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IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
Thoroughbred racing
- Thread starter DragicevicFan
- Start date
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Wouldn't have won anyway Scoop I don't think hence no protest, Jockey on the winner will get a few weeks.
The Cat was woeful today. Like All Silent in the Emirates, Gyps has me worried about Sea Battle's weight. Reckon Vaedictum may run an improved race today, throw in Sniper's and Mimi for some trifecta action. Interested to see how Bank Robber goes.
SCOOP said:
Wouldn't have won anyway Scoop I don't think hence no protest, Jockey on the winner will get a few weeks.
The Cat was woeful today. Like All Silent in the Emirates, Gyps has me worried about Sea Battle's weight. Reckon Vaedictum may run an improved race today, throw in Sniper's and Mimi for some trifecta action. Interested to see how Bank Robber goes.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
No reason for leysy to jump off Sea Battle now. Been so good to him.
Out to $8 on betfair. Good price.
Win savers on Snipers Bullet $12 & Orange County $23.
No reason for leysy to jump off Sea Battle now. Been so good to him.
Out to $8 on betfair. Good price.
Win savers on Snipers Bullet $12 & Orange County $23.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Yeah, it smashed em'. Sea Battle ran another great race.
Leysy learnt long ago to barely have a bet on cup & Oaks day. Possibly the hardest days racing of the year.
Backed Road to Rock earlier so holding head above water.
Going to stick with another old leysy favourite Baughurst in Race 8. The honest Light Vision obviously hardest to beat.
jb03 said:
Yeah, it smashed em'. Sea Battle ran another great race.
Leysy learnt long ago to barely have a bet on cup & Oaks day. Possibly the hardest days racing of the year.
Backed Road to Rock earlier so holding head above water.
Going to stick with another old leysy favourite Baughurst in Race 8. The honest Light Vision obviously hardest to beat.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Yeah quaddie was bad, bit disappointed there. Still made money (not much) by boxing 5 up in the tri. Lucky I wasn't pig headed enough to leave the fav out all together. Apparently it blew right out.
Good days racing today. Even Gauci rode a winner.
Leysy Days said:
Yeah quaddie was bad, bit disappointed there. Still made money (not much) by boxing 5 up in the tri. Lucky I wasn't pig headed enough to leave the fav out all together. Apparently it blew right out.
Good days racing today. Even Gauci rode a winner.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Well, the spring is over and it was by no means unforgettable. Watsisface won the CC, the handy Kyneton Cup prospect won the Cox Plate, beating the legendary Zipping, the bastard got beat in the Derby and the filly failed to stay in the Oaks and won by four.
The Huss was set an historic mission for the spring and came up 100 years short. Pretty much every trainer in the country proved that he is not fit to be mentioned in the same breath as the Socratres of the turf, Bart and the riding was as bad as I have ever seen.
And to cap it off Greg Eurell produced the true glamour horse of Australian racing, The Cat, half right at his longest primo trip and trained him into seventh in disgraceful company. Lucky So Crates Cummings was there to clean up.
So what was good? So Crates, of course. You may be reading this post at fifteen years of age. Maybe you're eighty. Irregardless, or disrespective of your age I can promise you this: you have never and will never see a better representative of Australian racing than Bart Cummings.
It's not fair to compare Moody or Danny O'Brien or that specialist in soft ons - Mick Price - to Bart. Because they suffer from incurable mediocrity. It's not a topic we come across with Bart.
Viewed missed a run in his lead up. Before the CC an interviewer (I forget the name) suggested to Bart that it would be a fine training effort to get Viewed over the line in the CC given the run he missed. Bart had a snort and the fired back with an introspective "It certainly would". What he didn't say was "Particularly given that he is stone dead."
Exactly how many Caulfield Cups has Bart trained? Who gives a *smile*? Certainly not Bart. How many years is it since the Monkey slaughtered Rogan Josh at 40s in the CC? (Oh, the pain.) And retained the ride.
The Melbourne Cup of 2008 will be a matter of consideration for form students for some months. But this much we know: if not for Blake Shinn's filthy ride Viewed wins by four. Gauci and Newitt will laugh for decades about how early he went. His missus cries over the same.
And today there was a touching scene with Anthony going berserk over running second behind the old man in the G1 Whatever Stakes. Bart barely choked out a chuckle. BTW in the movie of Bart's life Rodney Dangerfield will play Anthony.
After the MC some talking head fired off a "So what a way to cap off Viewed's career, Bart." and So Crates cut up a bit rough and said something like "You haven't seen the last of Viewed." Were you listening?
But when we're talking about kings, not just any king, but the brightest star in a century we have to look at fools. Enter Aidan O'Brien.
First up let's acknowledge that it was such a weak year that the pom (this decade's Beekeeper) ran second, albeit with the race put on for him (just like Beekeeper). If poms are in the finish it's a very weak year because poms are just no good at anything. Okay. Some may think it's unfair to make an assertion like that without backing it up so here goes:
Axiom of racing #0136- Poms are no good at anything.
I hope that clears that up.
So we've proven beyond doubt that it was a weak cup (as usual the Melbourne Cup was the clear highlight of the spring, even a weak one). And then we get to Aidan O'Brien's strong suit: he knew that.
But then it gets very funny. First the stable backs the various cripples he's brought off the planet. Turns out Mr O'Brien has a plan.
He has in his care a few horses that have never been in a horse race. Sure, they've regularly taken part in the British Saturday tradition in which five mongrels take ten minutes to parade around a track over 4000 yards. But racing? Nup. Never done it.
These equine legends, according to the master plan of Mr O'Brien, are going to set a sizzling speed over the longest mile and a half in the world. The stewards got involved, redefining redundancy and what happened next is legend, only a few days after it took place.
Mr Aidan O'Brien's horses (remember they've never actually been in a horse race before) are set the task of schooling Australian horses in pace. OMG. So they cut the first 1000m of a Melbourne Cup in under a minute. Three of them. And I hear that they ran the first ten furlongs in under two. Well, given that they've never run within 200m of that time in their lives it surprised no one that they got just a little tired and but for the retired pony (Gallopin) filled the reverse trifecta.
Afterwards it was all about the teddibly hahd track. Nuffers are nuffers, hard track or no. Mr Aidan O'Brien set a new benchmark for stupidity in world racing with his efforts in the 2008 MC. Let us never forget it.
If there was a simple lesson that Mr O'Brien could take from this campaign it is that he's here to learn, not to teach. The fact is that this Olympic idiot is still not sufficiently exposed by comparison to Bart. Most look like idiots compared to JBC. Let's establish a heirarchy.
I often refer to stupid racing people as carnies. And sure, I'm the first to admit that I'm a little too slow to break out the poison pen. But there are plenty dumber than carnies. Take Luca Cumani. He's an Upper Class Twit. His daughter may be attractive for a racing commentator. But she's less attractive than a supermodel and knows less about racing. Each of them has the rare talent of being able to run over themselves. UCTs.
A secret for you - at the Royal Melbourne Show there is a large tent (I cannot divulge it’s name but I’ve been there) where carnies bring in dodgem cars and try to run over themselves to prove that they’re upper class twits (that’s the thing about carnies, they’re always trying to improve themselves). But none has ever been able to do the dodgem suicide, proving for now that they’re not as stupid as Luca Cumani.
But Luca Cumani has a rare gift – he knows how dumb he is. And we can all be thankful that he survived his first glorious attempt to drive the red Fiasco over his own throat (a miracle). He can learn. So he gets Australian riders to battle on Australian turf. All he needs now is to get an Australian trainer to train them and he’s over the line.
And he knows the rule (he didn’t divine it – he was told): The Melbourne Cup is the longest mile and a half in the world. So that's the type he brings. Except for Mad Rush a ten furlong battler.
We all know that carnies only survive by stripping upper class twits. There's no doubt about who is the boss is the relationship. But Luca Cumani proved, giving hope to UCTs all over the world, that one day, maybe UCTs can fight back, can get almost square with the odd, *smile* carnie.
So we have three examples from the spring, a heirarchy of smart/stupid - the legend, Bart, the improving sub-carnie, Luca Cumani, and the immortal imbecile Aidan O’Brien. I s'pose it's a bit of a lopsided spectrum but who wants to think about the middle ground?
Speaking of which, what about us?
At Flemington this year we had… thirty-nine races. All bar one was put on for the leader. Most were run at a farcical tempo (despite turf genius, Greg Miles’s proclamations about the strength of the tempo, FFS). Only one was run at a fast clip and that was the Melbourne Cup. And that was thanks to the stupidity of Aidan O’Brien. Oh, the irony. Maybe he did teach us.
Aidan only stayed as stupid as he did because he can’t learn. Even UCTs like Luca Cumani can. So why can’t we? Do we want to appear on the idiot radar next to AO’B? That’s pretty ambitious.
Why were the races all run at such embarrassing rates? There are two reasons. The less important is that the stupid riders are not as stupid as they used to be. You just don’t get the half dozen total imbeciles cutting each other to ribbons over the first 600m like you used to.
The main reason is the compression of weights. If your mount is getting nine kegs from the good horse you want to make them carry it. So you put the speed on. This is an extension of ancient axiom of racing #0003: Back topweights in welters. FXS every race is at least a Corinthian these days.
When Tuesday Joy or Forensics is carrying the same weight as the bush mare down the bottom how can the rider of the weaker horse advantage himself by putting the speed on? He has to slow the speed to give himself a faint hope of stealing a minor placing.
This is an obvious problem and we let it happen because we are idiots. (By ‘we’ I mean the VRC, or Whoever.) The question for us now is what kind of idiot do we want to be – the kind who learns, like Luca Cumani, or the kind who teaches, like Nuftibag O’Brien?
The handicap is the cornerstone of Australian racing. Who did away with it? By evening the competition we improve it. And Melbourne is the home of the handicap. Who did away with the weight discrepancies? If we don't reinstate them we'll end up watching five mongrels parade over 400m in ten minutes.
Save us, Bart.
Well, the spring is over and it was by no means unforgettable. Watsisface won the CC, the handy Kyneton Cup prospect won the Cox Plate, beating the legendary Zipping, the bastard got beat in the Derby and the filly failed to stay in the Oaks and won by four.
The Huss was set an historic mission for the spring and came up 100 years short. Pretty much every trainer in the country proved that he is not fit to be mentioned in the same breath as the Socratres of the turf, Bart and the riding was as bad as I have ever seen.
And to cap it off Greg Eurell produced the true glamour horse of Australian racing, The Cat, half right at his longest primo trip and trained him into seventh in disgraceful company. Lucky So Crates Cummings was there to clean up.
So what was good? So Crates, of course. You may be reading this post at fifteen years of age. Maybe you're eighty. Irregardless, or disrespective of your age I can promise you this: you have never and will never see a better representative of Australian racing than Bart Cummings.
It's not fair to compare Moody or Danny O'Brien or that specialist in soft ons - Mick Price - to Bart. Because they suffer from incurable mediocrity. It's not a topic we come across with Bart.
Viewed missed a run in his lead up. Before the CC an interviewer (I forget the name) suggested to Bart that it would be a fine training effort to get Viewed over the line in the CC given the run he missed. Bart had a snort and the fired back with an introspective "It certainly would". What he didn't say was "Particularly given that he is stone dead."
Exactly how many Caulfield Cups has Bart trained? Who gives a *smile*? Certainly not Bart. How many years is it since the Monkey slaughtered Rogan Josh at 40s in the CC? (Oh, the pain.) And retained the ride.
The Melbourne Cup of 2008 will be a matter of consideration for form students for some months. But this much we know: if not for Blake Shinn's filthy ride Viewed wins by four. Gauci and Newitt will laugh for decades about how early he went. His missus cries over the same.
And today there was a touching scene with Anthony going berserk over running second behind the old man in the G1 Whatever Stakes. Bart barely choked out a chuckle. BTW in the movie of Bart's life Rodney Dangerfield will play Anthony.
After the MC some talking head fired off a "So what a way to cap off Viewed's career, Bart." and So Crates cut up a bit rough and said something like "You haven't seen the last of Viewed." Were you listening?
But when we're talking about kings, not just any king, but the brightest star in a century we have to look at fools. Enter Aidan O'Brien.
First up let's acknowledge that it was such a weak year that the pom (this decade's Beekeeper) ran second, albeit with the race put on for him (just like Beekeeper). If poms are in the finish it's a very weak year because poms are just no good at anything. Okay. Some may think it's unfair to make an assertion like that without backing it up so here goes:
Axiom of racing #0136- Poms are no good at anything.
I hope that clears that up.
So we've proven beyond doubt that it was a weak cup (as usual the Melbourne Cup was the clear highlight of the spring, even a weak one). And then we get to Aidan O'Brien's strong suit: he knew that.
But then it gets very funny. First the stable backs the various cripples he's brought off the planet. Turns out Mr O'Brien has a plan.
He has in his care a few horses that have never been in a horse race. Sure, they've regularly taken part in the British Saturday tradition in which five mongrels take ten minutes to parade around a track over 4000 yards. But racing? Nup. Never done it.
These equine legends, according to the master plan of Mr O'Brien, are going to set a sizzling speed over the longest mile and a half in the world. The stewards got involved, redefining redundancy and what happened next is legend, only a few days after it took place.
Mr Aidan O'Brien's horses (remember they've never actually been in a horse race before) are set the task of schooling Australian horses in pace. OMG. So they cut the first 1000m of a Melbourne Cup in under a minute. Three of them. And I hear that they ran the first ten furlongs in under two. Well, given that they've never run within 200m of that time in their lives it surprised no one that they got just a little tired and but for the retired pony (Gallopin) filled the reverse trifecta.
Afterwards it was all about the teddibly hahd track. Nuffers are nuffers, hard track or no. Mr Aidan O'Brien set a new benchmark for stupidity in world racing with his efforts in the 2008 MC. Let us never forget it.
If there was a simple lesson that Mr O'Brien could take from this campaign it is that he's here to learn, not to teach. The fact is that this Olympic idiot is still not sufficiently exposed by comparison to Bart. Most look like idiots compared to JBC. Let's establish a heirarchy.
I often refer to stupid racing people as carnies. And sure, I'm the first to admit that I'm a little too slow to break out the poison pen. But there are plenty dumber than carnies. Take Luca Cumani. He's an Upper Class Twit. His daughter may be attractive for a racing commentator. But she's less attractive than a supermodel and knows less about racing. Each of them has the rare talent of being able to run over themselves. UCTs.
A secret for you - at the Royal Melbourne Show there is a large tent (I cannot divulge it’s name but I’ve been there) where carnies bring in dodgem cars and try to run over themselves to prove that they’re upper class twits (that’s the thing about carnies, they’re always trying to improve themselves). But none has ever been able to do the dodgem suicide, proving for now that they’re not as stupid as Luca Cumani.
But Luca Cumani has a rare gift – he knows how dumb he is. And we can all be thankful that he survived his first glorious attempt to drive the red Fiasco over his own throat (a miracle). He can learn. So he gets Australian riders to battle on Australian turf. All he needs now is to get an Australian trainer to train them and he’s over the line.
And he knows the rule (he didn’t divine it – he was told): The Melbourne Cup is the longest mile and a half in the world. So that's the type he brings. Except for Mad Rush a ten furlong battler.
We all know that carnies only survive by stripping upper class twits. There's no doubt about who is the boss is the relationship. But Luca Cumani proved, giving hope to UCTs all over the world, that one day, maybe UCTs can fight back, can get almost square with the odd, *smile* carnie.
So we have three examples from the spring, a heirarchy of smart/stupid - the legend, Bart, the improving sub-carnie, Luca Cumani, and the immortal imbecile Aidan O’Brien. I s'pose it's a bit of a lopsided spectrum but who wants to think about the middle ground?
Speaking of which, what about us?
At Flemington this year we had… thirty-nine races. All bar one was put on for the leader. Most were run at a farcical tempo (despite turf genius, Greg Miles’s proclamations about the strength of the tempo, FFS). Only one was run at a fast clip and that was the Melbourne Cup. And that was thanks to the stupidity of Aidan O’Brien. Oh, the irony. Maybe he did teach us.
Aidan only stayed as stupid as he did because he can’t learn. Even UCTs like Luca Cumani can. So why can’t we? Do we want to appear on the idiot radar next to AO’B? That’s pretty ambitious.
Why were the races all run at such embarrassing rates? There are two reasons. The less important is that the stupid riders are not as stupid as they used to be. You just don’t get the half dozen total imbeciles cutting each other to ribbons over the first 600m like you used to.
The main reason is the compression of weights. If your mount is getting nine kegs from the good horse you want to make them carry it. So you put the speed on. This is an extension of ancient axiom of racing #0003: Back topweights in welters. FXS every race is at least a Corinthian these days.
When Tuesday Joy or Forensics is carrying the same weight as the bush mare down the bottom how can the rider of the weaker horse advantage himself by putting the speed on? He has to slow the speed to give himself a faint hope of stealing a minor placing.
This is an obvious problem and we let it happen because we are idiots. (By ‘we’ I mean the VRC, or Whoever.) The question for us now is what kind of idiot do we want to be – the kind who learns, like Luca Cumani, or the kind who teaches, like Nuftibag O’Brien?
The handicap is the cornerstone of Australian racing. Who did away with it? By evening the competition we improve it. And Melbourne is the home of the handicap. Who did away with the weight discrepancies? If we don't reinstate them we'll end up watching five mongrels parade over 400m in ten minutes.
Save us, Bart.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Lot to digest there jd.
Some old axioms ring true, mares in form stay, well in form. IMO Forensics was the bet of the carnival on Derby Day. Would have run well in the Emirates as Mimi backed up the form. Class mares, in form, at set weights. Pity there is not 8 races of them on every day of the carnival.
Ride of the carnival was Blake Shinn on Bird of Fire. From the outside barrier gets a soft lead and is the last jockey to pull the whip. Probably well aware that he could the cheap lead so that makes it an even better ride.
So I agree with all the pace comments. Do you roll the dice and try and win with the more likely result finishing last, or do you play it safe to pinch some prizemoney.
Samantha Miss looms as the horse most likely. Gee we need something as the WFA ranks are woeful. The Sydney siders are regainining their dominance. Perhaps WBGY, the Hussler trained properly and SM, perhaps with Viewed and others coming on the WFA ranks can return to interesting. It is lucky Tie The Knot has retired as may have won another swag of class 4 equivalent WFA races.
And don't be too hard on Luca Cumani. He did throw Francesca after all.
Lot to digest there jd.
Some old axioms ring true, mares in form stay, well in form. IMO Forensics was the bet of the carnival on Derby Day. Would have run well in the Emirates as Mimi backed up the form. Class mares, in form, at set weights. Pity there is not 8 races of them on every day of the carnival.
Ride of the carnival was Blake Shinn on Bird of Fire. From the outside barrier gets a soft lead and is the last jockey to pull the whip. Probably well aware that he could the cheap lead so that makes it an even better ride.
So I agree with all the pace comments. Do you roll the dice and try and win with the more likely result finishing last, or do you play it safe to pinch some prizemoney.
Samantha Miss looms as the horse most likely. Gee we need something as the WFA ranks are woeful. The Sydney siders are regainining their dominance. Perhaps WBGY, the Hussler trained properly and SM, perhaps with Viewed and others coming on the WFA ranks can return to interesting. It is lucky Tie The Knot has retired as may have won another swag of class 4 equivalent WFA races.
And don't be too hard on Luca Cumani. He did throw Francesca after all.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
A bit harsh on Cumani, Dyer'ere. But otherwise a hilarious read.
I had a great day at the track yesterday, despite being robbed on our Nico plunge.
Young Bear spoke to Brad (who is in disgraceful form by the way) before the Emirates and I listened in horror as he stated his intent to ride Nico midfield (or indecisively and against his pattern) from the wide gate. Niconero sat 6 deep, and made his run too early, and all could see he was looming as a contender upon straightening, before fading into 6th. All credit to the winner, who looks top class... But FFS, our bloke should've finished 3rd easily if he got anywhere near the rail. He was beaten 5 by the winner, 1 by third. The plunge at 50s went begging... but I'd do it again and all of the blokes involved believed his tough effort vindicated their decision to back him agressively. As I said, we were robbed. Should've run third, at least.
I had a great thrill in the Group 1 sprint... Bear and I were watching the races from the scales, and just before the jump, Dane pointed out that Bart was standing right next to me. We knew Swick was home at that point and he promptly kicked their heads in. Anthony made a lot of noise (as he had run the quinella with his old man), but Bart just chuckled. Naturally, I stood right behind the legend in his TVN interview in order to look like a member of the entoruage... we rode the Cummings coat tails all the way into the winners room, where the food and drink is free. We attempted to follow the Begg connections in there again after the emirates, but when we declared our allegiance to Begg's stable when interrogated by one of those green jacketed gooses, Begg (knowing his chances with the Emirates girls were greatly diminished with us in the room) simply shook his head. Despite winning his first Group 1 in nine years, the bloke clearly wasn't feeling charitable... and we were ejected.
What a day.
A bit harsh on Cumani, Dyer'ere. But otherwise a hilarious read.
I had a great day at the track yesterday, despite being robbed on our Nico plunge.
Young Bear spoke to Brad (who is in disgraceful form by the way) before the Emirates and I listened in horror as he stated his intent to ride Nico midfield (or indecisively and against his pattern) from the wide gate. Niconero sat 6 deep, and made his run too early, and all could see he was looming as a contender upon straightening, before fading into 6th. All credit to the winner, who looks top class... But FFS, our bloke should've finished 3rd easily if he got anywhere near the rail. He was beaten 5 by the winner, 1 by third. The plunge at 50s went begging... but I'd do it again and all of the blokes involved believed his tough effort vindicated their decision to back him agressively. As I said, we were robbed. Should've run third, at least.
I had a great thrill in the Group 1 sprint... Bear and I were watching the races from the scales, and just before the jump, Dane pointed out that Bart was standing right next to me. We knew Swick was home at that point and he promptly kicked their heads in. Anthony made a lot of noise (as he had run the quinella with his old man), but Bart just chuckled. Naturally, I stood right behind the legend in his TVN interview in order to look like a member of the entoruage... we rode the Cummings coat tails all the way into the winners room, where the food and drink is free. We attempted to follow the Begg connections in there again after the emirates, but when we declared our allegiance to Begg's stable when interrogated by one of those green jacketed gooses, Begg (knowing his chances with the Emirates girls were greatly diminished with us in the room) simply shook his head. Despite winning his first Group 1 in nine years, the bloke clearly wasn't feeling charitable... and we were ejected.
What a day.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Gyps I wish I'd got so many laughs from so few words. ;D
So the compression of weights leads to the lack of pace and to the compression of fields. This is not just theory now. Check the number of jockeys who were suspended during the carnival. It's a scandal. The culprit is easy to identify: it's the compression of weights.
If the bottomweight has 47kgs and the toppie 58kgs there will be pace. The rider of the lighweight can only take advantage of the break by putting the pace on (Glenn Boss, you leper, are you reading this? ;D). Consequently the field spreads out and jockeys can get a run without knocking half the field over.
Conversely, when the bottomweight, a country mare like Bellini Rose, carries the same weight as Forensics what else can the rider of the bushie do but take his mount to the first few and pray for a slow speed so he can pinch a minor?
You may say, well how come even when there's a speed on the jockeys still bunch? Well, I could say it's because they're all idiots. I believe I've argued that successfully a dozen times before.
But let's, for the sake of the argument, take a more generous line. The people riding the horses are human and it takes a few formulaic events before they get the urge to break the pattern. How often do we see a track bias overturned in the last race? That's because the nuffers on the horses finally work out that there is an advantage in say, leading. So they all try to lead and the last horse in running wins.
When most of the horses are near the same weight the jockeys get into the habit of not challenging the speed even when they get a chance (Glenn Boss, anyone?).
Australian racing is not parade of mongrels stuff. We got big fields. We got keen racing (usually) and topline bloodstock. The compression of weights is turning us into poms. And nobody wants that. How would it be if a horse like Septicmus won the Melbourne Cup? We'd all have to move to New Zealand, eh?
The Quality Handicap thing has worked to a point. Makybe Diva won three. But Rising Fast might have done that with similar breaks.
What's happening now is we're fully overboard with the compression of weights and it is ruining the advantages of Australian racing. There is no speed. There is no space. Lower the limit. Up the topweight. That will make it all better.
But don't we want to put the races on for the topweight? Nup. We want a speed, some space and a fight.
A dozen top line jockeys suspended and at most one fast run race in thirty-nine. This is the story of the 2008 spring carnival. A disaster.
Gyps I wish I'd got so many laughs from so few words. ;D
So the compression of weights leads to the lack of pace and to the compression of fields. This is not just theory now. Check the number of jockeys who were suspended during the carnival. It's a scandal. The culprit is easy to identify: it's the compression of weights.
If the bottomweight has 47kgs and the toppie 58kgs there will be pace. The rider of the lighweight can only take advantage of the break by putting the pace on (Glenn Boss, you leper, are you reading this? ;D). Consequently the field spreads out and jockeys can get a run without knocking half the field over.
Conversely, when the bottomweight, a country mare like Bellini Rose, carries the same weight as Forensics what else can the rider of the bushie do but take his mount to the first few and pray for a slow speed so he can pinch a minor?
You may say, well how come even when there's a speed on the jockeys still bunch? Well, I could say it's because they're all idiots. I believe I've argued that successfully a dozen times before.
But let's, for the sake of the argument, take a more generous line. The people riding the horses are human and it takes a few formulaic events before they get the urge to break the pattern. How often do we see a track bias overturned in the last race? That's because the nuffers on the horses finally work out that there is an advantage in say, leading. So they all try to lead and the last horse in running wins.
When most of the horses are near the same weight the jockeys get into the habit of not challenging the speed even when they get a chance (Glenn Boss, anyone?).
Australian racing is not parade of mongrels stuff. We got big fields. We got keen racing (usually) and topline bloodstock. The compression of weights is turning us into poms. And nobody wants that. How would it be if a horse like Septicmus won the Melbourne Cup? We'd all have to move to New Zealand, eh?
The Quality Handicap thing has worked to a point. Makybe Diva won three. But Rising Fast might have done that with similar breaks.
What's happening now is we're fully overboard with the compression of weights and it is ruining the advantages of Australian racing. There is no speed. There is no space. Lower the limit. Up the topweight. That will make it all better.
But don't we want to put the races on for the topweight? Nup. We want a speed, some space and a fight.
A dozen top line jockeys suspended and at most one fast run race in thirty-nine. This is the story of the 2008 spring carnival. A disaster.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Funny stuff Gyps. Good on yas. Reminds me a bit of a PREnder who was in the vicinity of a press conference once so he pushed in amongst the media throng and asked some questions for PRE. Sometimes when opportunity presents itself you've just got to take it. :hihi
Gypsy__Jazz said:
Funny stuff Gyps. Good on yas. Reminds me a bit of a PREnder who was in the vicinity of a press conference once so he pushed in amongst the media throng and asked some questions for PRE. Sometimes when opportunity presents itself you've just got to take it. :hihi
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
PRE PUNTERS CLUB
What a run - unfortunately mk33's run had to come to an end - and for a minute there I thought he was going to catch our tear-away leader for PRE Punter Of The Year. Not to worry mk33 you made a real race of it.
Next up is Scottyturnerscurse who is a renowned Sandown specialist - with a couple of good wins he too will frighten the life out of the PRE Punter of the Year race.
The member order of punting is -
1 Blood17 - return $41.30
2 Dyer'ere - return $28
3 The Claw - return 0
4 Rosy23 - return $129.50 - Club House Leader
5 jb03 - return 0
6 Leysy Days - return 0
7 Coughlan24 - return 0
8 Mainlandy - return 0
9 Hartbalme - return $34
10 mk33 - return $105.36
11 scottyturnerscurse - return 0 - In the chair
12 Tiger44 - return 0
13 Gypsy Jazz - return $53.50
14 Remote Tiger - return 0
The 2008 rules are -
1) $20 per week to bet on 1 horse or 2 horses in the following combinations;
1 Horse selected only;
$20 straight out for a win or,
$10 win x $10 place or,
$5 win x $15 place.
2 Horses selected
$10 win on both or,
$5 win and $5 place on both or,
$10 win on one horse and $5 win and $5 place on the other.
2) Should your bets collect more than $30 (meaning a win of $10+) you survive to bet - the next week for the club.
3) Selections can be at any Saturday metropolitan meeting in Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane or Adelaide. (On weekends where there are Group races on the Monday or Sunday as well as or instead of the Saturday racing the PRE Punter in the chair can forgo the Saturday racing and bet on the Monday or Sunday). Please post your selections on this thread by 11.00am on the day of the races so it gives me time to find them and put them on.
4) All profits (no matter how small) will be posted to Rosy's bank account to help with the admin costs of PRE This year I challenge you to out do last years great effort and really give the PRE bank account a kick along
5) All bets are put on Remote Tigers Darwin Bookie IASbet.com (gives a Superprice dividend guaranteed to be better than 2 of the three TABs and is generally better than all three) hence there is no outlay by other members of the Punting Club.
6) A total of collects for each member will be maintained by Remote Tiger and the member with the largest total of collects by the last day of the Melbourne Spring Racing Carnival will be announced the PRE Punter of the year, 2008.
PRE PUNTERS CLUB
What a run - unfortunately mk33's run had to come to an end - and for a minute there I thought he was going to catch our tear-away leader for PRE Punter Of The Year. Not to worry mk33 you made a real race of it.
Next up is Scottyturnerscurse who is a renowned Sandown specialist - with a couple of good wins he too will frighten the life out of the PRE Punter of the Year race.
The member order of punting is -
1 Blood17 - return $41.30
2 Dyer'ere - return $28
3 The Claw - return 0
4 Rosy23 - return $129.50 - Club House Leader
5 jb03 - return 0
6 Leysy Days - return 0
7 Coughlan24 - return 0
8 Mainlandy - return 0
9 Hartbalme - return $34
10 mk33 - return $105.36
11 scottyturnerscurse - return 0 - In the chair
12 Tiger44 - return 0
13 Gypsy Jazz - return $53.50
14 Remote Tiger - return 0
The 2008 rules are -
1) $20 per week to bet on 1 horse or 2 horses in the following combinations;
1 Horse selected only;
$20 straight out for a win or,
$10 win x $10 place or,
$5 win x $15 place.
2 Horses selected
$10 win on both or,
$5 win and $5 place on both or,
$10 win on one horse and $5 win and $5 place on the other.
2) Should your bets collect more than $30 (meaning a win of $10+) you survive to bet - the next week for the club.
3) Selections can be at any Saturday metropolitan meeting in Melbourne, Sydney, Brisbane or Adelaide. (On weekends where there are Group races on the Monday or Sunday as well as or instead of the Saturday racing the PRE Punter in the chair can forgo the Saturday racing and bet on the Monday or Sunday). Please post your selections on this thread by 11.00am on the day of the races so it gives me time to find them and put them on.
4) All profits (no matter how small) will be posted to Rosy's bank account to help with the admin costs of PRE This year I challenge you to out do last years great effort and really give the PRE bank account a kick along
5) All bets are put on Remote Tigers Darwin Bookie IASbet.com (gives a Superprice dividend guaranteed to be better than 2 of the three TABs and is generally better than all three) hence there is no outlay by other members of the Punting Club.
6) A total of collects for each member will be maintained by Remote Tiger and the member with the largest total of collects by the last day of the Melbourne Spring Racing Carnival will be announced the PRE Punter of the year, 2008.
Re: Thoroughbred Horse Racing [Merged]
Sunburnt Land has been killed by lightning.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24650607-2722,00.html
Sunburnt Land has been killed by lightning.
http://www.theaustralian.news.com.au/story/0,25197,24650607-2722,00.html
