Mark Harvey Sacked- Official

[Tigerbob]

I have no axe to gring regarding Lyon, he is merely a product of the AFL system & culture.

I do bear some concer regarding the Fremantle Football Club's financial offer to Lyon.
1. How financially stable is Freo?
2. Can it afford to pay Lyon what it is offering?
3. Does the AFL provide extraordinary support to Freo, as it does to at least 10 AFL clubs including the RFC?
4. If so, how can it justify the size of the offer to Lyon?
5. If the AFL is a custodian of the competition, how can it let Freo make such an offer?

There may be good answers to these but the questions are still worth asking.

May be evidence again of the AFL manipulating (fixing) the greater outcomes of the competition.

Freo have more money tahn most.

Sponsored by Pollywoodside, the massive mining company, and also have a board member who is the CEO of Westfarmers.

They have a huge amount of financial clout.

Heard Ross has received more than is being reported on too. Lot's of benefits, too hard to turn down.

 

[bullus_hit]

You guys damning Lyon should read Rohan COnnolly's piece today in the Age.

Also worth checking out Jake Niall's article on the imminent collapse of St Kilda both financially and onfield. As a gameday coach, I think Lyon is respectable if not overly defensive and did well to remain in premiership contention over a long period. However (and it's a big however) he and the recruiting team have quite literally gone for broke in the quest for a premiership and have almost guaranteed the club will struggle over the next decade. Sounds dire but that's the reality when you have half a dozen champions on the brink of retirement and very little in the way of fresh talent coming through the ranks. Dal Santo, Fisher, Montagna, Riewoldt, Milne and Kositchke will all be on the wrong side of 28 next year and even the 26 year old Brendan Goddard is no certainty to be around when free agency comes into play.

Part of being a strong coach is allowing for generational change, Geelong have shown great expertise in identifying young talent and nurturing them through the sytem, St Kilda on the other hand have recruited woefully over the past 5 years and have adopted a very flawed model of topping up on retreads. Now with another compromised draft they stand very little chance of making substantial inroads in a long overdue list rebuild. What makes the situation worse is their financial situation is perilous and a prolonged period in the cellar could be devastating. It would certainly be drawing a long bow to blame everything on Ross Lyon but he has to bear some responsibility for the current predicament.

 

[Lennox Street]

Freo have more money tahn most.

3rd on the revenue ladder last year and with no debt to serve. $34.6m in club-sourced revenue last year. St Kilda $29.8m. Richmond 14th.

 

[Phar Ace]

The more I have thought about it the more I actually respect Lyon for his decision. Took 7 months for the Aints to give him a resonable offer. The performance by the Aints and the off field stuff this years was more so related to the clubs culture and the players attitudes however Ross was the one who was going to get it in the neck. Good on him for jumping ship. The way Harvey was treated...well thats another story.

Whilst I generally agree with what you are saying, not sure I'm that tough on StKilda either in regards their delay. Let's not forget some of the disasters that beset them, non more so than a shocking start to the season on-field. I think StKilda were probably right to delay but simply didn't move decisive enough - it's not like there wasn't a coaching whirlwind building with Bailey on shakey ground for over a season, Eade no sure thing and Craig probably the least obvious.

Right to delay, just did it too long.

 

[Tigerbob]

Right to delay, just did it too long.

So in affect they were still wrong? ;D

 

[Phar Ace]

So in affect they were still wrong? ;D

There is a difference between slow and wrong, whatever it affects. Would you have re-signed him in the depths of being bottom 4 on the ladder and staring at a disasterous season?

In any event, this will probably be a win / win episode, subject to who they pick up. As Stu Loewe says, it's about the right time anyway.

 

[Tigerbob]

There is a difference between slow and wrong, whatever it affects. Would you have re-signed him in the depths of being bottom 4 on the ladder and staring at a disasterous season?

I would have made a decision prior to the close of the season as all clubs do. Not wait for the end of the season to offer a contract.

Also, the contract he had to allow him to walk with a season remaining? Mind boggling?

Ross Lyon has proved that you can go someway to polishing a *smile* :hihi and the Saint's neglected him.

Now they are back peddling. Will be interesting who they get. Scott Waters the rumours.

 

[Phar Ace]

I would have made a decision prior to the close of the season as all clubs do. Not wait for the end of the season to offer a contract.

At what juncture is that though - pick a round - any round?

Also, the contract he had to allow him to walk with a season remaining? Mind boggling?

Not overly - ever tried to have a coach coach when he doesn't want to be there - probably a benign looking trade off for something that was critical at the time of negotiation. Everything is capable of looking vastly different with more information.

Ross Lyon has proved that you can go someway to polishing a *smile* :hihi and the Saint's neglected him.

Now they are back peddling. Will be interesting who they get. Scott Waters the rumours.

Time and the next coach will go someway to determining whether Lyon was a genius or a nicely polished *smile* ;D

Watters - another Malthouse protege, he's building quite the dynasty isn't he.............

 

[Tigerbob]

At what juncture is that though - pick a round - any round?



Time and the next coach will go someway to determining whether Lyon was a genius or a nicely polished *smile* ;D

Watters - another Malthouse protege, he's building quite the dynasty isn't he.............

Say around the midway point of the season. Your either gonna go with him, or go in a new direction. They didn't decide either, forced to go in a new direction. Round 15 if you want a number.

Mick is building a lot of these guys up, let's see if any of them can actually coach. Waters has a sizeable rep on him though.

 

[GoodOne]

Right to delay, just did it too long.

If there was a get out clause in Lyon's contract and the club was adamant they wanted to keep him, why would you wait and open up an opportunity to lose him? There was plenty going on around other clubs sacking coaches, I would have thought you'd try and shore up a new contract as soon as possible. Saints management plain and simply stuffed up (assuming they wanted 100% Lyon to stay).

 

[Punxsutawney Phil]

I wonder whether Mark Harvey will find himself back at Essendon with his old teammates Hird and Thompson now that MacCartney has left?

 

[GoodOne]

I wonder whether Mark Harvey will find himself back at Essendon with his old teammates Hird and Thompson now that MacCartney has left?

Why not, the more the merrier.

 

[brigadiertiger]

People keep saying that St. Kilda waited to long to give Lyon a contract extension. Why should they have he still had a year to go on his current contract.

When Lyon asked for the extension back in April St. Kilda were not travelling all that well at the end of April they were 15th having only beaten Brisbane and drawn with us. If we were in that position would we be happy if the club gave the coach an extension based on that. Craig Kelly during half time on Friday said that towards the end of the season it was Lyon and his management that asked for talks to be put on hold.

A When Lyon asked early in the season he probably didn't deserve the extension that he wanted by the end of the season he did and was offered it but he cracked them and then knowing full well that Harvey was contracted for another season he stuck a knife right into Harverys back. I think karma will smack Lyon about a bit and he will deserve it.

 

[GoodOne]

People keep saying that St. Kilda waited to long to give Lyon a contract extension. Why should they have he still had a year to go on his current contract.

Umm, to keep him? There was a get out clause. And competitors were circling. If you had your mind set on a coach for the next few years surely you'd shore them up at the earliest possible chance and prevent any possibility of any other option. You make your own destiny.

 

[SAF]

I wonder whether Mark Harvey will find himself back at Essendon with his old teammates Hird and Thompson now that MacCartney has left?

As long as he doesn't come to Punt Rd.

 

[brigadiertiger]

Umm, to keep him? There was a get out clause. And competitors were circling. If you had your mind set on a coach for the next few years surely you'd shore them up at the earliest possible chance and prevent any possibility of any other option. You make your own destiny.

Still didn't deserve what he was asking for in April and when they felt that he did they offered it.

 

[KnightersRevenge]

People keep saying that St. Kilda waited to long to give Lyon a contract extension. Why should they have he still had a year to go on his current contract.

When Lyon asked for the extension back in April St. Kilda were not travelling all that well at the end of April they were 15th having only beaten Brisbane and drawn with us. If we were in that position would we be happy if the club gave the coach an extension based on that. Craig Kelly during half time on Friday said that towards the end of the season it was Lyon and his management that asked for talks to be put on hold.

A When Lyon asked early in the season he probably didn't deserve the extension that he wanted by the end of the season he did and was offered it but he cracked them and then knowing full well that Harvey was contracted for another season he stuck a knife right into Harverys back. I think karma will smack Lyon about a bit and he will deserve it.

I can't help but feel a little guilty pleasure at the way Kelly et al were blindsided by this deal. I am over the spin and disingenuos way managers speak about players in their own stable, though it is probably Pickering who really gets my goat (to the gramarians out there I've checked and this seems to be the proper usage, not goad). Either way Lyon probably got a better deal by being under-handed even though this came at the expense of Harvey.

 

[GoodOne]

Still didn't deserve what he was asking for in April and when they felt that he did they offered it.

So why complain when they lost out? It was their decision to wait another 5+ months to come to the party. Indecision is bad management. Saints only have themselves to blame.

 

[cmarkidis]

So why complain when they lost out? It was their decision to wait another 5+ months to come to the party. Indecision is bad management. Saints only have themselves to blame.

I know it's a professional caper, but coaches need to show loyalty to the club and players. Wallace, Thompson, not really men of great integrity. Lyon is in danger of being cast in the same mould. I wouldn't want Hardwick to walk. Somehow I think our bloke is made of the right stuff.

 

[TigerForce]

I know it's a professional caper, but coaches need to show loyalty to the club and players. Wallace, Thompson, not really men of great integrity. Lyon is in danger of being cast in the same mould. I wouldn't want Hardwick to walk. Somehow I think our bloke is made of the right stuff.

No ego in Dimma.