OK just semantics then. I read your post/commentary as an action (therefore tanking) vs something passive. e,g. "We need to (actively) bottom out" vs "If we (naturally) bottomed out it would help in the long run"
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You need top 5 ND picks to win flags!!!
- Thread starter Carter
- Start date
Yes the thread title could be construed as an action for sure, but yeah I meant a passive process we shouldn’t see as the end of the world
Adelaide haven’t played finals since 2017. Carlton since 2013. North since 2016, Hawthorn since 2018. Essendon last won a final 6 prime ministers ago. GCS have never played finals despite having more first round picks than just about any other club in that period. Fremantle went 7 years between finals appearances. Melbourne were a success after 16 years and an AFL HQ helping hand later.
Of course a rebuild doesn’t have to be that dire, it just usually is though.
ATM we're fielding three top five picks in Chimpah, Taranto and Martin. Prestia and Lynch top tenners. Hopper. Vlastuin. Daniel Rioli and Jack outside the ten. Shai the draft miracle.
If they were on the park fresh and sound that would be enough top end. As at R6 2023 most are close to retirement and not one of them is in form, fresh and sound. Jack is fresh and in form, to be fair. But he can't walk.
For 2023 that's the key. Next year the ducks are even less likely to line up. That's not to say that new talent can't emerge in that time.
Our near spoon year will come when the old boys fall off the football perch and we get a few injuries as well. That's the bottom out year. We had an unlucky year like that in 2021.
That's how we'll bottom out.
Not to say we have to turn into West Coast Spoonlovers. We are trying to avoid that by refreshing the top end talent through trades and RFA. Let's see how that pans out.
If they were on the park fresh and sound that would be enough top end. As at R6 2023 most are close to retirement and not one of them is in form, fresh and sound. Jack is fresh and in form, to be fair. But he can't walk.
For 2023 that's the key. Next year the ducks are even less likely to line up. That's not to say that new talent can't emerge in that time.
Our near spoon year will come when the old boys fall off the football perch and we get a few injuries as well. That's the bottom out year. We had an unlucky year like that in 2021.
That's how we'll bottom out.
Not to say we have to turn into West Coast Spoonlovers. We are trying to avoid that by refreshing the top end talent through trades and RFA. Let's see how that pans out.
You don't need top-five picks once you are good. We are still middling, with the injuries we actually don't know how good we are. But you do need to pull a few draft picks of higher talent at lower picks. We got Shai. Steal. We have Sonsie, a possible steal. We have Gibcus, looks to be sound for a top 10. And I hate to say it this week but if we take Van Rooyen, and get that pick right then the list looks 1000 times better. Along with Gibcus we'd have bookends. Good young bookends with the GWS lads in the middle. The kerfuffle about the trade would be gone if we had bookends locked away. We need to pluck one this year as well. It's a big draft for our future. Get it right and we stop the slide, get another draft wrong and it will take much longer to come back. We are looking at the cliff, not over it, not even toes over the edge but we are walking slowly but surely. Must stop it.
Agree with this Re Van Rooyen. He was an obvious choice at that pick, especially as both Chol and CCJ moved on during that trade period. Two young talls to replace two young talls with question marks.
Brown dies not appear to be anything special. A role player at best.
Well dare I say it , I reckon pies are red hot favs , they have one top end pic , admittedly he’s that good he’s worth 4 ,However their list management contradicts the premise of this thread . They turned over players and peanuts in return making shrewd choices with the selections at hand , also done very well with mid season pics, noble Johnson and Carmichael So I’ll go with coll approach over NM and blues stockpile of top end pics , it’s boloney that’s what you need for a flag
I think top 5 picks usually give you a better chance of landing a generational player. Outside those picks the odds are too high. Can be done but apart from Hird cant remember another. While i dont think you need them to win a flag, i do think you need them to build a dynasty.
I would start with a Richmond football Academy.
It would be nice if we could hide kids in a Academy like Footscary Sydney Brisbane and Collingwood do
I get the logic here.
But I'm not sure I agree with it.
I think this thinking is retrospective.
It may be true that we don't win the three flags without Martin and Cotchin. But it's also true we don't win them without Jack, or Grimes, or Nankervis. Players outside the top ten, taken in the PSD or traded in.
Then there's players who were high draft picks, but traded in like Prestia. Caddy. TJ Lynch. Critical.
But even though we don't win our flags without our rookie and psd picks, you wouldn't necessarily say that you NEED rookie and psd picks to win flags.
The reality is, whenever a side wins a flag it has champion players. Some of which are top 3 picks, some of which are taken in the teens, some traded in, some rookies and some free agents. As all clubs have some high end talent, all premiership teams will have some high end talent critical to their success.
I am also dubious that if we were to bottom out this year and next, the couple of top 5 picks we have would be any better than players like Bolton, Baker, Balta or even Sonsie. They might be. But would it drastically change our ability to win a premiership? Possibly. Not necessarily. We have just traded in two top ten draft picks. Do we really need to bottom out to rebuild and go again?
I don't think so.
I don't think anything I've seen in this thread has any evidence to suggest that we do.
I think in the end, I don't really understand the contention of this thread. Apparently it's not that we should try to bottom out, but that we need to, but we shouldn't do it on purpose. But we need to. But it needs to happen by accident.
I guess you could take this thread as 'if we do happen to bottom out, we might pick up some draft picks, which have a better chance of being A grade, which could make us a better side when we try to win a flag. So that's a bright side to being crap.'
And if that's the point then... Yeah. I guess.
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Didn't we just get two high picks in over summer? Plus a group of five early picks the summer before. Pretty sure Lynchman, Prestygiocomo n Caddy were also high draft picks that we brought into the club not so long ago.
Lots of ways of getting high draft picks into the club n some don't even involve bottoming out or even tanking.
Yes and no.
There’s Taranto, who I rate highly, don’t get me wrong.
Then there’s Cotchin.
So you gotta get them right, which kinda defeats my argument a bit, but this is where you store faith in your recruiting staff.
This is true unless your Geesook. In their case you just need a corrupt AFL head of footy that makes sure your bogey team is taken out, a massive home ground advantage, a gun recruiter and special jungle juice to keep all their geriatrics on the park and performing.
Coburg, you ignore the simple, pure truth of my analysis - that premiership sides are invariably stocked with top five talent, even the teams that are seen as perennial top ups (Geelong)
No amount of logging off to read my posts, then logging on again to reply, will change that fact, lol.
And as Jack Ross’s champion you are a horrible judge of talent and I am glad I do not consume your content on here very often. Maybe stick to teaching?
No amount of logging off to read my posts, then logging on again to reply, will change that fact, lol.
And as Jack Ross’s champion you are a horrible judge of talent and I am glad I do not consume your content on here very often. Maybe stick to teaching?
