Adem Yze

[Carter]

Absolute poppycock. You have no idea that he got tapped on the shoulder, you're speculating.
Baker was looking to go home a long time before the club knew it was rebuilding. I know that from a senior player. We were going to try make finals. It was only when the ass fell out of the season did we decide to do a "conventional rebuild". Rioli had met Dimma in April.
The club was not in control of the senior players wanting to go - theres a few opting out once we'd communicated the approach. It has changed tact quickly though, to maximise the opportunity.
This wasn't a mastermind approach from the club. This was akin to your big brother asking if you were interested in playing 52 pick-up.
We just slapped the cards out of his hand before he dropped them. It wasn't active, it was reactive. But Blair's done a few years of tap dancing training. Let's hope he doesn't slip.

Of course I’m speculating, what u blowing a gasket about?

By the way you’re wrong.

Bolton was targeted for trade not long after the club realised the true state of the list.

Rioli has been a domino we’d prefer to keep if I had to guess.

Don’t think we’re overly fussed about Baker considering what we need to bring in to get Yze started.

Anyone who thinks there’s been a rampant stampede is mistaken.

 

[Carter]

You are assuming so many things here.

1. That we get two top picks for Bolton
2. That if we do, we end up with two players who will play 200 games (involving good selecting, not being injury prone, no off field issues, the right desire and preparation, and developing well)
3. That the player(s) will offer more over 12 years than Bolton would over 6-7.

And my comment was about more than Bolton anyway, it's the combination of losing 4 premiership stars in the early to mid twenties.

Let's say we do the smart thing and pick Finn O'Sullivan with pick 1. Which will happen whether we trade anything or not.

Is he going to want to play in a side with a tier of premiership players above him?

Or is he going to want to clean up after Hopper for 6 years until he goes to play for Geelong?

There's the hope that that we manage to recruit enough good thing 18 yos with the draft haul that they form a winning nucleus and keep themselves together.

But that is no guarantee.

It is a risk. I don't know how you can, in any actual seriousness, suggest it's not.

But we're in it now. I'm going to hope it pays off. This trade and draft will be the most important in my time watching the Tigers.

And you are assuming the retention of Bolton will lead to superstar Bolton for the rest of his career.

Already showed signs of disinterest in a poor team in 2024.

Another general reason to trade players to keep the list refreshed and each campaign just slightly different.

Players should be hungry, not comfortable.

 

[Carter]

Bolton playing to his potential for the next 3-4 years is probably pointless anyway

Better to have two players coming into their prime at the end of that period.

 

[Sintiger]

I’m judging by player disharmony, results and statements he made. He said we were going to be a tough side to be beat , yet we were poorest defensive side in the competition. Standards were awful with one per centers, tackling and players weren’t dragged at times and even dropped. I’m judging him on getting the team on the one page first and seeing if there’s improvement. What we’ve seen so far is a pile of *smile* from this bloke and I want to see improvement and growth as team. This year it was all fragmented and same rubbish next year then questions need to be raised as we can’t have the same low standards.
Departures are excellent and Blake will be his mentor and hopefully he will develop as a senior coach as this year I saw him as a below mini assistant rather than a coach.

Opinions couched as statements.

What disharmony are you referring to? The unbelievable care that Sam Naismith talked about, or steely Green or Dylan Grimes? What about the support which Campbell Gray talked about when he got injured. There is heaps of evidence for a great culture still in he playing group.

You are connecting dots which don’t exist imo.

I don’t agree with you so let’s leave it there.

 

[TigerMasochist]

And my comment was about more than Bolton anyway, it's the combination of losing 4 premiership stars in the early to mid twenties.

Unfortunately, even with those 4 premiership stars playing most of the games this season, we still wound up with the good old splintery spoon driven home deep. So that kinda puts a fair dent in your argument to start with.
While there's never any guarantees to anything there's also a very strong form line that suggests under normal circumstances it's impossible to rebuild using just the normal drafting system of a couple of quality picks per year.
However there's an extremely strong likely hood that we've managed to fall into a perfect storm situation. Where there's reportedly an extremely deep and strong draft plus we have the opportunity through our players leaving of pillaging perhaps up to 3 years worth of quality juniors in one hit. A couple of years of development along with our current senior players and then we'll also have a situation where we will have also banked plenty of unused cap space and be in the perfect position to attack some premium free agents or simply trade for a couple of premium experienced players to drive an attack at finals again.

Right now I'd rather speculate n look toward the positives of what might be in 3 or 4 years time than sit n shuffle n hope n wonder why there doesn't appear to be anything happening beyond fading mediocrity.

 

[Tiggy Train]

Opinions couched as statements.

What disharmony are you referring to? The unbelievable care that Sam Naismith talked about, or steely Green or Dylan Grimes? What about the support which Campbell Gray talked about when he got injured. There is heaps of evidence for a great culture still in he playing group.

You are connecting dots which don’t exist imo.

I don’t agree with you so let’s leave it there.

And you’re refusing to believe reality. Naismith, Grimes lol , Green and Campbell Gray you’re clutching at straws. What are they supposed to say he’s a *smile* loser and should go back to Melbourne? FFS it’s not boys in a shelter shed stuff.
Try Rioli, Bolton and Baker. You honestly believe everyone was happy and onboard ? You’re creating your own five yo join the dot’s exercise. As I said Yze has a lot to prove and if he does that’s both of us happy, but he’s got a shitload of proving to do.
You are just guessing and are behind my rational thoughts.

 

[Sintiger]

And you’re refusing to believe reality. Naismith, Grimes lol , Green and Campbell Gray you’re clutching at straws. What are they supposed to say he’s a *smile* loser and should go back to Melbourne? FFS it’s not boys in a shelter shed stuff.
Try Rioli, Bolton and Baker. You honestly believe everyone was happy and onboard ? You’re creating your own five yo join the dot’s exercise. As I said Yze has a lot to prove and if he does that’s both of us happy, but he’s got a shitload of proving to do.
You are just guessing and are behind my rational thoughts.

It is really hard to have a logical discussion with you. Calm down, I just don’t agree with you.

 

[Tiggy Train]

It is really hard to have a logical discussion with you. Calm down, I just don’t agree with you.

Stop bringing up crap examples and enter the real world ST as not everything is as nice and cosy as you think. As for logic you defy that as you can’t see the massive faults this bloke has and I’m not saying he can’t improve them , but fmd he’s got a mountain to climb. You don’t have contracted players wanting to basically leave by April once they were all happy when EZy was first appointed. They were so happy with other senior players they had memorabilia removed then a few months later they wanted out. So why is the question? They loved him at the start and now they’re running to better pastures. Were you happy with our game plan? Do you think the team was playing 100% for him ? Do you think we were the well drilled team he promised us?
Any moron could’ve coached our team to two wins as a minimum with a list of 17 senior players. He showed no improvement, but I’m cutting him some slack bc of Meehan, but he’s on thin ice with me still until I see us improve as a team.

 

[Sintiger]

Stop bringing up crap examples and enter the real world ST as not everything is as nice and cosy as you think. As for logic you defy that as you can’t see the massive faults this bloke has and I’m not saying he can’t improve them , but fmd he’s got a mountain to climb. You don’t have contracted players wanting to basically leave by April once they were all happy when EZy was first appointed. They were so happy with other senior players they had memorabilia removed then a few months later they wanted out. So why is the question? They loved him at the start and now they’re running to better pastures. Were you happy with our game plan? Do you think the team was playing 100% for him ? Do you think we were the well drilled team he promised us?
Any moron could’ve coached our team to two wins as a minimum with a list of 17 senior players. He showed no improvement, but I’m cutting him some slack bc of Meehan, but he’s on thin ice with me still until I see us improve as a team.

I’ve read all this before. It’s the same stuff that has been posted over and over again, most of which I have commented on at the time.

 

[Tiggy Train]

I’ve read all this before. It’s the same stuff that has been posted over and over again, most of which I have commented on at the time.

Agree so we chill ST until we get more evidence forwarded to us in the season coming. We are both speculating from different corners and as I said I hope you’re right.

 

[Sintiger]

Agree so we chill ST until we get more evidence forwarded to us in the season coming. We are both speculating from different corners and as I said I hope you’re right.

You have an opinion and I have an opinion.

What’s that old saying about opinions and arseholes ?

 

[Tiggy Train]

You have an opinion and I have an opinion.

What’s that old saying about opinions and arseholes ?

Everybody has one, but some arseholes are bigger than others. Just like opinions can be.

 

[Number8]

An interesting mix of emotional and rational posts here.

No problems with being in either camp. It's just an observation.

Here's why I'm in the rational camp.

—Yze had no chance to implement his game plan given the lack of continuity with personnel
—Bolton and Rioli signed longterm contracts under vastly different circumstances: coach, vision, expectations
—Until I see different, I will take the club at face value that it will extract maximum value for all four want-aways
—Of the four want-aways, Graham and Baker should be no surprise given one was close to leaving previously and the other is out of contract and has made no secret of his ties to his home state
—Bolton just doesn't look like he is willing or able to carry others on his shoulders and, as such, isn't going to be the big loss he would seem to be
—Half a dozen first-round draftees gives Yze the chance to mould the team in his vision, without the baggage of players who, for whatever reason, are not on the same page
—Without the retirees and the want-aways, the list, as it stands, is not capable of executing a skills or decision-based game plan; the result of middling draft picks thanks to sustained success
—My guess is that Yze 'gifted' players games to really find out where they were at ... could they follow instructions, execute certain skills, buy-in to a new game plan?
—With years of compromised drafts ahead, thanks to the Tassie club, this the right time to cash in on what is being described as a generational draft
—No shade on the likes of Cumberland, Ryan, Sonsie and Dow, but they are on our list because they were the best we could do with the draft hands we had ... we can and will do better over the next 2–3 drafts.

Final thing: I'm lucky enough to be at peace with this past season. We filled our boots and it was great while it lasted. Sustained success, of the type Sydney and Geelong could only dream (i.e., multiple premierships and years of absolute dominance) comes with a spectacular price.

I'm excited by what the next chapter brings.

 

[ToraToraTora]

This thread is still as *smile* as it was a week ago.

 

[DavidSSS]

An interesting mix of emotional and rational posts here.

No problems with being in either camp. It's just an observation.

Here's why I'm in the rational camp.

—Yze had no chance to implement his game plan given the lack of continuity with personnel
—Bolton and Rioli signed longterm contracts under vastly different circumstances: coach, vision, expectations
—Until I see different, I will take the club at face value that it will extract maximum value for all four want-aways
—Of the four want-aways, Graham and Baker should be no surprise given one was close to leaving previously and the other is out of contract and has made no secret of his ties to his home state
—Bolton just doesn't look like he is willing or able to carry others on his shoulders and, as such, isn't going to be the big loss he would seem to be
—Half a dozen first-round draftees gives Yze the chance to mould the team in his vision, without the baggage of players who, for whatever reason, are not on the same page
—Without the retirees and the want-aways, the list, as it stands, is not capable of executing a skills or decision-based game plan; the result of middling draft picks thanks to sustained success
—My guess is that Yze 'gifted' players games to really find out where they were at ... could they follow instructions, execute certain skills, buy-in to a new game plan?
—With years of compromised drafts ahead, thanks to the Tassie club, this the right time to cash in on what is being described as a generational draft
—No shade on the likes of Cumberland, Ryan, Sonsie and Dow, but they are on our list because they were the best we could do with the draft hands we had ... we can and will do better over the next 2–3 drafts.

Final thing: I'm lucky enough to be at peace with this past season. We filled our boots and it was great while it lasted. Sustained success, of the type Sydney and Geelong could only dream (i.e., multiple premierships and years of absolute dominance) comes with a spectacular price.

I'm excited by what the next chapter brings.

Well put.

I also think Bolton is unlikely to perform well in a team which is uncompetitive. He is the sort of player who can weave magic at times, but he needs other players around him who will do the defensive work and create the pressure so he can perform. On that basis, I agree, he won't be a huge loss.

DS

 

[TT33]

Well put.

I also think Bolton is unlikely to perform well in a team which is uncompetitive. He is the sort of player who can weave magic at times, but he needs other players around him who will do the defensive work and create the pressure so he can perform. On that basis, I agree, he won't be a huge loss.

DS

Lets not kid ourselves, Bolton will be a huge loss. But it's a loss that we'll have to bear to enable us to rebuild for the future.
We should get 2 early draft picks for him. I'll rephrase that, we MUST get 2 early picks for him. Whoever we pick won't be as good initially, but may become so. Only time will tell.

Interesting times ahead.

 

[TheCan]

This is wrong too. We had a choice and we tapped Bolton on the shoulder. From that moment the path was set.

We chose to be a club on the hunt, actively providing Yze with a clean slate and a host of top end talent to develop.

The alternative was to keep the status quo, keep our marquee player, keep Rioli happy and convince Baker to stay.

That’s the long road. That’s a decade of misery.

100% agree and well said.

 

[JoeGee]

Lets not kid ourselves, Bolton will be a huge loss. But it's a loss that we'll have to bear to enable us to rebuild for the future.
We should get 2 early draft picks for him. I'll rephrase that, we MUST get 2 early picks for him. Whoever we pick won't be as good initially, but may become so. Only time will tell.

Interesting times ahead.

A huge loss? I disagree.

Maybe a noticeable loss of structure next year. But that's about it. Particularly if we have an injury free Lynch and Lefau continues his trajectory. Bauer now hitting stride and hopefully a good full preseason into him and Gibcus.

Very different look next year. Shai will be a huge loss if our entire forward line falls apart again, but otherwise he lacks the on-field ability to turn a game on its head like many other players getting paid similar amounts can.

 

[Mr Brightside]

I thought the same as what Benny has come out and said that the Ozzzze sat back and observed this year , slate is clean for me hearing that from the Cheif .

I’m putting my Mr B jester hat and saying will see plenty to like by this time next year

 

[French Tiger]

No Yze no Melbourne

One way to look at it ha ha