Welcome to Tigers: Jason Castagna

[bullus_hit]

Correct.

Correct.

We get the drift Leysy, George cannot be compared to anyone (apart from Lambert strangely enough). Would it be permissible to compare Castagna with Castagna, pre-bye versus post-bye? Think you've been caught in a timewarp with a tendency for flashbacks ol' fella.

 

[MD Jazz]

So he doesn't need to take marks (even though he's supposedly great in the air) & he doesn't need to kick goals even though he can't cut it in the midfield? Once again we slowly descend into farce with the Teflon George retorts. Blind Freddy can see he's in a form rut, confidence is shot & every time he misses a goal it halts the team's momentum. We effectively lost the GWS match because of Castagna, his out on the full against Geelong also set off the Cats revival. It's all good and well to say he's there for pressure but bear in mind every shank on goal hands the ball back to the opposition.

As for the Higlet comparisons, I think you'll find he has Castagna well & truly covered. Not sure where you get the idea Higgins is inferior once the ball hits the ground, contested possessions 7.4 vs 4.4, clearances 1.8 vs 0.4, this despite the fact that George has had 83% TOG compared to Higlet's 73%. With all the time Higgins has spent in the middle he's still managed to have scoreboard impact, 16 goals & 89 score involvements is super impressive, Castagna's figures only fractionally better despite the extra forward minutes (23 & 96).

Higlet is playing more midfield, of course contested numbers will be up. Compare George with other forwards. How do those numbers look?

Agree George is in a bit of a rut, but I don't think the choice will be between George and Dan for a spot. I think Butler will definitely come back in and think it would be Ellis or Kmac that is dropped.

Good problem to have.

 

[tigertim]

So he doesn't need to take marks (even though he's supposedly great in the air) & he doesn't need to kick goals even though he can't cut it in the midfield? Once again we slowly descend into farce with the Teflon George retorts. Blind Freddy can see he's in a form rut, confidence is shot & every time he misses a goal it halts the team's momentum. We effectively lost the GWS match because of Castagna, his out on the full against Geelong also set off the Cats revival. It's all good and well to say he's there for pressure but bear in mind every shank on goal hands the ball back to the opposition.

As for the Higlet comparisons, I think you'll find he has Castagna well & truly covered. Not sure where you get the idea Higgins is inferior once the ball hits the ground, contested possessions 7.4 vs 4.4, clearances 1.8 vs 0.4, this despite the fact that George has had 83% TOG compared to Higlet's 73%. With all the time Higgins has spent in the middle he's still managed to have scoreboard impact, 16 goals & 89 score involvements is super impressive, Castagna's figures only fractionally better despite the extra forward minutes (23 & 96).

So for the sake of 12 contested marks in 18 games, just how much more does Castagna provide to the team? To put that in perspective Higlet has 6 so statistically that's a net benefit of one extra mark every 3 games. Time to get those rose coloured glasses off & instead focus on where George needs to improve. If he reverts back to his early season form doubt you'll get one complainant on this here board.

Just 2 contested marks from his last 7 games.

 

[Harry]

Ignore this week. It was the jack show up forward. There was minimal contest and chaos up there. Also some are confusing being good in the air with contested marking. No one said george was a good contested mark.

 

[tigerlove]

Higlet is playing more midfield, of course contested numbers will be up. Compare George with other forwards. How do those numbers look?

Pretty bad. He's had just 2 and 3 efficient disposals in his last 2 games. Just 2 marks inside 50 in his last 2 games. He just isn't playing well. Supercoach gives you a rough idea how well a player is going. Early in the season he had scores of 97,98,115,94 in 4 of his first 5 games. He's had 46,24,41 and 20 in 4 of his last 5 games. Clearly out of form, needs to step it up. More concerning is his low pressure act count. That's one of his most important assets.

 

[bullus_hit]

Higlet is playing more midfield, of course contested numbers will be up. Compare George with other forwards. How do those numbers look?

Agree George is in a bit of a rut, but I don't think the choice will be between George and Dan for a spot. I think Butler will definitely come back in and think it would be Ellis or Kmac that is dropped.

Good problem to have.

Think you're missing the point, the contention was that Castagna is better at ground level which doesn't stack up with reality, Higgins has had 21 stoppage clearances to Castagna's 5 (this stat excludes time in centre square). The fact he has had similar score involvements & only 7 fewer goals shows the added value he brings to the team. Tackles inside 50 also comparable, so pressure not in question.

But as far as the AFL benchmark is concerned, a fit Toby Greene would enter the conversation, Robbie Gray provided his forward split was favourable, a reinvented Luke Parker perhaps, Luke Breust another who offers infinitely more. These blokes kick double the goals, take just as many contested marks & get their hands on the ball twice as much. Does Castagna have the arsenal to reach these heights? I have my doubts but I'd like to see him at least replicate the form he showed in the opening half dozen matches. That was perfectly acceptable for a potential premiership player.

Just 2 contested marks from his last 7 games.

The extent to which he's fallen off the perch is troubling. 2 contested marks, 4 goals 9 behinds & a few out of bounds on the full, only 4 goal assists. The myth that he's a CHF surely needs reassessment.

Ignore this week. It was the jack show up forward. There was minimal contest and chaos up there. Also some are confusing being good in the air with contested marking. No one said george was a good contested mark.

Please don't bring up the halving of the contest line, that's lame. Hanley repeatedly ran off George as have a few others over the course of the season. The notion that he's playing on Michael Hurley or Jeremy McGovern is more mythical revisionism.

 

[TigerMasochist]

Shorty got ditched from the side a few weeks out from finals last year because his form tapered badly. Georgie would be in exactly the same boat at the moment if Geezer wasn't out injured. Love the pace, harassment n chaos that the three amigos bring to our forward half when they're all involved in the game. Strong possibility that if Georgie doesn't pull the finger out n provide a bit more real soon, then he'll lose his spot to Geezer when he gets fit or perhaps someone else will be flung a Hail Mary opportunity.
On current form I can't see any of Higlet, KMac or BEllis being dropped to keep a spot open for Georgie if Geezer gets back. There's far too many mid forward rotations available to us at the moment to waste time n energy carrying a player who's out of form when finals arrive.
Might be harsh but it's looking like it'll be Geezer or Georgie if a decision needs to be made. Still two weeks to go but form n fitness will be imperative.

 

[craig]

Think you're missing the point, the contention was that Castagna is better at ground level which doesn't stack up with reality, Higgins has had 21 stoppage clearances to Castagna's 5 (this stat excludes time in centre square). The fact he has had similar score involvements & only 7 fewer goals shows the added value he brings to the team. Tackles inside 50 also comparable, so pressure not in question.

But as far as the AFL benchmark is concerned, a fit Toby Greene would enter the conversation, Robbie Gray provided his forward split was favourable, a reinvented Luke Parker perhaps, Luke Breust another who offers infinitely more. These blokes kick double the goals, take just as many contested marks & get their hands on the ball twice as much. Does Castagna have the arsenal to reach these heights? I have my doubts but I'd like to see him at least replicate the form he showed in the opening half dozen matches. That was perfectly acceptable for a potential premiership player.

The extent to which he's fallen off the perch is troubling. 2 contested marks, 4 goals 9 behinds & a few out of bounds on the full, only 4 goal assists. The myth that he's a CHF surely needs reassessment.

Please don't bring up the halving of the contest line, that's lame. Hanley repeatedly ran off George as have a few others over the course of the season. The notion that he's playing on Michael Hurley or Jeremy McGovern is more mythical revisionism.

Breust is a bloody good player, and amazing finisher as is Gunston.

These two are the key to the Hawks scoring ability.

 

[MD Jazz]

Think you're missing the point, the contention was that Castagna is better at ground level which doesn't stack up with reality, Higgins has had 21 stoppage clearances to Castagna's 5 (this stat excludes time in centre square). The fact he has had similar score involvements & only 7 fewer goals shows the added value he brings to the team. Tackles inside 50 also comparable, so pressure not in question.

But as far as the AFL benchmark is concerned, a fit Toby Greene would enter the conversation, Robbie Gray provided his forward split was favourable, a reinvented Luke Parker perhaps, Luke Breust another who offers infinitely more. These blokes kick double the goals, take just as many contested marks & get their hands on the ball twice as much. Does Castagna have the arsenal to reach these heights? I have my doubts but I'd like to see him at least replicate the form he showed in the opening half dozen matches. That was perfectly acceptable for a potential premiership player.

The extent to which he's fallen off the perch is troubling. 2 contested marks, 4 goals 9 behinds & a few out of bounds on the full, only 4 goal assists. The myth that he's a CHF surely needs reassessment.

Please don't bring up the halving of the contest line, that's lame. Hanley repeatedly ran off George as have a few others over the course of the season. The notion that he's playing on Michael Hurley or Jeremy McGovern is more mythical revisionism.

Higlet is a pure footballer, george isn't. He'll never have higlets smarts.

Toby Greene is the premier HFF in the comp. He's an AA.

The other guys you mentioned play too much midfield or up the ground to allow a proper comparison.

Yep, george is clearly out of touch, but on his early season form is a very good footballer. Hopefully he recaptures it. If he plays poorly in the last 2 weeks his place will definitely be in jeopardy.

 

[bullus_hit]

Higlet is a pure footballer, george isn't. He'll never have higlets smarts.

Toby Greene is the premier HFF in the comp. He's an AA.

The other guys you mentioned play too much midfield or up the ground to allow a proper comparison.

Yep, george is clearly out of touch, but on his early season form is a very good footballer. Hopefully he recaptures it. If he plays poorly in the last 2 weeks his place will definitely be in jeopardy.

This is more a comment about skill sets & flexibility. Would I take Gray's 34 goals & 21 possessions? Absolutely. Ditto a player like Michael Walters who also has 23 goals but provides 322 metres gained every match. Jade Gresham another who would walk into our side, 34 goals & 17 touches definitely a value added swap. The fact that George has an extra 5 contested marks for the season is a bit of a red herring IMO, have said as much throughout the course of this thread.

Do I believe Castagna can turn things around? I certainly hope so but he's a confidence player & restoring the swagger is easier said than done. What I don't want is taking a bloke into a final with a sub-standard conversion rate, over the past 7 weeks he's firing at roughly 25% if one takes into account the shots out of bounds on the full. That can be demoralising. Contrary to what many in the media believe, we will cop a firm test in the qualifying final, a few cracks started to appear against Geelong & to be fair, if it wasn't for an Ablett shank we would have dropped the 4 points. In all likelihood it will be the Hawks, Collingwood or Sydney, there's enough talent in those sides to capitalise on anything less than 100%.

 

[Baron Samedi]

This is more a comment about skill sets & flexibility. Would I take Gray's 34 goals & 21 possessions? Absolutely. Ditto a player like Michael Walters who also has 23 goals but provides 322 metres gained every match. Jade Gresham another who would walk into our side, 34 goals & 17 touches definitely a value added swap. The fact that George has an extra 5 contested marks for the season is a bit of a red herring IMO, have said as much throughout the course of this thread.

Do I believe Castagna can turn things around? I certainly hope so but he's a confidence player & restoring the swagger is easier said than done. What I don't want is taking a bloke into a final with a sub-standard conversion rate, over the past 7 weeks he's firing at roughly 25% if one takes into account the shots out of bounds on the full. That can be demoralising. Contrary to what many in the media believe, we will cop a firm test in the qualifying final, a few cracks started to appear against Geelong & to be fair, if it wasn't for an Ablett shank we would have dropped the 4 points. In all likelihood it will be the Hawks, Collingwood or Sydney, there's enough talent in those sides to capitalise on anything less than 100%.

No, we left at least eight goals on the table against Geelong and have regained four premiership players since.

The only QF opponent I would be half-worried about is GWS. And with Heath Shaw down, all the more reason to exploit them with pace and chaos in F50.

Unless George has two absolute stinkers, he stays. Thankfully the selection committee seems to feel the same way.

 

[bullus_hit]

No, we left at least eight goals on the table against Geelong and have regained four premiership players since.

The only QF opponent I would be half-worried about is GWS. And with Heath Shaw down, all the more reason to exploit them with pace and chaos in F50.

Unless George has two absolute stinkers, he stays. Thankfully the selection committee seems to feel the same way.

I reckon GWS finishes 3rd, although a lot will depend on their match with Sydney. The Hawks have one of the best finals records out there, everything changes in September & Clarkson is a shrewd tactician. In no way would I be taking that game lightly. Sydney have Buddy & Rance is out of form, that match-up will be key to our chances. Collingwood I'm less concerned about but they did play well for 3 quarters. We probably lose a little bit of home ground advantage as well. One things for certain, we need to go into the finals completely switched on, history tells you finishing 1st guarantees nothing come September.

 

[Baron Samedi]

I reckon GWS finishes 3rd, although a lot will depend on their match with Sydney. The Hawks have one of the best finals records out there, everything changes in September & Clarkson is a shrewd tactician. In no way would I be taking that game lightly. Sydney have Buddy & Rance is out of form, that match-up will be key to our chances. Collingwood I'm less concerned about but they did play well for 3 quarters. We probably lose a little bit of home ground advantage as well. One things for certain, we need to go into the finals completely switched on, history tells you finishing 1st guarantees nothing come September.

I’ve been a critic of Hardwick in the past, but these days I gotta say that he is superb at establishing a modest, humble mindset.

I believe this is crucial in fostering continued success. We probably haven’t had a better man manager since Hafey.

 

[Tigers of Old]

The Butler ankle will see him retained.

 

[22nd Man]

Becoming increasingly irrelevant.

 

[TigerForce]

Becoming increasingly irrelevant.

Yep. Just doesn't do enough. Missing in attack too many times we go forward.

 

[jb03]

Should be a good thread over the next 48 hours

 

[Harry]

I'm not sure whether the anti-George crew actually watch the game. Georges spot in the side is safe.

 

[St Kevin]

Played injured.

 

[evo]

I'm not an ant-Georger by any means but thought he was poor again tonight.