Think it was Peter Moore who threw his runners up medal & they stopped giving them out from then on.
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The Geelong Cants
- Thread starter 23.21.159
- Start date
I think some people here are focussing too much on the “getting there” part of being in Preliminary Finals and Grand Finals, and overlooking what is the most telling part - how you actually perform. What every club should be striving for is to build a team who competes well in finals. This and this alone is what clubs should be judged upon.
The best of the Cats in recent years was being totally overrun in a shortened Grand Final by a Richmond team effectively down two players - both from the same line, from the early part of the first term. Their next best was being less dramatically overrun in the 2019 PF by a Rance-less Richmond(they had no Hawkins) after they found themselves in front by an inflated amount at HT due to the Dangerfield gift goal that otherwise could have been a Richmond scoring opportunity. The way these games played out left you with the impression if they were played 10 times over Richmond win 10 times over but by a bigger average winning margin.
The 2021 finals Geelong were not any threat to the best few teams.
2018 they were well beaten in an EF, absolutely no threat to man or beast.
2017 they copped smashings by both Grand Finalists, never looking a realistic threat at any time material to the result.
2016 they were comfortably beaten with a decent home advantage by the LOSING Grand Finalist.
And it was before this I thought where they took the wrong turns that led to all these results being about their realistic ceiling, where had they used their draft picks at the draft and consequently taken some lower finishes producing more and superior draft picks, they would have had a real chance of being a burgeoning Premierships threat over the next couple of years.
Given their chosen path, the best they were going to get was one burgled flag if they did a Bradbury. The alternative path they’d have been taking the chance of a period out of the finals(so what if you perform the way the Cats have in finals) but with a decent chance of forming a team that could truly challenge for 4-5-6 seasons.
Now after these failures they are probably in the worst position in the AFL in terms of having a real chance to challenge in the next 10 seasons. So it is a catastrophic failure. I am pleased they have failed because I hate the philosophy upon which they have based their strategy.
The best of the Cats in recent years was being totally overrun in a shortened Grand Final by a Richmond team effectively down two players - both from the same line, from the early part of the first term. Their next best was being less dramatically overrun in the 2019 PF by a Rance-less Richmond(they had no Hawkins) after they found themselves in front by an inflated amount at HT due to the Dangerfield gift goal that otherwise could have been a Richmond scoring opportunity. The way these games played out left you with the impression if they were played 10 times over Richmond win 10 times over but by a bigger average winning margin.
The 2021 finals Geelong were not any threat to the best few teams.
2018 they were well beaten in an EF, absolutely no threat to man or beast.
2017 they copped smashings by both Grand Finalists, never looking a realistic threat at any time material to the result.
2016 they were comfortably beaten with a decent home advantage by the LOSING Grand Finalist.
And it was before this I thought where they took the wrong turns that led to all these results being about their realistic ceiling, where had they used their draft picks at the draft and consequently taken some lower finishes producing more and superior draft picks, they would have had a real chance of being a burgeoning Premierships threat over the next couple of years.
Given their chosen path, the best they were going to get was one burgled flag if they did a Bradbury. The alternative path they’d have been taking the chance of a period out of the finals(so what if you perform the way the Cats have in finals) but with a decent chance of forming a team that could truly challenge for 4-5-6 seasons.
Now after these failures they are probably in the worst position in the AFL in terms of having a real chance to challenge in the next 10 seasons. So it is a catastrophic failure. I am pleased they have failed because I hate the philosophy upon which they have based their strategy.
He left Collingwood because he thought his shitt didn't stink and he deserved to win one, so he packed his bags and went to the most under achieving side at the time, in Melbourne.
While I reckon a premiership franks your success, it doesn't define it.
Remaining competitive for a long period of time and constantly putting yourself in the position to challenge for a flag is a clear marker that you're doing things well ... and that is a definition of a successful organisation.
I think this attitude was burned into my psyche, initially, during the Patterson/Sproule/Bartlett/Jeans years, when all I wanted to do was go to the footy and either win or see signs of improvement. Turning up to school on a Monday and being mocked by Essendon, Collingwood or Carlton supporters was dreadful. Anytime we won, well, I would be walking on air for the entire week.
But, I reckon, the other thing that defines success is whether or not you're proud to be associated with an organisation.
While we've won flags in the recent past, there have been other incredibly important markers of success along the way:
• Record membership
• Beating all of the other 'big 4' Melbourne clubs in the one year
• Breaking longstanding losing records
• Winning the hotly-contested signature of Tom Lynch
• Retaining all marquee players
• Recruiting and retaining a thriving set of Indigenous lads
• Reintegrating the VFL side
• Winning two Jim Stynes Leadership awards
• Etc
I imagine Geelong could compile a similar list of successes, with 'remaining in contention' near the top of that list. While they will forever gnash teeth over not winning a flag this past decade, to not consider that club as successful is just churlish.
Remaining competitive for a long period of time and constantly putting yourself in the position to challenge for a flag is a clear marker that you're doing things well ... and that is a definition of a successful organisation.
I think this attitude was burned into my psyche, initially, during the Patterson/Sproule/Bartlett/Jeans years, when all I wanted to do was go to the footy and either win or see signs of improvement. Turning up to school on a Monday and being mocked by Essendon, Collingwood or Carlton supporters was dreadful. Anytime we won, well, I would be walking on air for the entire week.
But, I reckon, the other thing that defines success is whether or not you're proud to be associated with an organisation.
While we've won flags in the recent past, there have been other incredibly important markers of success along the way:
• Record membership
• Beating all of the other 'big 4' Melbourne clubs in the one year
• Breaking longstanding losing records
• Winning the hotly-contested signature of Tom Lynch
• Retaining all marquee players
• Recruiting and retaining a thriving set of Indigenous lads
• Reintegrating the VFL side
• Winning two Jim Stynes Leadership awards
• Etc
I imagine Geelong could compile a similar list of successes, with 'remaining in contention' near the top of that list. While they will forever gnash teeth over not winning a flag this past decade, to not consider that club as successful is just churlish.
Well if Geelong are such a model of success why aren't more Teams following their brand of Football!
Trying to obtain a small odd shaped home ground footy oval that suits the home ground specialists only!
Recruiting older aged players, 30years plus! and having the oldest aged playing side/list going around!
Having a coach that specializes in constant whinges/excuses as to why they do not win Finals/Gfs!
Why hasn't old Salty spawned a heap of quality coaches from his assistants over these/his successful years!?
Their only winning strategy was performed by their Captain for years until the AFL changed the umpiring rules, ducking for frees!
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I agree with your first statement, and the general notion the teams other than the Premier can be considered to be successful. But imo this does not include the Cats over recent seasons.
The principle purpose of all AFL football clubs is to build a football team, form a game plan, and create a culture that is capable of at least winning a Premiership given a fair run at it. The Cats have had a very fair run at it, and they have not looked capable. I cannot think of one single losing Preliminary or Grand Final for them since 2016 where you think if they replayed that match next week the Cats could realistically win it. So they have been pretenders, despite their impressive volume of home and away season wins over that time.
Therefore, they haven’t really ticked the “remain in contention” box at all. This is because of some mixture of not building the right team, not forming the right game plan and or not having the right culture. The team has largely been too old, so their best players get run off their legs every September. Their game plan does not put enough pressure on strong opponents in finals, and indeed invites opposition pressure in the areas of the ground where the game is won and lost. And their culture seems to accept when you get under pressure in big games you start playing for false free kicks in preference to genuinely contesting the ball. This of course is in complete contrast to the very strong and successful Geelong teams of the 2007-11 era where they were well led, full of quality prime age players, and as far as I know(I missed a lot of it overseas,) just genuinely contested the ball.
Successful clubs are mostly winning Premierships. This Geelong team has mostly won Semierships. Two levels below genuine success.
Will they be recognised as a successful club/preiod in 100 years? Or will they be criticised for repeating the same plan/topping up and expecting a different result?
That is probably it in a nutshell. We are all too happy to discuss the merits of Geelong over the last period because we have watched it and prior to 2017, envied it. But for those coming later. Nuh. Hawthorns period of dominance resulted in a swag of premierships and quite rightly they are lauded for that period. I do think the Geelong last decade will fade fairly fast in peoples memories going forward despite their consistency over that time.
Theoretically I might know they've been a bloody good team for a long time. Doesn't mean I have to admit it publicly.
Considering some 30 plus years of hidings, mockery n suffering, I'm more than entitled to hate them with a passion n turn the blow torch back on them at full heat.
What's the point of being a club supporter if ya can't hang *smile* on all the opposition clubs when the opportunity presents itself?
So Richmond either had a good era from 1916 to 1947 or we failed.
In those 32 years we made the finals 22 times
We made the grand final 15 times winning 5 times
From 1989 to now - 33 years - Geelong has made the finals 24 times
They have made the grand final 9 times winning 3
In those 32 years we made the finals 22 times
We made the grand final 15 times winning 5 times
From 1989 to now - 33 years - Geelong has made the finals 24 times
They have made the grand final 9 times winning 3
Everyone belted us prior to 2017. So many thumpings. But 2 & 3 definitely. Just change out “comes across as” with IS/ARE
I do agree on that. Tho i'd say the great teams don't celebrate it & the mediocre ones do & often don't achieve much more than it.
I can't speak for anyone else but for me it's more to do with how their fans treated us when we were rubbish more than anything else. Funnily enough the shoe has been on the other foot recently & they aren't so keen on those conversations as they once were.
I can still recall their chants towards us as we left the ground after rd 12 '19. It would have been fun to see if they were so vocal after the Prelim, given they laughed when i mentioned we'll meet them again in Finals. That bunch copped what they deserved, they were carrying on like they'd won the flag already. In the case of Scott it becomes amusing given his obsession with making comments about us over recent yrs which have always backfired on him.
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For mine the "all in" comes from who they have recruited, Ablett was never going to be a long term player upon his return & they'd retired Bartel a year before who was younger than him. Smith & Higgins are in the same boat now, Higgins wasn't even in their best side at the end of last yr....
Bingo. 37 years has set as apart from the others.
It's time to unleash.
I haven't stopped hanging *smile* to 'Collingwood supporters 'only Collingwood could lose a GF leading by 5 goals'
'Only Collingwood supporters could be proud of there side losing to interstate side at the G in a GF'.
*The questions beckons, Would Brisbane have won 3 in a row if they played another side?"
We beat them during that era, stkilda was good, Port??
I tend to use the reverse tactic in this sort of situation - and it’s just to agree with them.
Let them blather on about their “gun” players and just nod your head and add nothing.
They’re expecting counter arguments - don’t give them the satisfaction.
They are *smile* deluded.
Let ‘em stay that way.
