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Steve Morris F/S
- Thread starter tigs2010
- Start date
tigertim said:
i think you're missing Chimps point. everyone would rather a forward who can kick goals. and we have a couple in the vfl who may be able to do that. but what Hardwick is possibly telling them is if you want to play AFL you need to play hard.
if they wont play hard they wont have an afl career, that will be the case whether they get a few games now or not. but if they learn their lesson we will have well rounded players on our list, players with skill and flair, who will also tackle and harass. i think most should agree that will improve our side in the long run.
Brodders17 said:
Seems that way ie Dimma wants to have the small forward role play "hard". But again, I say this should only be one aspect of playing the game. If the role has to be be play "hard", fine, great. But I'd say "play hard...but also get the ball, maybe kick a few goals". The "pro" view on Morris is so one-dimensional, I find it odd.
IF Morris was a defender I MAY be able to cop this but as an OFFENSIVE player this is farcical.
Certainly a huge part of Stevie's role is the harrassing defender, trying to lock the ball into the forward line or cause poor opposition ball use on exit allowing us to get repeat contests in our forward half.TJsFurrow said:
It's also not just about physical hardness at the contest or opponent it's about repeat efforts n work rate around the contest.
Over recent years we've often had sides streaming out of our forward half for coast to coast goals n unopposed creative run out of our forward line. Stevie sets an example of work integrity for all around our forward half, especially our youngsters.
We're not going to be perfect all the time, but in recent weeks there has been a marked improvement in defensive n structural ( with out the ball ) work rate all over the ground. We're making it much harder for sides to get quick cheap repeat goals.
Yes, I'd also like Stevie to get his hands on the pill a bit more n kick or set up the odd sausage, he got one against the druggies n missed two shots against Port so he's almost getting there, but his most important priority is the work ethic n intensity he's bringing into the team structure.
So he couldnt cut it as a defender so we put him forward but he's still a defender? Again, seems odd. I appreciate these days there's a role for a defending forward but again, to have this player do so little of anything ( other than, what, chase tail all day?) just seems bizarre.TJsFurrow said:
So can anyone tell me which RFC players that aren't harrassing, tackling and chasing and by what quantifiable outputs?
Because by all available "second tier" stats like tackles (3), score assists (0), pressure acts (10), score involvements (2) metres gained (55) he aint setting the world on fire.
Because by all available "second tier" stats like tackles (3), score assists (0), pressure acts (10), score involvements (2) metres gained (55) he aint setting the world on fire.
tigertim said:
Those stats don't really capture what Morris brings to the team. It's one of those qualitative things that is difficult to quantify.
I'm on the fence. Said it before and I'll say it again, it's pointless saying 'why don't we bring in such and such he'll get more kicks?', what Morris brings is suicidal chaos. That can't be denied, some try, but you're deluding yourselves. You can't just say to a replacement , 'OK, we want suicidal chaos'. It doesn't work like that.
Dimma wants suicidal chaos in the forward line, and Morris is giving it to him. Its an experiment. Mixed results so far, I'm not completely convinced but we're winning. Some of the furious indignation on here its as if some people take Morris being in the side as a personal slight.
Dimma wants suicidal chaos in the forward line, and Morris is giving it to him. Its an experiment. Mixed results so far, I'm not completely convinced but we're winning. Some of the furious indignation on here its as if some people take Morris being in the side as a personal slight.
tigersnake said:
Furious indignation because Morris is probably one of the worst players in the AFL right now getting a regular gig. We're forced to carry him offensively every week and play a man down in the forward line because of Dimma's love in the face of cold stark reality that he's barely SANFL standard. Thank god for our backline carrying us! Even Jack said as much post game. Playing a guy just because he runs around like a mad man defensively and flails his arms a lot but nothing else? Is this 2009? Are we in the start of a rebuild or something that we have to play someone so limited overall?
ps as pointed out his one positive was average on the weekend. Half the team had more pressure acts. 3 tackles a game for a guy who's one role is to apply pressure is average too.
Poor argument to say Steve Morris is "average" at applying pressure. He's blatantly elite.
It's like saying Lids is an average kick because he was credited with only 8 kicks one week, which is about average.
It's like saying Lids is an average kick because he was credited with only 8 kicks one week, which is about average.
Barnzy said:
You can argue he deosn't get enough kicks. You can argue he isn't much good. No worries there. But all the stats in the world won't deny what he does do, suicidal chaos. You're pushing *smile* uphill if you try to deny that. You may not like the suicidal chaos, but you can't deny he brings it. Dimma wants him to bring that, he brings it. Dimma is the coach. The side is winning.
Jason King said:
Some good posts already explaining the benchmark for intensity he brings. Another factor is the brown pants factor. He is making defenders worry about what will happen to them. Before they gather the ball and while they have it.
The mental pressure and fear make them less effective.
A few posters have mentioned how easy sides would role out of our fwd 50 in the past. Morris has been a big factor in why we have been able to address this.
look Im not sold on this experiment either, but I think people need to look at his role and what he is there for rather than judge him as a small fwd. People say Harwick is a coach with no original thoughts. This is one. Not sure steve is the answer to his idea, but steve is giving it everything he has, he is manic.
But agree that it would be nice to find a player who could offer more on the other side of the coin. YArran when playing at his best offers the manic attack on the defender and sublime offensive skills. In my interpretation of what Dima is thinking he would be the ideal player for it. Although probably to much of an asset to sacrifice for this type of role.
I don't think he even does that. Modern footballers by and large aren't worried about getting hurt, it's part of the game and it comes with the territory. What they don't like is being made look second rate and getting scored on. We've got a bloke in the side who does that an elite level, and it ain't Steve Morris. It's Shane Edwards, he's the X factor that terrorises opposition defences, not Steven 'the headless chook' Morris. Every time we go in with Morris we're effectively going in a player short.ninjahaha said:
tigersnake said:
If a player offers nothing offensively and as I pointed out earlier purposely doesn't try to offer much because he knows he can't (his little leads inside 50 only serve the purpose to drag away a man. There's no intent to get the ball there if you watch closely). Isn't it logical he would have more energy and enthusiasm towards running around and applying more defensively than your average small forward who has to do both roles by kicking goals and pressure/tackling?
So Dimma wants a player in a forward line who can't kick goals but to just run around and try to chase the opposition while playing a 5 man forward line effectively with 6 players. It's a poor game plan if you ask me. A negative mindset, nothing puts more pressure on opposition than goals. I've never seen this trialed before by any coach in my time watching football. Defensive forwards still contribute offensively, Morris doesn't. So Dimma will either be proved to be one of the smartest coaches in recent memory or one of the dumbest coaches. I know where my money is going.
