point is there really is no right or wrong here. If we could guarantee that the pick we get for Cuz would allow us to acquire a future 250 gamer then I think most would do the deal. By the same token if it was guaranteed that the pick would be wasted on a fringe player with no future then of course none of us would make the trade. The only real difference comes down to philosophy. Do you try and maximise your chances in the draft or do you hold onto a player because of the intangible benefits they provide. It's an interesting discussion if you try and see it from all angles.

You say "IF we could guarantee"............if we could all predict that a 2nd round pick would play 250 games AND TAKE US TO FINALS, then he'd be worth the trade.

I can see what value Cuz is to us NOW, so I will not make a trade. As I posted earlier, if Cuz played like Brown does in a lazy type of way (even though we and most clubs know Brown's a top player) without showing true leadership and cohesion within the team, then I'd trade Cuz for sure. But as we have lacked true leadership and skill development for a long time, I'd keep Cuz for now because he and everyone else knows that he'll only be worth another 2 years at most.

Let's squeeze as much from him now, before taking a risk of an UNKNOWN possibility in the short run.

 

[Disco08]

Fine, so you're in the "keep him for his intangibles" camp. That's good as long as you recognise that by turning down a trade you also take take the risk of giving up a future star. As I said, there really is no right or wrong.

 

[Scoop]

This is interesting.

Those who want to trade Cousin's have in the majority been opposed to him coming in the first place. Those same people are also not fans of getting rid of glass half full types that we have so many of at Richmond.

Good thread. The odds of getting a second round pick fro Cousins are very slim in all honesty. I think we would have more like in moving along a McGuane/a Moore/a Jackson/a Foley/a Tuck/a Coughlan/a Graham for picks. If those that want to move Cousins along are truly all about getting better and exploring then maybe they would move some of those listed above.

 

[Tiger74]

For a lotto ticket

And would you bank on Cousin's hammy's remaining intact for the next 2 years? Thats a lottery in itself.

As for all that aggression being put towards those supporting this proposition, please remember:

1) This is NOT about whether you rate Cousins or not - in fact the reason it is a good topic is because everyone does rate him

2) This is about whether we will get more from Cousins for 1 year, possibly 2, as opposed to a 2nd round pick

Also I ask again to the pro-tankers disgusted at dumping Cousins because of his leadership qualities, how does forcing young players to tank for a 2nd round draft pick help the development?

 

[Disco08]

This is interesting.

Those who want to trade Cousin's have in the majority been opposed to him coming in the first place. Those same people are also not fans of getting rid of glass half full types that we have so many of at Richmond.

Good thread. The odds of getting a second round pick fro Cousins are very slim in all honesty. I think we would have more like in moving along a McGuane/a Moore/a Jackson/a Foley/a Tuck/a Coughlan/a Graham for picks. If those that want to move Cousins along are truly all about getting better and exploring then maybe they would move some of those listed above.

I'd trade most of those guys for a second rounder, and I was quite happy about getting Cousins. I reckon Harry would trade all of those blokes together for a second rounder.