Sorry Ryan or OHB? As there were discussions of both around the time i quoted you? If Samson then you're probably more right than wrong.
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Samson Ryan
- Thread starter Tigertool
- Start date
I think the club is right so spend money and time on him. Blokes his size don't come along often, particularly ones who can kick well....
If he comes good at 26 and plays another 6-8 seasons as a big bodied ruck all of PRE will be singing his praises. I guess it's a wait and see.
Gotta say i agree with the nay sayers here.
Its funny we have two 23 year olds in Ryan and Koschitzke. One is being afforded all sorts of excuses and the other is being highly criticised for similar output.
My choice would be to find out what Koschitzke can offer as a defender and also play Blight. That allows us to play Balta forward and we can also play Bauer as a mobile third tall forward. When Lynch comes back those three would be the tall set up.
Kosi and Balta if need be can give Nankervis a rest.
Its funny we have two 23 year olds in Ryan and Koschitzke. One is being afforded all sorts of excuses and the other is being highly criticised for similar output.
My choice would be to find out what Koschitzke can offer as a defender and also play Blight. That allows us to play Balta forward and we can also play Bauer as a mobile third tall forward. When Lynch comes back those three would be the tall set up.
Kosi and Balta if need be can give Nankervis a rest.
Sure spend the time on him,but seriously question and have him correct his one handed marking style.Also on the rare occasion when he has put up both hands and held out flat towards the ball is also a critical error.Pointless being a good kick if you you do not get many.Cumbo at least can kick goals with his unusual style.Ryan cannot clunk a mark on any regular basis with his unusual style.
His marking style has to be fixed.
I reckon he does get held, I reckon too many forwards do and only a couple of them ever get frees for it.
I don't see it as an excuse, more an explanation as to why he keeps going up with 1 hand.
But, from what I see, if you are being held and you don't get frees as a result, then you change your tactics. Someone must be trying to teach him to mark, and I figure they would also be telling him to get separation and lead. I watched the 2017 Dusty highlights on another thread and you notice how much more movement there was in our forward line back then - a lot of kudos for players playing unselfishly by kicking to a player in space with a better shot on goal, but that requires players to move to space which we haven't been doing for a few years. Samson, if he can learn to mark, should be doing this - at his height he doesn't need much space just a short run and jump and no-one will be able to spoil it.
DS
I reckon he does get held, I reckon too many forwards do and only a couple of them ever get frees for it.
I don't see it as an excuse, more an explanation as to why he keeps going up with 1 hand.
But, from what I see, if you are being held and you don't get frees as a result, then you change your tactics. Someone must be trying to teach him to mark, and I figure they would also be telling him to get separation and lead. I watched the 2017 Dusty highlights on another thread and you notice how much more movement there was in our forward line back then - a lot of kudos for players playing unselfishly by kicking to a player in space with a better shot on goal, but that requires players to move to space which we haven't been doing for a few years. Samson, if he can learn to mark, should be doing this - at his height he doesn't need much space just a short run and jump and no-one will be able to spoil it.
DS
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Blight has shown alot more than Kosi in the backline at VFL level imo and is 18 months younger (Kosi about to turn 24). For me there is no spot for Kosi back, but there is an opening forward but he hasn't shown the capability to take it yet. He has a long contract though (through to 2026 - didn't realise so long) so is going to be given every opportunity.
Nothing to stop us playing both in the backline with Miller. Add in Smith, Brown, and Trezise.
Its easy to do, no more Short in the backline, move Rioli to a wing and Broad as the 7th defender or even wing. Next year there is always Gibcus coming back.
Lynch Bauer and Balta as our tall forwards, especially if Blight and Koschitzke with Miller can show a bit down back..
When Gray shows some good form change it around and give him some games as well.
The rest of this year is about playing the borderliners, ie Koschitzke in a different role, the kids Smith McAuliffe Trezise and Campbell plus the rest of the talls Blight, Bauer and Gray.
Try some seniors in different roles ie Rioli to a wing even Broad.
Just add the better seniors around them What is there to lose?
The question that regularly seems needed to be asked all the time is. Are we in rebuild or not? If the answer is yes, then we need to play as many kids as practicable and make sure there is enough of the better seniors there when we do.
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No, Balta stays back for the rest of his career. Crazy to me people still want him forward. Balta, Miller, Blight all young. Gibcus definitely if he can get right. Brown a lock. I like Tresize. And also Smith. I see no room for Kosi back. Is behind the others in that position imo and we have to keep 1 or 2 experienced back.
We have forward issues. Campbell Gray looks OK but a long-shot still. Lefau out for a year now. Bauer maybe but a bit short. Not proven yet. Kosi has a chance but needs to improve alot. He was recruited to provide forward coverage. Need a gun forward like Lynch & Reiwoldt. Don't see it in what we current have. Lynch contracted to next year but at 32yo next year and recurring injuries I'm not sure Tigers get too many more games out of him.
And yes it is feels like a rebuild. Look at all the over 30s we've had to offload and still offload.
I agree he's probably still a couple of years off. He just isn't ready physically. It's a big investment by the club for a very uncertain return.
You mention numerous tall defensive options and exclude Kosi. When has he played as a defender for us? Would just like for us to see what he has to offer as a defender because i reckon most have seen enough of him as a forward.
All those tall defensive options!!! yet you go on to say we have forward issues and exclude Balta from the conversation. Are none of the kpd's coming thru good enough.
I would have thought Miller has shown he belongs, Gibcus is potentially easily the best kpd we have, Third tall Bauer a possibility, Blight looks likely then there's young, we need to see Koschitzke at the level as a defender and Gray started as a defender. Then of course there's Balta.
Only Balta looks capable of becoming a quality key forward imo.
Beggars can not be choosers. Lynch is 32 and the injuries are really happening in recent years. Then there is who? You guessed it Noah Balta.
Just an opinion but we should not be looking for a quality kpf to partner Lynch. Nope we need to find Lynchy's replacement.
The logical choice is Balta !!!. What we Really need to find is a quality junior kpf to partner Balta.
No to Balta. Been tried 3 times during his career and has wrecked his confidence every time, nowhere near up to the class of Lynch and Reiwoldt as a forward. Doesn't have the natural forward ability you need to be the best. But will be a champion backman. That's logical.
Yes I already said we need to find Lynch"s replacement, that I agree with. We don't have one. Need to either recruit ala Lynch or use a quality draft pick. No guarantees of course.
Of course we can keep trying Kosi, and had some hopes for him but so far considering he is 24yo in July and he has been on a list and played 52 games, I haven't been that impressed even at VFL level either forward or back. He'll have to improve immensely and I can't see that there is much growth left. But he's contracted until through 2026 so I'm sure he'll be given more opportunities but I suspect that will be forward. Of course as you say these are just our opinions. The club will do in the end what they see fit.
Yet its pretty much collectively agreed on here that Jack and Lynch have been held at most contests (and I've seen it with my own eyes) for years now. I don't think its something the umps pay much UNLESS you flop around etc like the Kings, Curnows, Ben Browns who flop and throw themselves around to accentuate any contact. I think for a long time, we have tried to play like men with these sort of things and not play the game.
Not in favor of turning a gun back into an average forward. Balta stays back for mine.
I am really disappointed with Ryan's development this year, which feels like he has gone backwards, but nevertheless happy to see him get him games. Only way to improve.
Thats my thoughts on Balta too.
He "could" be a very good kpf, but he IS one of the best defenders in the comp.
Remember when we tried Rance on a wing because his running capacity was so good?
Forwards being held is a huge problem but the AFL choose to just ignore it.
What a mess.
DS
