One habit Browne must get rid of is always looking to dish off the handball immediately after gaining possession of the ball. This style of play worked in the 70's & 80's but in this day & age ruckmen must be more unpredictable.
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Andrew Browne
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Leysy Days said:
Agree, but think if Graham dished up Browne's last few games he would have been more roundly criticised than Browne has been. They both need another 40-50 games, one of them will likely not get that opportunity. Gus is a better bet right now, he has played much better football at times than Browne. Offers much more around the ground. Both are long-term projects, although how much can their marking develop because this is Browne's biggest weakness.
bullus_hit said:
Do you really think because he is big he is strong. They dont go hand in hand. Browne has eons of development to go physically. Is miles away from where he will be in 4 to 5 years.
As for ruckman needing to have mobility. Look at guys like Jolly, Mumford & Sandi. All are among the better rucks in the league. All lack pace big time. But all crack in hard & are extremely strong over the ball & contest very strongly in the air. They are far more crucial aspects that a ruckman needs.
Big Cat Lover said:
Gus is over 3 years older than Browne though Big Cat. He shouldn't be having the same or similar level of impact as Gus.
If the ranga was performing at Gus' level when he gets to that age leysy'd suggest he's not up to it. Facts are though he is just a kid in ruck terms.
Guys like Cox, Sandilands, Jamar & Jolly weren't worth two bob at Browne's age. None could get a game at AFL level. None were holding overhead marks & none impacted AFL games for a few years or in most cases until there mid 20's.
None of this is to say Browne will make it, he may or may not. But from where he was at when we drafted him he's tracking exactly as he should be.
We just need someone to some in above him so he can develop at the correct rate.
I cant believe Browne is copping slack around here. What is supposed to do? dominate ? Did our top ten pick Vickery ? Hell no and he still cant dominate any part of the ruck game.
This is what we get for overlooking our list needs for so many years. Then when blokes like McKernan, Jacobs and Griffen were available we didnt chase hard enough.
This is what we get for overlooking our list needs for so many years. Then when blokes like McKernan, Jacobs and Griffen were available we didnt chase hard enough.
Leysy Days said:
I reckon Jolly and Mumford are a lot more mobile than Browne will ever be, at times Browne appears like he has concrete in his boots. I really hope I'm wrong on this but I just get the feeling Browne doesn't have enough strings to his bow, in saying that I would be delisting Graham first and foremost and replacing him with a recycled ruckman. Browne does deserve the benefit of the doubt and another couple of seasons should be enough time to see if he's got the talent.
Leysy Days said:
Gus has about 60 more hit outs with 2 more games played than Browne. I don't have access to stats for hit outs to advantage where I was looking (footywire) unfortunately but it would be very interesting to evaluate that too.
Can't agree with this on any level. And was one of those defending Gus early. Browne is big and slow and predictabe. No surprises there. But he gives his everything at the contest. His hand-written, individually signed and personally delivered telegraphs that he is about to handball are a problem, but it can be solved. Gus just wasn't impacting at all. Browne has at least held his own, at his level, in his ruck duels. Gus was getting owned often with single figure hit-outs. Browne isn't. (Cruezer is a freak and he'd be our freak if Carlton had wanted the best mid in the draft instead of a ruckman.) Gus can't take a contested mark and doesn't have the aerobic capacity at the moment to run with Cruezer either so its a zero sum gain surely.Baloo said:
We'd all love to have an old and wise body out there to help them both but we don't so for now Hardwick is playing the bloke that competes the hardest. Gus can have his spot back if he is prepared to use his size a bit more brutally it seems to me.
bullus_hit said:
Mumford (and probably Sandilands too) was at least as cumbersome as Browne looks now. Mummy probably also weighed more at the same age. The strings to the bow was the same early knock on Sandilands - still really happy for Browne to have another three years yet. He was passable against Brisbane, wore the Berger down.
Generally speaking Browne has but one pace and he sustains it right through the game. With each pre-season he'll raise the pace at which he operates and sustain it just as well. Is OK below the knees, has to keep his handballs up and follow through with his whole body to protect his team mate some more - it's coming - just won't be 2011
Baloo said:
Not forgetting them, I was genuinely on board and hoping for the best, I certainly haven't written him off. I'm an eternal optimist. How could I not be? But Browne has shown more, if slower, vigour and a willingness to expend himself and to try to affect the contest that was lacking in Gus's game when he was dropped. He can certainly get it back he is young and fit. He just has to want it badly enough. As do plenty from the last few games....
Baloo said:
Leysy's said he's happy for Browne to go back & have a spell for a while.
We know Gus isnt the answer but hopefully he at least goes harder at the contest if he returns.
Leysy Days said:
I'm not sure Gus isn't the answer I'm just not sure he understood the question.
Smoking Aces said:
Interesting where we go from here.
Leysy would be open to most suggestions.
Of our current stocks leysy would delist Graham & keep Browne developing. Derickx would be line ball for another year depending on how he comes back from his injury.
The one thing leysy wouldnt do is trade away a 1st rd pick for someone who wouldnt be here for the a 6-7 year period. i.e McIntosh.
We need that pick to add another long termer to the list. Now if it is a ruckman that is young enough that would be OK. i.e Mitch Clark. Otherwise we are better off adding a talented young midfielder & chasing a top line ruck hard once free agency comes in.
If we cant get that long termer via trade we do need to get an older ruckman in though to give us some relief, whether that be a Seaby, Griffin, Hille type. But needs to be on the cheap. i.e pick in the 3rd rd or later so that we dont jeopardize getting a talented long termer through the doors.
Phar Ace said:
Very true, in fact I recall he had to shed 20 kg in order to reach the desired playing weight. Browne deserves more time, I just hope the athleticism comes with the experience.
