Jay Schulz [Merged]

[Bill James]

He has had 2 years in the system, Sarge has had 5.

And yes I think Hughes is showing encouraging signs, where he is presenting, showing some strength in the packs when it hits the ground and taking contested marks.

 

[Tigers of Old]

He has had 2 years in the system, Sarge has had 5.

And yes I think Hughes is showing encouraging signs, where he is presenting, showing some strength in the packs when it hits the ground and taking contested marks.

I do think he has shown more improved commitment at the ball which is good but his goal & field kicking have gone backwards dramatically. :headscratch
I am not sure why that is but it's not a sign of improvement. Still after watching Travis Cloke kicking at goal this week, those kicking yips may not be unfixable with some confidence.
His movement appears more mechanical overall and he seems to have lost some pace this season, perhaps because he's bulked up too quickly?

Cleve doesn't look like he is going to be a champ anytime soon but I don't want appear hypocritical as I have supported Schulz's development for a long time when he's looked unlikely.
Hughes does need to be afforded games to improve as I've always argued these young key forwards do take time and sometimes players mature later than others.
Unfortunately at Richmond we need them right now in order to be competitive.
I hope Cleve makes it. We need him to.

 

[turk-d-tiger]

Hughes is 21 already, he was top aged when drafted. He is the same age as Buddy Franklin.
Do you think he's improving? It doesn't look like it to me.

yeah ok please point out any kpp under 22 that does match up to buddy...?
and out of the same draft which chf player is better than hughes so we can compare..?

 

[Mr Brightside]

In many different roles in 2 weeks,would think its Sarge's best 2 in a row at AFL level an must say I like the fact that it seemed Sarge thought bugger it Richo's going to crash into me anyway I may as well get the pill myself ;D

 

[CarnTheTiges]

I thought Sarge was our best player on Sunday. You have to admire the bloke's courage too. He takes a screamer in defence, knocks the wind out of himself, comes back on the forward line and goes at the ball with no regard for life and limb and takes another screamer, he was also our most effective forward with 3 goals. Of course this dual ability in defence and attack will reignite the debate about where he is best suited to play.

 

[the claw]

okay people its nearly seasons end and i thought i would bring up anothe another of the delist candidates who here thinks he should stay or go.
who thinks hes done enough to keep his spot who thinks hes done no more than in past yrs who thinks he has enough improvement in him to become a good consistent footballer. personally i think we need an upgrade but shulzys saving grace may be hes a rare commodity, that being a good sized kpp. if this is the only reason we keep him its the wrong reason.the other saving grace for him may be polaks injury again i think this a poor reason to hang onto him.

 

[IanG]

We can't afford to delist any KPPs.

 

[TigerMasochist]

okay people its nearly seasons end and i thought i would bring up anothe another of the delist candidates who here thinks he should stay or go.
who thinks hes done enough to keep his spot who thinks hes done no more than in past yrs who thinks he has enough improvement in him to become a good consistent footballer. personally i think we need an upgrade but shulzys saving grace may be hes a rare commodity, that being a good sized kpp. if this is the only reason we keep him its the wrong reason.the other saving grace for him may be polaks injury again i think this a poor reason to hang onto him.

Pretty much answered your own question Claw. Being a bit short of KPP and Polack getting injured means we will need to keep him for next year. He has played reasonably off the backline without excelling.
If there's a reasonable offer then consider it if not, he's not costing any kind of mega bucks so you just keep a big hard footsoldier.

 

[the claw]

We can't afford to delist any KPPs.

w2hat even duds. imo you dont keep duds under any circumstances.

 

[craig]

We can't afford to delist any KPPs.

The only reason is cos Wallet hasnt *smile* drafted any.

Pattison, McGuane, Schulz, should all be traded imo and replaced with dfair dinkum skilled KPP such as Lisle, Hurley, Trengrove, Post etc., guys with height, skill, and ability to fill specific roles.

Schulz is no more than a waste of a list spot after 6 years of nothing as will be Pattison when a second decent ruck arrives.

As for Hughes who knows and Polak well its highly likely he wont play AFL again.

Rance will be a better footballer long term than McGuane anyway.

Fair dinkum no wonder this club is mired in mediocrity when people think blokes like Schulz, Pattison, and McGuane etc are keepers.

Whats even sadder is that the coaching staff cant make a decision.

Wallet never rated Schulz in the media and said he wasnt up to it............ yet 4 years later with Schulz doing sweet fugg all he is still at the club.

Im tipping a lack of real action on the list at seasons end like the 05 draft which imo could culminate in a poorer 09 season as the club continues to retain mediocre near enuffds and not good enuffs for yet another year

 

[Tigers of Old]

Gun. ;D

Seriously, he has improved this year or you have the blinkers on.

 

[Scoop]

I'll say it again, *smile* is a solid B Grade KP. If at the start of the year you told me he was going to average 16 touches and 7 marks you would take it in a heartbeat. At times, dealt with very harshly by TW. If we kept this long, you wouldn't get rid of him after he has his best year.

 

[Tigermad2005]

No way should he go unless the dees are giving us pick 1

 

[linuscambridge]

We have been very patient with Kelvin Moore who is now rewarding us for our tolerance, and many on here forget that Jay is a year younger than Moore.

I would have no hesitation in saying Jay is playing much better at the same age than what Moore was, Moore showed us very little last year. If Jay continues to improve the way he has over the last 6 months and kicks on the way Moore has, we could have a very handy player on our hands.

No doubt he hasn't lived up to his high teens draft position and some early promise, but I think Jay is just starting to find his feet at AFL level. Plus he has a few rare attributes at the Tigers, he is over 190 cms tall, despite the occasional shank his kicking effeciency is very good, and he can break a pack and do some damage unlike "Clean Knees Cleve".

In addition he plays the packs like a rover at times, no other Tigers player over 6 foot 2 spends as much time on his knees at the bottom of packs, feeding out handballs to the outside mids, the way Schulz does.

I think he is a keeper.

 

[pahoffm]

Interesting write-up about Schultzy in this week's Pro-Stat newsletter.

He apparently achieved an extraordinary DT score as a result of the Tiger tactics last weekend.

 

[Knighter]

So what, I had the DT's all day Monday after the win.

 

[pahoffm]

So what, I had the DT's all day Monday after the win.

Nice one.

 

[TOT70]

Here's an interesting comparison with the current all-conquering Cats, at the beginning of the 2004 season, which became their breakout year. They had the following players on their list that year:

Paul Chapman: 22 at the time, 51 games in 4 seasons on an AFL list
Josh Hunt: 22, 15 games in 4 seasons
Cameron Mooney: 24, 61 games in 7 seasons on an AFL list
Jared (now Max) Rooke: 22, 33 games in 4 seasons on an AFL list
David Wojcinski: 23, 55 games in 5 seasons on an AFL list.

The Cats have been very patient with their players. Others like Matthew McCarthy, Paul Chambers, Matthew Spencer, Charlie Gardner, Henry Playfair, Tim Callan and Will Slade who didn't quite make it were all given five years plus.

It makes a mockery of this idea of giving players a couple of years and moving them on if they aren't potential All-Australians by then. Most of us would have found it hard to rate more than one or two players on that list in 2004. Patience has been rewarded.

 

[LachlanGrant]

Keep Schulz.
Small contract extension at a decent price.
Has been relatively injury free and has played some good games.

 

[the claw]

Here's an interesting comparison with the current all-conquering Cats, at the beginning of the 2004 season, which became their breakout year. They had the following players on their list that year:

Paul Chapman: 22 at the time, 51 games in 4 seasons on an AFL list
Josh Hunt: 22, 15 games in 4 seasons
Cameron Mooney: 24, 61 games in 7 seasons on an AFL list
Jared (now Max) Rooke: 22, 33 games in 4 seasons on an AFL list
David Wojcinski: 23, 55 games in 5 seasons on an AFL list.

The Cats have been very patient with their players. Others like Matthew McCarthy, Paul Chambers, Matthew Spencer, Charlie Gardner, Henry Playfair, Tim Callan and Will Slade who didn't quite make it were all given five years plus.

It makes a mockery of this idea of giving players a couple of years and moving them on if they aren't potential All-Australians by then. Most of us would have found it hard to rate more than one or two players on that list in 2004. Patience has been rewarded.

hmm nice spin on things there. for starters chalmers was rookied in 2002 and was traded in 2005 for a late second rounder i believe that would be after 3 yrs..
spencer was drafted 2003 and delisted 2007 4yrs.
gardner playfair and king were let go for no other reason other than salary cap pressure.
callan lasted 5 yrs but found it hard trying to break into the cats midfield injuries early on did not help.
callan like king gardner playfair are at other top 8 clubs
once again callan has injury problems but was good for the dogs before injury struck. to say these blokes have not made it is not quite right.
mccarthy lasted 4 yrs.

now the ones that are still there. paul chapman played 29 games in his first 4 yrs. he played 16 games in 2002 13 in 2003 and showed heaps, he then played 22 games in 2004. the thing with chapman is he steadily improved each yr regardless of games. schulz and many others on our list have not done this.

hunt debuted in 2001 playing 6 games played a futher 7 in 2002 and played just 2 games in 2003 due to a shin injury but again injury aside he showed improvement.

rooke was a rookie elevation in 2002.he played 15 games this yr a further 18 in 2003 again he showed steady improvement.

mooney came to geelong at the end of 99.he had been in the system a fair while and is one they showed a lot of patience with. was playing regular footy for them by 01 02 though.

wojinski debut 99 played 20 games to 01. played 17 in 02 and 18 in 03 and 21 in 04.he showed steady improvement.

i find it silly to be comparing any of these players to schulz. geelong have shown about 4 yrs is the norm for their players to establish themselves, of course there has been the odd exception to this. schulz made his debut in 2003 hes had 6 yrs with little steady improvement and still has not established himself on our list. if he was at geelong he would have been long gone.