Can Yze Coach?

[Tigerwa]

Jury out for me.
I think he has come in not wanting to rock the boat.
Next year it has to be all him and stamp himself ON THE TEAM and what he wants and how we play on the team.
The feel is he is following instructions almost.
Hard to see a clear blueprint of what he wants not made easy by a lot of injuries.
My biggest worry we fail to embrace a rebuild and we get lost in the wilderness again.

 

[Coburgtiger]

I hear you, but your point means I probably didn't explain well enough. I see it more that with confidence in where our teammates are and making slightly better choices we probably execute 60%+. At that level we stop the turnover goals against ourselves and get 6 additional inside 50's where we have players clear out the back.

The one's I can recall, Kamdyn kicks to Seth on the wing but it's a loopy kick and the blues player gets across and spoils OOB. (Note: The training drills are focused on flat hard kicks and Kamdyn got called out at training for loopy kicks.) Had that kick got to Seth, Noah was out the back and clear of Weitering. Another one we worked the ball well off halfback, kick over the top (Hugo I think), He has an inside option and outside option but on the inside there are two blues defenders squeezing up. He either had to out side and around the blues or feign going outside to draw the defender wide and then go inside. He went inside without feigning and the two blues collapsed in and we had a stoppage (I think it was Taranto that got caught). Those are decision making/execution errors that can be fixed. Three or four other such surges were similar. It's just a little more confidence, understanding between teammates and the execution pays off.

If anything I see it more aligned to 2017 and just needing the players to "trust" and execute, so yes some additional talent but it as much workrate and effort which we have seen appears better at the VFL level so it is doable with many of the current list imho.

Speed/endurance and two way running are needed along with ability to execute to some acceptable level.

I hear what you're saying, and you may be right.

To me, however, it sounds like a game plan requiring a high degree of technical proficiency under pressure, which, when executed poorly, creates extreme vulnerability.

Perhaps if it becomes second nature with quality footballers, the reward for the risk is there.

But it's similar to how Geelong always came unstuck against us in finals.

I'm also not suggesting a reversion to an outdated game plan.

Just that the current one might be too ambitious. We've been training it for 7 or 8 months, and look like a rabble. There is time. I'm sceptical.

 

[Tigers2011]

Hard not to be concerned. I’ve been to all but a couple of interstate matches and aside from trying to win centre clearance and kicking long to take territory & force contests, I’ve no idea what the actual game plan is. We’ve certainly lost the ballistic, take the game on style from 2017-2020. Even 2022.

The lack lustre effort in the biggest of club days to celebrate Dusty’s 300th was unforgivable. Surely the coaching staff had to get the team up for that match.

Perplexing selections (especially with younger players as subs); no plan B in game; inconsistent effort & intensity; single way of kicking in from behinds (rinse, repeat, turnover, opposition goal) & glacier ball movement & it’s a mess.

Not convinced injuries are solely to blame with the type of football being played. Anyway jury out for me, but 2 wins and a % of 60 isn’t acceptable.

 

[Tigers2011]

Huge off season awaits

 

[Stig]

You need to stop posting and proving to everybody that you know nothing about football.

Do you really think a team that has played almost every player on the senior list and has had zero continuity is going to master a brand new gameplan?

BTW genius, I'm still awaiting your response to my question. But I know you won't reply because you know NOTHING about football.

What’s the question and I will answer it for you
you are right . I know nothing

 

[Stig]

Generally takes half a year to implement a game plan. This has been wrecked by injuries. For gods sake we have used over 40 players already for the year.

Who knows whether he can coach but until he gets a decent run with some players you cant really tell

Give you a tip
The 40 players all train together
Rubbish excuse

 

[Stig]

I was tempted to start a new thread called the "Rational Discussion Thread" but figured I'd post in here.

The last goal we kicked, by Rhyan, was our gameplan on full display. Yes it was late in the game and yes Carlton may have eased off but that was our "EKP" and "Control and Surge" drills on full display. My recollection is that it Miller, Brown, Banks, Rioli, Kosi and Nigel all involved. I stand to be corrected on who the actual players were and if I can bother/bear to watch a replay I'll call out who was involved in the chain.

From where I sat I could see us try that same approach about 10 times in the game. I reckon we executed it about twice, once for Rhyan's goal and once earlier in the game. We turned it over with poor kicks and smothered/blocked handballs at least 5 or 6 times and a couple of times ran into stoppages. So the plan is there the execution under gameday/pressure is not. Sadly a couple of times the pressure was self inflicted (i.e. we handpassed into a poor position) or rushed disposal when the pressure was not there. That's learning and poise that needs to be gained by experience (hopefully).

So if, and it's a big if but it is where we need to develop, we can execute more than 50% of those chains/surges we go from conceding 10 goals on turnover to far closer to the league average of 3 to 4 and we increase our scoring by 2 or 3 goals. That in yesterday's game reduces the Blues to somewhere in to 90's for points scored and get's us up into the 80's.

That to me is a combination of confidence, belief and trust in your teammates that is not quite there on gameday. Something I can understand when there is very limited consistency with the same playing group.

Give you a tip
We are the only team this year not to kick 100 points or more
Gameplan is terrible ( if there is one )
We fail miserably to maintain ball inside F50 and we simply don’t press high enough
Then when opposition win ball back
Onballers especially don’t fold back quick enough to support the defenders
Simply not good enough
Dow huge culprit thus got dropped last week and should play VFL for remainder of year

 

[Ghost of Punt Road]

I am starting to hope that Yze is following a tanking plan. Not what I want as such, but it would explain how little the team is performing.

It isn't a team of rookies. There are enough good players that a team with a good system would be doing better than this.

 

[wigglyworm]

Give you a tip
The 40 players all train together
Rubbish excuse

I suspect the guys with ACL's Hammies, Calf Strains probably dont do as much training as the rest

 

[Stig]

I suspect the guys with ACL's Hammies, Calf Strains probably dont do as much training as the rest

Well they have exposure to the game plan and the 3 team meetings they have during the week
If they don’t understand they shouldn’t be playing Elite Football
Where are the camels by the way

 

[daniel30]

He may be a good gameplan tactician with footy intelligence but if he doesn't establish certain standards and non negotiable quickly such as commitment to a contest and defensive efforts, he won't last long as senior coach.

Nothing to do with coaches sorry to breake news. Effort, pressure and intensity on players that's not negotiable on there behalf in any level of footy.

 

[French Tiger]

Nothing to do with coaches sorry to breake news. Effort, pressure and intensity on players that's not negotiable on there behalf in any level of footy.

That's the problem with modern footy. You can't drag someone who is not performing like you used to be able. It was embarrassing if you ever got dragged. Now they all come off.

If someone gives away a stupid 50 & gives away a goal, off you come son.

 

[daniel30]

I'll say again point the finger at Yze etc on certain areas and Meehan etc. The biggest picture is who is running the footy department Livingstone and Blair under Gale. Last 2 seasons they have not read the writing on the wall , poor management and standards and poor appointments. We're is there accountability.

Very simple beefup the footy department get the best around Yze. For me super important.

 

[Cooper O'Reilly]

I'll say again point the finger at Yze etc on certain areas and Meehan etc. The biggest picture is who is running the footy department Livingstone and Blair under Gale. Last 2 seasons they have not read the writing on the wall , poor management and standards and poor appointments. We're is there accountability.

Very simple beefup the footy department get the best around Yze. For me super important.

Let’s not forget that Newman and possibly Ziebell are the only assistants that Yze had any say in appointing.

I’d like to think that Yze would have a huge say in who his assistants are as the current crop’s contracts expire. Building a team of coaches that you want and trust should be a non negotiable for any senior coach.

 

[Carter]

If a game plan requires a team of 1st round draft picks to function, then it isn't much of a game plan.

What?

This notion is really dumb.

If Yze needs a Clayton Oliver from the national draft to help drive a midfield to win territory more often than not then that’s perfectly reasonable.

The reality is all flag-winning teams have stars on every line. Yze has been saddled with a bunch of kids and has-beens.

You put far too much faith in our list and far too little in our head coach, who survived a rigorous selection process for a reason. He is renowned to be one of the most gifted tacticians in the game and there is no valid reason to doubt this.

Conversely, our list is in terrible shape and there is no valid reason to doubt this either.

So what if Yze needs good players? Shock horror.

This isn’t under 10s footy where an under-skilled team gets to dump it long to contests.

If Yze is demanding skill and precision then he should get a fair crack at turning over the *smile* list until he gets it.

 

[Coburgtiger]

What?

This notion is really dumb.

If Yze needs a Clayton Oliver from the national draft to help drive a midfield to win territory more often than not then that’s perfectly reasonable.

The reality is all flag-winning teams have stars on every line. Yze has been saddled with a bunch of kids and has-beens.

You put far too much faith in our list and far too little in our head coach, who survived a rigorous selection process for a reason. He is renowned to be one of the most gifted tacticians in the game and there is no valid reason to doubt this.

Conversely, our list is in terrible shape and there is no valid reason to doubt this either.

So what if Yze needs good players? Shock horror.

This isn’t under 10s footy where an under-skilled team gets to dump it long to contests.

If Yze is demanding skill and precision then he should get a fair crack at turning over the *smile* list until he gets it.

I didn't say he doesn't need stars to win a flag.

I said it shouldn't need a bunch of first rounders just to function.

There's a difference.

 

[Carter]

I didn't say he doesn't need stars to win a flag.

I said it shouldn't need a bunch of first rounders just to function.

There's a difference.

Hardwick and his brains trust found a way to immunise mistakes on the footy field.

It was a miracle, a revolution in footy tactics.

That won’t happen again. Yze is a different beast altogether and clearly, *clearly* requires different skill sets to what he was saddled with.

Our next flag will be driven by more technical virtues.

So what if he demands a certain level this squad can learn but cannot yet execute? It sets an ongoing standard and is good for the club despite all the hand-wringing on here.

We learn who is good enough whilst also cruising to the high end of the draft. Win-win.

Unless, of course, you are a tribal supporter who instinctively demands blood whenever the losses start to mount.

I’d suggest we all give Yze time, but thankfully the club will rightly ignore us and remain focused on the long term like any elite club should.

 

[Coburgtiger]

Hardwick and his brains trust found a way to immunise mistakes on the footy field.

It was a miracle, a revolution in footy tactics.

That won’t happen again. Yze is a different beast altogether and clearly, *clearly* requires different skill sets to what he was saddled with.

Our next flag will be driven by more technical virtues.

So what if he demands a certain level this squad can learn but cannot yet execute? It sets an ongoing standard and is good for the club despite all the hand-wringing on here.

We learn who is good enough whilst also cruising to the high end of the draft. Win-win.

Unless, of course, you are a tribal supporter who instinctively demands blood whenever the losses start to mount.

I’d suggest we all give Yze time, but thankfully the club will rightly ignore us and remain focused on the long term like any elite club would.

Who is demanding blood?

I haven't heard any 'Sack the coach' calls.

We have won 2 games and have a percentage of 60.

We have had more completely uncompetitive quarters and games than we have in any season for 10 years.

Calling an unproven coach in charge of this a brilliant tactician, and tracking along nicely just seems like blind faith.

Which is also fine.

He has time. He has given us very little yet. No one's really expecting to see anything for the rest of the year, so it's a free hit.

But we need to improve next year. At best, finishing bottom nets you one more elite player each year, if you get lucky and draft well. That can't be the ongoing plan.

 

[TigerForce]

I am starting to hope that Yze is following a tanking plan. Not what I want as such, but it would explain how little the team is performing.

It isn't a team of rookies. There are enough good players that a team with a good system would be doing better than this.

He is. Read between the lines on what he's said in some pressers and especially last week (where he somehow let it slip a bit) on SEN on Lyon's and Watson's show. Needs to balance it out in case the media picks it up.

 

[RoarEmotion]

So what if he demands a certain level this squad can learn but cannot yet execute? It sets an ongoing standard and is good for the club despite all the hand-wringing on here.

Love this.

Do you adjust the plan to meet the standard or play the long game and keep the standard.

We bemoan our skill off half back and turnovers and loopy kicks that get picked off. Seeing that your skill isn’t good enough provides massive feedback you neee to improve that skill or your spot is in jeopardy in the medium turn.

The training reports seem to back up that this is the standard being expected.

I get both arguments but you need to take a view on what will stand up under finals pressure and go for that view.

Short term we have some senior players not pulling their weight for form/injury/mental application which is a separate issue. Ones like broad, mcintosh and Tarranto aren’t in this camp.