2024 Draft Thread

[TT33]

there's quite a few misconceptions about Jagga Smith being propagated in here.

he's the best player in a very deep pool of talent. He is the u18 AA captain.

he isn't slow, he isn't soft, he isn't outside, he rarely turns the ball over, he doesn't get injured, his kicks go 40m to his teammates advantage, he rarely hacks a kick in hope, he finds space and delivers the ball, he kicks goals from 50m, he is a prolific ball winner, he plays selflessly and creatively, he is professional, he is driven, he is a leader.

testing will show him athletically elite

interviews will suggest a champion and a captain.

there is almost zero chance he wont be a great player at AFL level for a long time.

I really dont get it?

I totally get the variation in peoples preferences; that many would prefer FOS, Lalor or Draper. They are indeed four quite different players. I do completely understand why anyone would rank those three higher than Jagga (Ashcroft and Lombard too). I get that, although its highly unlikely, Jagga Smith could last until pick 6

but I totally dont get the disparity between what people write about Jagga, and the reality of what he achieves on a footy field, week after week, at all levels, for years

I find it really quite strange? its like a reverse Archie Roberts-effect

is it supporter fear of failure? is it because he is built like a bit like a young Shane Edwards?

(btw, he plays a fair bit like an old Shane Edwards)

All very true, I still think he does a lot of "floater" type kicks. He's not the only one.
It's my perception of his kicking. Don't get me wrong, I'll be quite happy if we pick him at #1. I don't have enough knowledge to suggest who'd be a better pick.
Thank goodness we have professionals who scout these guys for years now. Not like our early pick & hope efforts.

 

[Number8]

but I totally dont get the disparity between what people write about Jagga, and the reality of what he achieves on a footy field, week after week, at all levels, for years

Don’t reckon it’s any more than the fact we’re talking about pick 1. The bar is high and we need run and carry. He’s the right man for a lot of needs, but is he the right man for our needs?

 

[caesar]

So all Coates Qtr Finals games are at Port Melbourne this weekend.

Entry to all Coates Talent League matches is free, with all quarter finals available to be streamed live and free on the Coates Talent League app.

The AFL has today confirmed the fixture for the 2024 Coates Talent League Quarter Finals.

BOYS FIXTURE​

Saturday, September 7
Third Quarter Final, Geelong Falcons (Country/Tas #1) vs GWV Rebels (Country/Tas #4)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 11:30am AEST

Fourth Quarter Final, Dandenong Stingrays (Country/Tas #2) vs Gippsland Power (Country/Tas #3)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 2:00pm AEST

Sunday, September 8
First Quarter Final, Sandringham Dragons (Metro #1) vs Calder Cannons (Metro #4)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 11:00am AEST

Second Quarter Final, Northern Knights (Metro #2) vs Oakleigh Chargers (Metro #3)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 1:30pm AEST

 

[Tigertool]

there's quite a few misconceptions about Jagga Smith being propagated in here.

he's the best player in a very deep pool of talent. He is the u18 AA captain.

he isn't slow, he isn't soft, he isn't outside, he rarely turns the ball over, he doesn't get injured, his kicks go 40m to his teammates advantage, he rarely hacks a kick in hope, he finds space and delivers the ball, he kicks goals from 50m, he is a prolific ball winner, he plays selflessly and creatively, he is professional, he is driven, he is a leader.

testing will show him athletically elite

interviews will suggest a champion and a captain.

there is almost zero chance he wont be a great player at AFL level for a long time.

I really dont get it?

I totally get the variation in peoples preferences; that many would prefer FOS, Lalor or Draper. They are indeed four quite different players. I do completely understand why anyone would rank those three higher than Jagga (Ashcroft and Lombard too). I get that, although its highly unlikely, Jagga Smith could last until pick 6

but I totally dont get the disparity between what people write about Jagga, and the reality of what he achieves on a footy field, week after week, at all levels, for years

I find it really quite strange? its like a reverse Archie Roberts-effect

is it supporter fear of failure? is it because he is built a bit like a young Shane Edwards?

(btw, he plays a fair bit like an old Shane Edwards)

He averaged 39.6 disposals a game for 5 weeks and must surely have a disposal average on 33+ per game for the U18 season.

He's produced head-and-shoulders-rolled-gold output over the next best set of player numbers. I think if recruiters can look those eye-watering numbers in the eye and still be unsure then it's enough for anyone to be unsure.

 

[Leysy Days]

So you would be happy to take a Bakes type with no 1.
Jagga is a average kick ,unless it is short,does a lot of dinky handballs ,which a lot of them puts his team mates under pressure ,but it still goes on his efficiency as good,,gets bustled out the way in hard contests easily ,he is lucky he has elite endurance ,because if he didn't you would be looking at a top 20 pick.

Really can't be arsed going over the same ground/argument TBH BT.

Would just be repeating what said on Mick (and others at the top end) below.

Will say Bakes comparison's are pretty silly. Been a very valuable player, but Bakes has never been a consistent ball winner - at any level. Something Mick does in his sleep. Different players with different strengths.

And no-one is right or wrong yet. Cos guess what, we won't know who was right in this debate for a few years.

Been busy with kids sports etc. Getting back to this question. @bengal tigers also asked Leysy something about who is better than Lawler at 1. Didn't think anyone cared!!

Am gunna be soft and answer in a roundabout way:

As you both know, not scared to have a strong opinion in this place. Mostly it works, very occasionally it doesn't.

But really don't have a strong opinion on pick 1. Will say, reckon there is now a clear cut top 4. Then a gap to the rest. In no order:

FoS - Class, step, agile, nice size, composure, skills etc. Always in this top echelon all year. Worthy no 1. Only small ? mark is his ability to win enough ball. Has he delivered a 35 touch, 15 contested, 7 clearance, 3 goal game?

Lawler - amazing kick, wins own footy, strong as an ox, good overhead, good first two steps, competitor. Is he Dusty? Is he De Goey? Is he Raynor? Only ? mark can he build his aerobic capacity. Great call by BT to always have him this high.

Draper - Low centre of gravity, strong, evasive, and puts opponents on back foot more than anyone else (which we badly need). reads the play. SA boy? And not quite as composed as the other 3.

Mick Jagga - Leysy's boy. Have read Lachie Neale comparisons. He'll never be that. His old man was a whippet all his life. Mick looks cut from the same cloth. He'll never be thick through the core. 100% more Zak Butters/Nick Daicos. have also read he's not quick - also wrong ILO. Combine his agility with his zip and he's the hardest to lay a hand on in this class bar Draper.

Another thing he's knocked for is his hurt factor - again completely disagree. Yes he might go short, but it's always to his teams advantage and keeps the flow of the chain going. Imagine him going into Hawthorn next year the way they move the ball. He would rack up 30 plus and 10 score involvements every week. His hurt factor, pace, agility, reading of the ball, head over the ball etc - are elite and still undersold.

The one thing Leysy agrees is a legit ? mark is his size. He will never be big built and a strong core. It will be butters/rozee not dusty/neale.

Soft answer - But reckon the 4 should be grouped together and can completely see why anyone would take one over the other.

Gun to the head would take FoS ATM if knew his Vo2 and aerobic stuff checked out. That probably hasn't changed since March.

Would also love if we could trade another pick to take a second player from this four. That should be a chance.

And FFS don't take Armstrong in the top 10 - There's your opinion.

 

[Webbie26]

I

Be amazed if we take that many talls EZ.

Expecting one. Two at a push.

I think we definitely take 2 maybe a whitlock and faull combo with later picks

 

[Webbie26]

Pick 1 if we take jagga nobody will be dissapointed. If we take fos nobody will be dissapointed. Both will be guns

 

[Mr Brightside]

there's quite a few misconceptions about Jagga Smith being propagated in here.

he's the best player in a very deep pool of talent. He is the u18 AA captain.

he isn't slow, he isn't soft, he isn't outside, he rarely turns the ball over, he doesn't get injured, his kicks go 40m to his teammates advantage, he rarely hacks a kick in hope, he finds space and delivers the ball, he kicks goals from 50m, he is a prolific ball winner, he plays selflessly and creatively, he is professional, he is driven, he is a leader.

testing will show him athletically elite

interviews will suggest a champion and a captain.

there is almost zero chance he wont be a great player at AFL level for a long time.

I really dont get it?

I totally get the variation in peoples preferences; that many would prefer FOS, Lalor or Draper. They are indeed four quite different players. I do completely understand why anyone would rank those three higher than Jagga (Ashcroft and Lombard too). I get that, although its highly unlikely, Jagga Smith could last until pick 6

but I totally dont get the disparity between what people write about Jagga, and the reality of what he achieves on a footy field, week after week, at all levels, for years

I find it really quite strange? its like a reverse Archie Roberts-effect

is it supporter fear of failure? is it because he is built a bit like a young Shane Edwards?

(btw, he plays a fair bit like an old Shane Edwards)

One thing I like about Jagga that he does better then his counterparts, is the fact when his got it the opposition ain’t , he has the ball in hes hands a lot .

Definitely has underrated work rate and desire to “ want” the ball , I don’t see his work as getting the one 2 stat raiser, I see him as a genuine hungry ball winner with great footy nous

I’m a bit against the grain with the little more I’ve watched , I think FOS and Smith are clear best , Smillie is actually the smokie for me to be best , think the next lot are more a bunch of throw a blanket over 10 kids more then 4 or 5 , think the draft order is going to flip a lot from the general “ mock “ at this point to what actually happens on draft night . Hope I’m wrong , however I’m not sure this is a super draft , think it will be very good just no super draft at this point

 

[eZyT]

Don’t reckon it’s any more than the fact we’re talking about pick 1. The bar is high and we need run and carry. He’s the right man for a lot of needs, but is he the right man for our needs?

I get the pressure of pick 1; not nailing it reverberates through the decades.

but that still doesn't explain the propagation of a narrative that Jagga is a fragile skinny version of Anthony Miles.

He is quite an astonishing footballer who hasn't put a foot wrong in 3 years.

he does run and carry, then he finds a teammate, runs more, and gets it back, with a minute to go in a hard close game.

 

[Mr Brightside]

So all Coates Qtr Finals games are at Port Melbourne this weekend.

Entry to all Coates Talent League matches is free, with all quarter finals available to be streamed live and free on the Coates Talent League app.

The AFL has today confirmed the fixture for the 2024 Coates Talent League Quarter Finals.

BOYS FIXTURE​

Saturday, September 7
Third Quarter Final, Geelong Falcons (Country/Tas #1) vs GWV Rebels (Country/Tas #4)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 11:30am AEST

Fourth Quarter Final, Dandenong Stingrays (Country/Tas #2) vs Gippsland Power (Country/Tas #3)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 2:00pm AEST

Sunday, September 8
First Quarter Final, Sandringham Dragons (Metro #1) vs Calder Cannons (Metro #4)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 11:00am AEST

Second Quarter Final, Northern Knights (Metro #2) vs Oakleigh Chargers (Metro #3)
ETU Stadium, Port Melbourne, 1:30pm AEST

I’d like to request @Redford please return to his best avatar of PREs finest junior scout so everybody can keep an eye out for him at Port over the weekend …….fabulous hat

 

[eZyT]

One thing I like about Jagga that he does better then his counterparts, is the fact when his got it the opposition ain’t , he has the ball in hes hands a lot .

I’m a bit against the grain with the little more I’ve watched , I think FOS and Smith are clear best , Smillie is actually the smokie for me to be best , think the next lot are more a bunch of throw a blanket over 10 kids more then 4 or 5 , think the draft order is going to flip a lot from the general “ mock “ at this point to what actually happens on draft night . Hope I’m wrong , however I’m not sure this is a super draft , think it will be very good just no super draft at this point

yeah like I said,

completely understand different eyes seeing players they want more than Jagga.

I dont get how any set of eyes can look at jagga and doesn't see an incredible footballer.

You could wonder how my eyes look at Josh Smilie and see a pick 15? but theres data that supports my eyes.

there isn't any manner of data, anywhere, to suggest Jagga isn't Top 5 at absolute worst.

but like Leysy says, it will all be sorted in 5-6 years,

and most of us will have forgotten what we thought

 

[Webbie26]

One thing I like about Jagga that he does better then his counterparts, is the fact when his got it the opposition ain’t , he has the ball in hes hands a lot .

I’m a bit against the grain with the little more I’ve watched , I think FOS and Smith are clear best , Smillie is actually the smokie for me to be best , think the next lot are more a bunch of throw a blanket over 10 kids more then 4 or 5 , think the draft order is going to flip a lot from the general “ mock “ at this point to what actually happens on draft night . Hope I’m wrong , however I’m not sure this is a super draft , think it will be very good just no super draft at this point

Totally agree 100% even the smille can be the best in time. Smith does chase the footy and neglects his man at stoppages or do anything to chase and defend however. Fos on the other hand is a 2 way player and defends way more

 

[eZyT]

Totally agree 100% even the smille can be the best in time. Smith does chase the footy and neglects his man at stoppages or do anything to chase and defend however. Fos on the other hand is a 2 way player and defends way more

defensive running is a very rare quality in the junior big dogs

 

[Mr Brightside]

yeah like I said,

completely understand different eyes seeing players they want more than Jagga.

I dont get how any set of eyes can look at jagga and doesn't see an incredible footballer.

You could wonder how my eyes look at Josh Smilie and see a pick 15? but theres data that supports my eyes.

there isn't any manner of data, anywhere, to suggest Jagga isn't Top 5 at absolute worst.

but like Leysy says, it will all be sorted in 5-6 years,

and most of us will have forgotten what we thought

Like all footballers they all have queries on them .

Totally get the Smillie thoughts , I think the thing that will stop him from being elite is competitiveness at ball and man , if he learns that his frame can be a wrecking ball , he’ll be a star if not imho he’ll still be a very good 150 gamer

 

[eZyT]

Like all footballers they all have queries on them .

Totally get the Smillie thoughts , I think the thing that will stop him from being elite is competitiveness at ball and man , if he learns that his frame can be a wrecking ball , he’ll be a star if not imho he’ll still be a very good 150 gamer

yeah I dont think he its Bont or Cripps, more Elliot Yeo.

I'd be happy to take a punt after we have Joeberry locked away on a 4 year deal

 

[mrposhman]

Totally agree 100% even the smille can be the best in time. Smith does chase the footy and neglects his man at stoppages or do anything to chase and defend however. Fos on the other hand is a 2 way player and defends way more

I'm still in the FOS at 1 camp. Multiple other clubs will take him, less convinced that as many take Smith as they are looking for complimentary players for their rebuilds.

North - If they take a mid, will want a mid that can play alternative positions. They had Sheezel in the backline, then into the mid, they had McKercher doing that role this year, if they take a mid they will take a flexible one, FOS / Lalor / Langford, one that can play at either HB or HF
West Coast - They like bigger mids IMO, so will probably target that, or they might try and add speed. FOS / Lalor / Langford / Draper
Adelaide - If Draper is there, they will take him, not sure who else they might take, but probably a bigger body if they can't get speed. If they want to play Rankine / Rachele in there, then if speed isn't there in Draper, do they go with a bigger body
Melbourne - I guess depends if they keep this pick, but they may go for someone like Reid. Their recent picks, seem to value excellent kicking skills over other things
Richmond - Might this mean Jagga takes a slide

For the reasons above, I reckon Jagga has a bigger chance of sliding than FOS, so IMO I take FOS at 1. It probably depends where we rate Lalor as well.

 

[Tiger Ghost]

Jagga is number 1 for me at the moment, if you've ever been to watch 18's footy you'll know they don't tag, they don't flood and generally theres not too much defensive pressure. The fact that Jagga went up to VFL and absolutely stood out against men playing in a different structure says volumes about the boy. Get it done.

 

[TT33]

We've got to get at least 3 picks in the top 10, pick the eyes out them & hopefully its happy days.

 

[eZyT]

We've got to get at least 3 picks in the top 10, pick the eyes out them & hopefully its happy days.

we should trade Gibbo, Noah, Seth, MRJ, Tarrant, Hopper, Tom Brown, MCCauliifee and Bauer

and just start from scratch with 22 draft picks?

we might be unrecognisable and win a free-kick count for a couple of weeks?

well, a half anyway.

 

[Don’t Argue]

we should trade Gibbo, Noah, Seth, MRJ, Tarrant, Hopper, Tom Brown, MCCauliifee and Bauer

and just start from scratch with 22 draft picks?

we might be unrecognisable and win a free-kick count for a couple of weeks?

well, a half anyway.

I asked Benny Gale recently why we’re always last for free kick differential. I told him not to give me the story about it being our game style as the Suns are now first for differential with our old coach and the same game style as ours. He said lucky Balme wasn’t there to hear the conversation as he would have needed another triple bypass.
In private later he asked me if it was true about Suns being first and when I said yes he scratched his head and said “*smile* me”