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Talking Politics
- Thread starter Legends of 2017
- Start date
At least the Albanians didn't get "his precious"! :hihi
....anyway, more importantly, I thought it was a drag at night answering the phone, and having someone from India wanting to "talk to the home-owner"... :
...but people can expect a phone-call and even a visit, from your favourite neighbourhood union heavy:
ACTU targets union members in marginal seats
AM - Wednesday, 13 June , 2007 08:00:00
Reporter: Chris Uhlmann
If you're in a union living in a marginal seat, then expect a telephone call from your union between now and the election urging you to vote against the Howard Government.
And, if after the first call you can't seem to quite make up your mind, then you can expect two more phone calls and perhaps a home visit from a delegate as well.
AM has obtained the ACTU's federal election strategy manual and it shows the multi-million dollar television advertising blitz against WorkChoices is just part of the union push.
The Australian Council of Trade Unions Political Strategy Manual is a handbook for unions on how to beat the Howard Government.
One of its aims is to identify union members who are undecided voters and get them to vote against the Coalition through a series of phone calls and home visits.
The manual says there are about 13,000 union members living in each marginal seat, and 30 per cent of them are undecided voters.
Swinging some of these against the Coalition could turn the election.
To track these people down, the ACTU developed an electoral search program called Magenta Linas, which identifies union members in marginal seats and supplies their telephone numbers. The member is then contacted by their union or a company called E-lect Interactive.
The first call asks about the member's voting intention and their key issues of concern, including whether the Howard Government's workplace laws would be enough to swing the member's vote away from the Coalition.
In a chapter on how to deal with undecided voters, the document says:
EXCERPT FROM ACTU ELECTION MANUAL: In the lead up to the election, the goal is to make three phone calls to members whose vote is undecided, plus a door-knock visit prior to the election, if they remain undecided.
The document says callers should not tell people how to vote or get into an argument about politics.
EXCERPT FROM ACTU ELECTION MANUAL: It may be despicable to you that the member may agree with some of the Federal Government's policies. But avoid getting into heated arguments; such debates are likely to make the member dig their heels in.
The first phone call is used to mine information and set the foundation for future calls.
Callers are asked to pay particular attention to the language members use, and to find out about their ambitions and if they have a family or a mortgage.
The idea is to build a profile of the member and to loop his or her concerns back in follow up calls.
EXCERPT FROM ACTU ELECTION MANUAL: Like a rhetorical question pre-empts a response, the sequence of these calls should lead to one conclusion: the IR laws are horrific. They must go. To ensure they go, I need to vote against the Coalition Government at the election.
http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2007/s1949614.htm
Ruddy and Gillard have, of course, defended this type of campaign, which shows they are closely aligned to the Unions.
Not smart Ruddy....not smart at all... :-X
....anyway, more importantly, I thought it was a drag at night answering the phone, and having someone from India wanting to "talk to the home-owner"... :
...but people can expect a phone-call and even a visit, from your favourite neighbourhood union heavy:ACTU targets union members in marginal seats
AM - Wednesday, 13 June , 2007 08:00:00
Reporter: Chris Uhlmann
If you're in a union living in a marginal seat, then expect a telephone call from your union between now and the election urging you to vote against the Howard Government.
And, if after the first call you can't seem to quite make up your mind, then you can expect two more phone calls and perhaps a home visit from a delegate as well.
AM has obtained the ACTU's federal election strategy manual and it shows the multi-million dollar television advertising blitz against WorkChoices is just part of the union push.
The Australian Council of Trade Unions Political Strategy Manual is a handbook for unions on how to beat the Howard Government.
One of its aims is to identify union members who are undecided voters and get them to vote against the Coalition through a series of phone calls and home visits.
The manual says there are about 13,000 union members living in each marginal seat, and 30 per cent of them are undecided voters.
Swinging some of these against the Coalition could turn the election.
To track these people down, the ACTU developed an electoral search program called Magenta Linas, which identifies union members in marginal seats and supplies their telephone numbers. The member is then contacted by their union or a company called E-lect Interactive.
The first call asks about the member's voting intention and their key issues of concern, including whether the Howard Government's workplace laws would be enough to swing the member's vote away from the Coalition.
In a chapter on how to deal with undecided voters, the document says:
EXCERPT FROM ACTU ELECTION MANUAL: In the lead up to the election, the goal is to make three phone calls to members whose vote is undecided, plus a door-knock visit prior to the election, if they remain undecided.
The document says callers should not tell people how to vote or get into an argument about politics.
EXCERPT FROM ACTU ELECTION MANUAL: It may be despicable to you that the member may agree with some of the Federal Government's policies. But avoid getting into heated arguments; such debates are likely to make the member dig their heels in.
The first phone call is used to mine information and set the foundation for future calls.
Callers are asked to pay particular attention to the language members use, and to find out about their ambitions and if they have a family or a mortgage.
The idea is to build a profile of the member and to loop his or her concerns back in follow up calls.
EXCERPT FROM ACTU ELECTION MANUAL: Like a rhetorical question pre-empts a response, the sequence of these calls should lead to one conclusion: the IR laws are horrific. They must go. To ensure they go, I need to vote against the Coalition Government at the election.
http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2007/s1949614.htm
Ruddy and Gillard have, of course, defended this type of campaign, which shows they are closely aligned to the Unions.
Not smart Ruddy....not smart at all... :-X
No issue with this Liverpool. Have mates in the Libs and I know they have been doing similar for years.
Its all a part of modern politics. With finite resources you want to focus your dollars as precisely as possible, hence any outlet that lets you refine targeting is desperately wanted. We still do the door knocks and letter drops, but everyone knows these are far from efficient uses of time, money, and resources.
Its all a part of modern politics. With finite resources you want to focus your dollars as precisely as possible, hence any outlet that lets you refine targeting is desperately wanted. We still do the door knocks and letter drops, but everyone knows these are far from efficient uses of time, money, and resources.
Yeah, both parties have highly sophisticated computer electoral databases. They both have catchy acronyms, the Libs is called ANIMALS from memory, forget what the acronym is, but you hear Lib campaign workers saying things like ‘one of our main election weapons is animals’.
They gather info on individuals from all sorts of sources, they doorknock, often with a clipboard and write stuff down that is different to what you think they’re writing, for example, you might be telling them about an intersection you want fixed and you think they are writing about that, when they are actually writing ‘commie nutcase with questionable personal hygene, won’t ever vote for us so ignore in future’. It’s a funny example but it happens a lot.
Also any letters to the editors in newspapers the put an entry in the database thats appropriate to their goals. For example if a letter has a far left view the Libs would enter ‘rusted on ALP, ignore in campaigns’, things like that.
They identify and focus in on potential swinging voters in marginal seats then bombard them with propaganda. Any rusted on voters, supporters or opponents, are ignored.
Note to Liverpool, both sides do what I’ve just outlined. I was pretty surprised at Hockey’s ‘evil big brother’ response, its not much of a step to expose the fact that the coalition have been doing it for about a decade with far greater and ever increasing sophistication.
They gather info on individuals from all sorts of sources, they doorknock, often with a clipboard and write stuff down that is different to what you think they’re writing, for example, you might be telling them about an intersection you want fixed and you think they are writing about that, when they are actually writing ‘commie nutcase with questionable personal hygene, won’t ever vote for us so ignore in future’. It’s a funny example but it happens a lot.
Also any letters to the editors in newspapers the put an entry in the database thats appropriate to their goals. For example if a letter has a far left view the Libs would enter ‘rusted on ALP, ignore in campaigns’, things like that.
They identify and focus in on potential swinging voters in marginal seats then bombard them with propaganda. Any rusted on voters, supporters or opponents, are ignored.
Note to Liverpool, both sides do what I’ve just outlined. I was pretty surprised at Hockey’s ‘evil big brother’ response, its not much of a step to expose the fact that the coalition have been doing it for about a decade with far greater and ever increasing sophistication.
Tiger74/Tigersnake,
I've never doubted both parties use such tactics.
Agree with both of you.
The thing is, the Union is supposed to be a body working for the 'worker' out there, not a polictical party in their own right, or as a group campaigning on behalf of the ALP....unless the ALP/ACTU are the "New Coalition"?
I've never doubted both parties use such tactics.
Agree with both of you.
The thing is, the Union is supposed to be a body working for the 'worker' out there, not a polictical party in their own right, or as a group campaigning on behalf of the ALP....unless the ALP/ACTU are the "New Coalition"?
Liverpool said:Tiger74/Tigersnake,
I've never doubted both parties use such tactics.
Agree with both of you.
The thing is, the Union is supposed to be a body working for the 'worker' out there, not a polictical party in their own right, or as a group campaigning on behalf of the ALP....unless the ALP/ACTU are the "New Coalition"?
Firstly the "unions" have voting rights within the ALP. Not surprisingly they usually campaign in tandem, as the ALP policy is influenced by them at the National Council.
Secondly, the Libs have similar issues with Big Business. The Libs have a number of foundations that make massive donations to the party. These foundations exist as the Libs have to declare who donates to them, but not who donates to an independant third party. This allows corporates to say "we are bi-partisan" while secretly funnelling money.
To be honest I hate money politics, and both sides at times disgust me with their mutual vested interests. This being said, at the grassroots I have seen some outstanding local members, who are truly committed to helping their electorate (regardless of who they vote for). Unfortunately this isn't sexy, doesn't get press, so we all focus on the mud slinging.
In terms of how to stop it....Im not sure. You need to stop the money flow, but at the same time you need to allow free speech. I am inclined to limit political advertising, but this is against free speech and is open to exploitation through loop-holes.
Well knock me down with a feather.
The ALP and the Unions are on the same side?
Bugger me.
And now some one has told me the Libs and business are in bed.
Geez this is a surprise.
Next we'll have front page news "Rosy is a RFC member" or Bob Brown's a tree hugger.
Must be a real slow news week.
The ALP and the Unions are on the same side?
Bugger me.
And now some one has told me the Libs and business are in bed.
Geez this is a surprise.
Next we'll have front page news "Rosy is a RFC member" or Bob Brown's a tree hugger.
Must be a real slow news week.
Anduril said:
Firstly, the $500b you are spruiking is FOREIGN debt, and something Crean was whingeing before the last election, and using this as an excuse as to why interest rates will go through the roof, blah, blah, [insert scare tactics similar to WorkChoices here].... :
Heard it all before...
Secondly, while you are happy to mention the $96b of NET debt in 1996, you fail to mention, that when the Libs were ousted in 1983, it was approximately $9b...yet a year later under Hawke, it was already at $16b...and continually rose to the $96b before Howard took over.
The ALP didn't do much in their 13 years or so to bring it down, did they?
Some interesting figures here (see Table F4):
http://www.budget.gov.au/2006-07/myefo/html/09_appendix_f.htm
I wish both parties would pull their heads in on debt.
People confuse public and private sector debt all the time, the government only control public sector debt. As for the private sector, if the best way they fund growth is via debt, great. They make an economic decision in their best interests, and if they fail, so what.
As for public debt, it is only bad if we cannot repay it. We have never reached this point as a country.
Debt has gotten a bad wrap, but if used properly it is a great tool. It is a joke we had to go to tolls on Eastlink simply because the electorate would have freaked if they grabbed a billion or two in debt.
In general we will always have a high level of foreign debt. We are a small economy, and simply dont have the internal capital to fund the investments we need.
People confuse public and private sector debt all the time, the government only control public sector debt. As for the private sector, if the best way they fund growth is via debt, great. They make an economic decision in their best interests, and if they fail, so what.
As for public debt, it is only bad if we cannot repay it. We have never reached this point as a country.
Debt has gotten a bad wrap, but if used properly it is a great tool. It is a joke we had to go to tolls on Eastlink simply because the electorate would have freaked if they grabbed a billion or two in debt.
In general we will always have a high level of foreign debt. We are a small economy, and simply dont have the internal capital to fund the investments we need.
evo said:
Before I head off to this Evo....
Tiger Attack said:
TigerAttack,
How splattable are those tomatoes mate?....I'm willing to pay BIG $$$ and get my money's worth, and don't care where they come from...as they as they give old Keating a facelift! :hihi
Last couple of years it was - Hey Mums and Dads - step right up to the investment of a lifetime -
TELSTRA Shares T1 T2 T3 and as many T's as you want - buy these shares in Australia's largest telco - they are Government backed for the Government owns the shares but wants to sell them to you so you can enjoy the profits of this great Australian Icon.
Now that the Government has divested itself of 83% of Telstra and made a huge profit on the asset sale
The Liberal Government announces the successful bidder for the new broadband in Australia is OPEL - a partnership of Optus and Elders - the Liberal Government is providing OPEL with $1billion to help build this new wireless (in the bush) and optic fibre (in the main cities) network.
As a result of this announcement Telstra Shares fell on the ASX yesterday
How do you feel Mums and Dads? Duped, Shafted?
But remember Honest John Howard is the battlers best friend...............
Footnote: Optus is owned by Singtel which is majority owned by the Singapore Government - under this new broadband network part of the profits will go to the Singapore Government and its people. SO FEEL GOOD for everytime you use the new network you will be helping to line the pockets of Singaporeans.........
TELSTRA Shares T1 T2 T3 and as many T's as you want - buy these shares in Australia's largest telco - they are Government backed for the Government owns the shares but wants to sell them to you so you can enjoy the profits of this great Australian Icon.
Now that the Government has divested itself of 83% of Telstra and made a huge profit on the asset sale
The Liberal Government announces the successful bidder for the new broadband in Australia is OPEL - a partnership of Optus and Elders - the Liberal Government is providing OPEL with $1billion to help build this new wireless (in the bush) and optic fibre (in the main cities) network.
As a result of this announcement Telstra Shares fell on the ASX yesterday
How do you feel Mums and Dads? Duped, Shafted?
But remember Honest John Howard is the battlers best friend...............
Footnote: Optus is owned by Singtel which is majority owned by the Singapore Government - under this new broadband network part of the profits will go to the Singapore Government and its people. SO FEEL GOOD for everytime you use the new network you will be helping to line the pockets of Singaporeans.........
whats the problem? If the OPEL proposal is better than the Telstra one, the Government is duty bound to deliver the best outcome to VOTERS.
And who cares if OPEL is a foreign entity? We export minerals, food, and a variety of other goods, and expect access to world markets for these. If we start rejecting the right for foreign firms t do business here we will shoot ourselves in the foot.
Finally in terms of Govt obligations, at the end of the day the Govt is answerable to voters and not shareholders.
And who cares if OPEL is a foreign entity? We export minerals, food, and a variety of other goods, and expect access to world markets for these. If we start rejecting the right for foreign firms t do business here we will shoot ourselves in the foot.
Finally in terms of Govt obligations, at the end of the day the Govt is answerable to voters and not shareholders.
