For mine it's a failure, especially when, from a list management point of view they have gone "all in" to win 1.
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The Geelong Cants
- Thread starter 23.21.159
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While I broadly agree with this, we are judging with the benefit of hindsight. When you look at it from the perspective at the time, it is quite reasonable to think they were close and it was worth trying to bridge that gap for a flag. To some extent we are spoiled, we won 1 and then added 2 more, but flags are damned hard to win. Look at West Coast, managed 1 and look to be sinking.
Yes, a failure, but not an unreasonable failure.
The worst thing Geelong have done is to sacrifice their future too much for the chance of a flag now. They should have balanced both goals better. Easier said than done though.
DS
I've slung as much poo at Scott and Geelong as anyone but one thing I would say is I think fans are often too binary regarding winning flags. It's win or bust. Which is not how it works, only one side can win a premiership each year. In 2018 we fell short, but we still finished top and had a great year that should not be dismissed or forgotten. Not enough credit is given to the side who finishes first after the home and away season imo.
Would I rather have Scott's tenure / record over Dimma's or Clarko's? No, but I'd take it over almost any other coach in the league during that period, which says a lot.
Would I rather have Scott's tenure / record over Dimma's or Clarko's? No, but I'd take it over almost any other coach in the league during that period, which says a lot.
Thing is, to win flags, you have to keep presenting. We’ve been lucky, three GF appearances have translated into three flags. In the lead up to them, we made finals three years in a row and achieved bubkus during that period. We also had a Prelim Final loss in 2018. Point is, it took seven finals appearances over nine years to win those flags.
The Cats have also won three flags in recent times and they have been contenders for much longer than we have.
I prefer to look at it this way.
Would Geelong have beaten GWS in 2019? Of course they would have beaten them. We only just got over the line, thanks to some terrific goal kicking from Lynch.
How close were they in 2020? They were leading at half time and were beaten by a Dustin Martin Masterclass. You could argue that they would have gone further in 2017, except for another Dustin Martin Masterclass.
Let‘s just enjoy the pain Richmond has caused to a rival. They enjoyed it for decades before we came good again.
By the way, we have 8 flags from our last 10 GF appearances. Worth every minute of it.
The Cats have also won three flags in recent times and they have been contenders for much longer than we have.
I prefer to look at it this way.
Would Geelong have beaten GWS in 2019? Of course they would have beaten them. We only just got over the line, thanks to some terrific goal kicking from Lynch.
How close were they in 2020? They were leading at half time and were beaten by a Dustin Martin Masterclass. You could argue that they would have gone further in 2017, except for another Dustin Martin Masterclass.
Let‘s just enjoy the pain Richmond has caused to a rival. They enjoyed it for decades before we came good again.
By the way, we have 8 flags from our last 10 GF appearances. Worth every minute of it.
And when the Bombers make the finals as well your chances are very high in winning a final.
Yep, we're bloody harsh judges!
Thing is that premierships are what is counted, just the way it is in most sports. We judge Greg Norman on major wins, not how long he was ranked number 1 in the world, same goes for tennis, same goes for cricket . . . we're harsh!
Success is hard to measure, if you are contending and look like you are a chance to win the big prize you clearly are having more success than a team which is languishing down the bottom. But you have to have your eyes on the main prize, and here it becomes a judgement call. Do you sacrifice everything for the chance to win one? Most would answer yes and it is a good answer. But if you fall short it may not be a complete failure but it is a failure. Nasty business. Hard to see what Geelong should or could have done differently at the time, they were genuine contenders. For a rising team getting closer to the top is success (look at Melbourne, they got close, saw the gaps, and managed to take the next step, of course that means 17 other teams did not take the next step) but at some point you need to convert contending into succeeding.
DS
Agree 100% but I think I'd prefer a kick to the nuts over what we had over those 37 years as well!!
without checking i doubt any other coach in the league has coached the last 10 years without winning a flag.
I get that but no other coach has had years and years of top 4 finishes either. Doesn't make up for the fact that they dont win however explains them not moving him on.
And btw, the pies have lost 8 flags from their last 10 GF appearances. Worth every second of it. (Apart from the 2 they won!)
*apologies. ... I know this is a cats topic but the opportunity to stick it to Collingwood was irresistible.
Yeah, I had a fun conversation with a Cats fan that I met at a golf day last year.
Once he found out I was a Tigers fan he hit me with something along the lines that Dusty is clearly better than anyone on Geelong’s list. I was feeling sceptical at this so I replied, “what, even better than Dangerfield???”
He insisted on conceding that Dusty was too good but after him, he argued, that, man for man, Geelong had better players everywhere. Selwood is better than Cotchin, Hawkins is a superstar, Riewoldt is just a good player. Arguments along those lines.
I countered with Grimes, Vlastuin and even Broad would get a game before Tom Stewart.
Eventually, we got down to discussing the big ones, Castagna vs Gary Rohan and Nankervis vs Rhys Stanley. Game over.
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Over the recent period? I'd rather have the Dogs, WCE and Melbourne's record than the Cats.
I can see both sides on the geelong situation. What really made me think they had lost the plot was when they traded 3 (?) first round picks for Cameron. They finally had a strong draft hand and a real chance to start the renewal process, while still being very competitive, and they pissed it away on him. That was a massive fail IMO.
Pity those bastards had that little purple patch in between. Just imagine how sad, cold n lonely those moggies fans would be if they'd come out of 40 plus years of competition dominance n continuous finals with bubkis, a totally clean slate.
Just did a quick snaffle through the history books n since the start of the 1980 season until last years finish the Moggies have managed.
3 Flags won.
6 lost Grannies.
10 lost Prelims.
7 lost other finals.
So in 42 completed seasons, they've played finals 26 times and made the last four on 19 occasions for a grand total of 3 flags. That's some kind of gianormous effort of consistent performance over such a long time. But ultimately with only 3 flags to show for such sustained effort, it's kinda underwhelming.
Think I'm gunna fully load up the ammo bag as I'm going to visit my Moggies brothers on the weekend, Haaaarrrrgh.
Puts the Moggies overall results into some kind of perspective. Last fifty or sixty years I'm guessing our 8 from 10 record would be behind probably only Hawforns efforts.
The massive advantage the Scats get from all their home games flatters them. Come finals, time after time they come up short, fairly sad that isn't it
