The case for a KPP draft pick

[pahoffm]

I see that Butcher has still not made your A class category. I assume you might be a touch unhappy if we use Pick 3 on him. What are the chances of Grifiths lasting to our 2nd pick if we happen to choose Morabito or Trengove with our 1st pick.

You never know your luck in the big city.
But then again, in the big city, most risk takers end up getting mugged.

Phantom, our list is crying out for another genuine KPP. I hate to think what the consequneces will be for our future success if we miss out on a very good tall in this draft. They will be even harder to find once Gold Coast and West Sydney join the comp.

I must admit that I agree.

It was why that extra early pick in the 2nd round was so important.
And why I'm still upset about losing it.

How many of the talls that I put up will still be available in the 2nd round?

In the end it's going to be a decision that Francis will have to make, and live or die by.
That's the responsibility you take on as Recruiting Manager.

 

[IanG]

please not Butcher .. at least his name is synonymous with his kicking

Panos as a tall forward with our R2 if Tapscott is not there

Temel as another tall forward with our R4

Is there any info on Temel available?

 

[Smoking Aces]

You never know your luck in the big city.
But then again, in the big city, most risk takers end up getting mugged.

I must admit that I agree.

It was why that extra early pick in the 2nd round was so important.
And why I'm still upset about losing it.

How many of the talls that I put up will still be available in the 2nd round?

In the end it's going to be a decision that Francis will have to make, and live or die by.
That's the responsibility you take on as Recruiting Manager.

And thats why its super important that we trade into a 2nd round pick.

With Thursfield just signing a contract extension I would see what interest our other 2 medium tall defenders in Moore and McGuane generate.

 

[Leysy Days]

Always a compelling case to take the tall.

As we know, elite talls go very quickly in the draft.

Recent elite talls such as Roughead, Franklin, Ryder, Clark, Kennedy, Dowler, Hansen, Gumbleton, Kreuser, N.Brown, Frawley, Everitt, Natanui & Vickery have all gone early in the draft. A few of these much earlier than expected.
Why?
Because they're elite talls.

Over the years, we've debated Ottens v Johnstone, Fiora v Pavlich, Tambling v Franklin.

In the case of Ottens v Johnstone, even though Johnstone has had a 10+ year career, no one has criticised the RFC for taking Ottens.

We've also had -

Tim Walsh at 4 before Jarrad McVeigh or Mitch Thorp at 6 ahead of Selwood.

Dont mess with your early picks. Its who the recruiters deem best available early doors.

 

[Dyer Disciple]

Must be best available and I believe there will be a few midfielders who will be rated higher than Butcher.

 

[pahoffm]

Is there any info on Temel available?

Yes, Temel is a solid 194cm kpp. He can play both forward and back.
I first saw him for Calder at the Coburg oval 2 years ago.
I spoke to him, when he sat behind me, at the TAC GF last year.

His TAC stats are as follows:
http://www.sportingpulse.com/team_info.cgi?player=Serhat%20Temel&action=PSTATS&pID=188600353&client=1-3020-0-81015-8066199

Personally, I like him as a good late pick option.
I like Luke McDonald as a good late pick option too. (In fact I put it to Greg to draft him 2 years ago as an under-aged project tall.)
Temel is more versatile than Luke.
But Luke is the stronger forward.

 

[pahoffm]

We've also had -

Tim Walsh at 4 before Jarrad McVeigh or Mitch Thorp at 6 ahead of Selwood.

Dont mess with your early picks. Its who the recruiters deem best available early doors.

Must be best available and I believe there will be a few midfielders who will be rated higher than Butcher.

Yep. Good points.

It's a hard decision, considering also that in the next few drafts we're unlikely to get a pick until well into the 2nd round.

 

[IanG]

Must be best available and I believe there will be a few midfielders who will be rated higher than Butcher.

The Hawks have shown the importance of getting the structure right with talented key talls.

 

[tigertim]

Surely the odds are we can finally land a decent KPP this time arund? If it be Butcher then great.

 

[Dyer Disciple]

The Hawks have shown the importance of getting the structure right with talented key talls.

Bit misleading, we also where going to take Roughhead. Roughhead and Franklin compared to Lids and Tambling far more favorably than Butcher and co compare to Scully and co.

 

[pahoffm]

Football list strategy usually tells you to get you goal to goal line right first.

Then get your midfield right.

Then your rucks.

Then your flankers.

I said it 2004, when we were rebuilding then.

Since we're rebuilding now, I'll say it again.

 

[Dyer Disciple]

It's a hard decision, considering also that in the next few drafts we're unlikely to get a pick until well into the 2nd round.

This is the thing troubling me also. If we don't take a highly rated tall now, where do we find one? Tricky, this is why I was hoping we would bite the bullet and trade one of our better "glass is half full/empty" type midfielders to a Sydney or Essendon or something in the hope of getting another pick inside the 1st/2nd round.

I too was dissapointed to loose the second round priority pick.

Football list strategy usually tells you to get you goal to goal line right first.

Then get your midfield right.

Then your rucks.

Then your flankers.

Generally I've always agreed, the spine is very important. However in the modern game I personally think the midfield has become the most important. Then spine.

 

[IanG]

Bit misleading, we also where going to take Roughhead. Roughhead and Franklin compared to Lids and Tambling far more favorably than Butcher and co compare to Scully and co.

Only in hindsight, I don't believe they did in 2004 at least not from what I remember. Franklin had an extremely poor National Champs and attitude, and I don't think Butcher suffers much in comparison to Roughhead's rep at the time.

 

[TOT70]

Football list strategy usually tells you to get you goal to goal line right first.

Then get your midfield right.

Then your rucks.

Then your flankers.

I said it 2004, when we were rebuilding then.

Since we're rebuilding now, I'll say it again.

Given your player ratings, are you suggesting that Richmond draft Ben Griffiths at number 3/4, passing on Butcher and the midfielders?

 

[mopsy fraser]

surely we have to go after big blokes.

i could understand going for the best available if the first 6 or 7 rated players were midfielders.

but we will have roughly pick 3 or 4,melbourne get the first 2 so in theory we would only be overlooking one better available player before taking butcher.

 

[johnson2richo2003]

Generally I've always agreed, the spine is very important. However in the modern game I personally think the midfield has become the most important. Then spine.

Agreed.Perfect example.How effective has Lynch[West Coast] been since the departure Judd and Cousins.

And just on Butcher.It seems his kicking for goal is questionable but has good hands etc.
Don,t we already have 2 of those types on the list already[Post & Polak] so why waste a pick 3 or 4 on the very same type thats already there fpr the same output?

 

[Dyer Disciple]

Only in hindsight, I don't believe they did in 2004 at least not from what I remember. Franklin had an extremely poor National Champs and attitude, and I don't think Butcher suffers much in comparison to Roughhead's rep at the time.

Disagree, Richmond was going to take Roughhead and Lids, that's both clubs rating him a high enough talent to not be a risk while filling list needs. Franklin was in most peoples Top 4 or 6 and was widely accepted as the next best or best forward with Roughhead. Sure he was enigmatic but not many questioned his talent or potential, most of the doubters were of his attitude.

 

[IanG]

Agreed.Perfect example.How effective has Lynch[West Coast] been since the departure Judd and Cousins.

And just on Butcher.It seems his kicking for goal is questionable but has good hands etc.
Don,t we already have 2 of those types on the list already[Post & Polak] so why waste a pick 3 or 4 on the very same type thats already there fpr the same output?

Post and Polak are more mobile type players, we need a player who can take a strong contested grab.

Disagree, Richmond was going to take Roughhead and Lids, that's both clubs rating him a high enough talent to not be a risk while filling list needs.

Melbourne are mooted to perhaps take Scully and Butcher. The Bulldogs rated Griffin No. 1 in 2004. There are 2 outstanding mids in this draft, Scully and Trengrove, the rest of the mids don't seem to be guarantees.

 

[Dyer Disciple]

Post and Polak are more mobile type players, we need a player who can take a strong contested grab.

Melbourne are mooted to perhaps take Scully and Butcher. The Bulldogs rated Griffin No. 1 in 2004. There are 2 outstanding mids in this draft, Scully and Trengrove, the rest of the mids don't seem to be guarantees.

Bit different again in my opinion. Exceptions to every rule, Melbourne had the luxuary of the first pick last year and Morton before that. They have truly bottomed out and reaping the benefits of such. Their midfield doesn't look too bad for the future, and having Butcher to compliment Butcher gives them a handy one two punch considering they will have Scully and Morton in the midfield forgetting their players who have been there longer or promising talent like Valenti, Buckley etc to complient Davey who is playing more in the midfield these days and Mclean, Jones etc.

It wouldn't be a cardinal sin for Melbourne to go Butcher.

 

[BladeTiger]

Football list strategy usually tells you to get you goal to goal line right first.

Then get your midfield right.

Then your rucks.

Then your flankers.

I said it 2004, when we were rebuilding then.

Since we're rebuilding now, I'll say it again.

Have to agree Phanto. Can't remember a really competent Richmond spine since the early 1980 when we had St Francis (admit he was pinch hitting), The Ghost, Cloke and Roach (having The General in the ruck didn't hurt also).