Matthew Clarke

[St Kevin]

Unless the player fell into his hands, he basically always missed good kids after our pick.
Imagine now, just after 3 flags.
Having 2x Ellis, Huggins and Cd waiting to get into the side.
We would stay up
But 3 are gone and the last one cant run out half a game at the age of 20.
Either trade the early picks or go get better at recognising talent.

With respect, “Fell into his hands” is such a cop out.

FJ said he would have picked Martin even if we had the first pick (ahead of Scully, who was a moral first overall pick). He clearly knew what he was doing there. Coupled with his refusal to trade the pick to Sydney, it’s far too simplistic to just say he lucked into it.

Same with Cotchin, I think he’s been on the record as saying he’d have picked Cotchin regardless (and we should have had the first overall pick that year).

 

[zippadeee]

With respect, “Fell into his hands” is such a cop out.

FJ said he would have picked Martin even if we had the first pick (ahead of Scully, who was a moral first overall pick). He clearly knew what he was doing there. Coupled with his refusal to trade the pick to Sydney, it’s far too simplistic to just say he lucked into it.

Same with Cotchin, I think he’s been on the record as saying he’d have picked Cotchin regardless (and we should have had the first overall pick that year).

Its easy to say it after.
What's his
excuse with huggins??

 

[TT33]

With respect, “Fell into his hands” is such a cop out.

FJ said he would have picked Martin even if we had the first pick (ahead of Scully, who was a moral first overall pick). He clearly knew what he was doing there. Coupled with his refusal to trade the pick to Sydney, it’s far too simplistic to just say he lucked into it.

Same with Cotchin, I think he’s been on the record as saying he’d have picked Cotchin regardless (and we should have had the first overall pick that year).

He would also have picked Riewoldt at 8 if we hadn't swapped it for 13, was very relieved when Jack was still available.

 

[St Kevin]

Its easy to say it after.
What's his
excuse with huggins??

Does he need an excuse? Not every pick works out. Higgins could play, but didn’t want to be at Richmond / didn’t back himself to play consistently. Is that Jackson’s fault, Higgins’ fault, or the coaches’ fault? Frank’s third on the culpability scale there.

Edit: also, regardless of whether he said it after, he still made the pick at the time. Which makes your argument redundant. Now if Frank had picked Sam Walsh with the first overall pick, you’d have more of a point.

 

[King Kong]

Not to mention the very poor selections of Cotchin, Martin, Riewoldt, Edwards, Rance, Vlastuin and B. Ellis. Amazing he lasted as long as he did.

Edwards and Rance were 2nd round picks (no knock on those) and I wouldn't be calling B Ellis a win. A pass at best.

A Bigfruity nuffy would have picked Cotchin at 2 and Martin at 3. That leaves Riewoldt and Vlastuin as great 1st round picks............2 wins v 4 duds!

 

[King Kong]

Does he need an excuse? Not every pick works out. Higgins could play, but didn’t want to be at Richmond / didn’t back himself to play consistently. Is that Jackson’s fault, Higgins’ fault, or the coaches’ fault? Frank’s third on the culpability scale there.

Edit: also, regardless of whether he said it after, he still made the pick at the time. Which makes your argument redundant. Now if Frank had picked Sam Walsh with the first overall pick, you’d have more of a point.

Higgins was always a very limited upside footballer. Was driven by his old man from a young age to get the max out of his ability. Was capped out at 17 with a high fitness base but very average kicking skills. When you look at the next 12 players taken after him it was a terrible pick.

 

[Tortured Tiger]

Higgins was always a very limited upside footballer. Was driven by his old man from a young age to get the max out of his ability. Was capped out at 17 with a high fitness base but very average kicking skills. When you look at the next 12 players taken after him it was a terrible pick.

Yeah for sure, Will Walker just got delisted. Some have done better some have done worse. We are all experts with hindsight.

 

[The_General]

Higgins was always a very limited upside footballer. Was driven by his old man from a young age to get the max out of his ability. Was capped out at 17 with a high fitness base but very average kicking skills. When you look at the next 12 players taken after him it was a terrible pick.

The oversimplification of the list build process on here is laughable.
Wallace said to the recruiters, I want outside run. I want a Nick Del Santo type.
The recruiting team prioritised talent level (eg upper echelon) next tier, next tier etc. They then broke into mid, key pos etc. They had 6 in that group of kids we were looking at, eventually we went JON. If Wallace had said I need an inside bull, I'm sure we'd have picked a different mid.
It's more than just Frank or Clark sitting there saying, oooh I like him. He goes alright. They recruit to support the list build, which is there to support the coaches game plan. Higgins was the perfect type for Dimma's plan. If he'd stayed this year with us, he'd have played more games. I don't think that was a bad pick.
Ellis has played over 200 games of football and won 2 premierships. That's more than a pass. You may not like his style, but he performed.

 

[AstuteTiger]

Edwards and Rance were 2nd round picks (no knock on those) and I wouldn't be calling B Ellis a win. A pass at best.

A Bigfruity nuffy would have picked Cotchin at 2 and Martin at 3. That leaves Riewoldt and Vlastuin as great 1st round picks............2 wins v 4 duds!

Rance was a PP, end of first round. I had been keeping tabs on Rance rated him highly and was hoping we would pick him. When his name was called out, almost did cartwheels lol, called a mate we were both happy as larry.

Some average players between 3-8, but still some B talent picks in Myers, Palmer, Masten and Henderson, How about the dees picks 4 and 14

Round	Pick	Drafted By	Player	Current Team	Games Since Drafted
​	1​	Carlton​	Matthew Kreuzer P​	​	189​
1​	2​	Richmond​	Trent Cotchin​	Richmond​	268​
1​	3​	West Coast​	Chris Masten​	​	215​
1​	4​	Melbourne​	Cale Morton​	​	76​
1​	5​	Western Bulldogs​	Jarrad Grant​	​	95​
1​	6​	Essendon​	David Myers​	​	123​
1​	7​	Fremantle​	Rhys Palmer​	​	123​
1​	8​	Brisbane​	Lachlan Henderson​	Geelong​	204​
1​	9​	St Kilda​	Ben McEvoy​	Hawthorn​	244​
1​	10​	Adelaide​	Patrick Dangerfield​	Geelong​	283​
1​	11​	Sydney​	Patrick Veszpremi​	​	23​
1​	12​	Hawthorn​	Cyril Rioli​	​	189​
1​	13​	West Coast​	Brad Ebert​	​	260​
1​	14​	Melbourne​	Jack Grimes​	​	100​
1​	15​	North Melbourne​	Robbie Tarrant​	North Melbourne​	174​
1​	16​	Port Adelaide​	Matthew Lobbe​	​	100​
1​	17​	Geelong​	Harry Taylor​	​	280​
​	18​	Richmond​	Alex Rance P​	​	200​
2​	19​	Western Bulldogs​	Callan Ward​	GWS​	247​

 

[Scoop]

At 5 A+ fooballers on the list. Cotch, Danger, Cyril, Rance, Taylor and Ward. And some good B+ and B's.

And four hall of famers. It's a good list.

 

[AstuteTiger]

At 5 A+ fooballers on the list. Cotch, Danger, Cyril, Rance, Taylor and Ward. And some good B+ and B's.

And four hall of famers. It's a good list.

Agree some elite talent, even B+ McEvoy, Ebert, Tarrant.

 

[fastin bulbous]

Edwards and Rance were 2nd round picks (no knock on those) and I wouldn't be calling B Ellis a win. A pass at best.

A Bigfruity nuffy would have picked Cotchin at 2 and Martin at 3. That leaves Riewoldt and Vlastuin as great 1st round picks............2 wins v 4 duds!

Cherry picking narrative that gives 0 credit for good choices all credit for bad. Can’t you see that your own argument is a perfect reflection of what you accuse frank of?

 

[AngryAnt]

Its easy to say it after.
What's his
excuse with huggins??

you are so hot for huggins.

 

[Tortured Tiger]

Edwards and Rance were 2nd round picks (no knock on those) and I wouldn't be calling B Ellis a win. A pass at best.

A Bigfruity nuffy would have picked Cotchin at 2 and Martin at 3. That leaves Riewoldt and Vlastuin as great 1st round picks............2 wins v 4 duds!

Tell me a long term recruiter with a perfect record ?, they all have hits and misses.

 

[zippadeee]

you are so hot for huggins.

Dud

Cost us Allen or Ryan or Taylor.
imagine Liam Ryan on the G..4 goals every week

 

[AngryAnt]

Ellis has played over 200 games of football and won 2 premierships. That's more than a pass. You may not like his style, but he performed.

I'm guessing around 5% of all AFL footballers would play 200 games. So that's a damn good pick.

EDIT oh here, I was close...



AFL is a tough racket. Less than a third of players get to 50 games.

 

[zippadeee]

They were pissed still celebrating the 17 flag. I couldn't believe we picked up another small.
When at that stage had George Rioli Bulter Lambert and Prestia in our best 22.

Tell me a long term recruiter with a perfect record ?, they all have hits and misses.

 

[Tortured Tiger]

Dud

Cost us Allen or Ryan or Taylor.
imagine Liam Ryan on the G..4 goals every week

I look forward to you putting your selections out for this draft so we can put them into a time capsule for 4 years and see how you go. We are all experts after the event.

 

[Blind Charlie]

Huge bust.
1st rounder playing at other club 2 years after drafting him is a bust.
Which ever way you look at it

Played good footy until brain surgery then continued to play good footy until traded for picks we've yet to even use !

Is it still a bust if we end up with 2 x AA players?

 

[tigertim]

I'm guessing around 5% of all AFL footballers would play 200 games. So that's a damn good pick.

EDIT oh here, I was close...

View attachment 13282

AFL is a tough racket. Less than a third of players get to 50 games.

And barring injury Bellis will play the 40 more games to get to 250 putting him in the 1.86% bracket (He’s on 210 with 3 more seasons to go in his GCS contract)

I wonder what the parameters were for the above table, every player ever drafted or every player to play at least one game.