Re: Adam Goodes

[Rosy]

.........He performed a war dance at the crowd, so what why should the crowd feel threatened? ...........

Threatened maybe not. It was barbaric behaviour as far as I'm concerned though. Still threatened is just one word. I don't expect they actually expected a savage to spear them. Rather than threatened you think the crowd would feel intimidated?

 

[Total Tiger]

I don't see how anything you have cited him as doing is in fact the cause of division, but it is fact bringing latent issues to the surface that still exist as I have said before. He performed a war dance at the crowd, so what why should the crowd feel threatened? Other players and coaches have made threatening gestures to the crowds without much of an uproar or the crowds themselves actually feeling threatened.

BTW Nathan Buckley on SEN just comprehensively pwned Dermott Brereton on the issue in terms of statements Brereton has made.

I did not mention the war dance. I quite liked it. Also didn't mention the word threatened at all. Perhaps re-read what I wrote if you wish to debate with me. Or not. I don't really care what you think

 

[KnightersRevenge]

So this is still going. Un-*smile*-believable.

I've asked three idnividuals on here the same question (roughly) not one has answered. I put it to the entire thread: When a see of angry faces boos Adam Goodes relentlessly, can he take comfort that the bloke/chick in seat 13b has "good" reasons? Does he have that abilitiy? Or do they all look and sound the same to him? And if he can't tell, then why do it?

No the people booing are NOT the victim. Yes if you boo now that you know 100% without a shadow of a doubt that Adam Goodes and the Richmond Tigers think you are supporting the gutless bigots amongst the booers, then that is your choice. Own it.

 

[Rosy]

So this is still going. Un-*smile*ing-believable.

...

Own it.

And you're still contributing. :hihi

Own it? One thing I've noticed from a few people on here is them ordering others around and telling them what to do and what to say yet often not answering questions or discussing actual opinions themselves.

 

[IanG]

I did not mention the war dance. I quite liked it. Also didn't mention the word threatened at all. Perhaps re-read what I wrote if you wish to debate with me. Or not. I don't really care what you think

Well you haven't been specific at all, so I have to assume one of the issues was the war dance and the issue with that was people apparently felt threatened. How specifically has he been divisive?

 

[KnightersRevenge]

And you're still contributing. :hihi

Own it? One thing I've noticed from a few people on here is them ordering others around and telling them what to do and what to say yet often not answering questions or discussing actual opinions themselves.

I didn't say I'd stop contributing Rosy, I said I wouldn't answer your posts. Nice cherry-picking of my quote by the way. :-*

 

[Baloo]

How is thread ticking over when there's a game and a half happening and it's the last quarter?

 

[KnightersRevenge]

How is thread ticking over when there's a game and a half happening and it's the last quarter?

It was 3/4 time. My brother rang me from Aus and gave me a ribbing over this thread. Set himself up as devils advocate just to see if he could tip me over the edge...he suceeded! I nearly popped a poofer valve. :cutelaugh

 

[Baloo]

Heh, you can choose your friends....

 

[Brodders17]

By definition anyone who differentiates on the basis of race is racist.

Maybe by your definition. Not by the one I used. There are various definitions.

it is not my definition. it is from the webster dictionary. and as far as i can tell the list of definitions you give all define racism as believing your race is superior, not just different.

I honestly don't believe anybody is booing Adam because they believe their race is superior to his race. Do you?

i think some are booing because they dont like an Indigenous person being outspoken on race issues.
do you think it is all innocent that one player is booed, called a monkey and told to go back to the zoo?

 

[Chiang Mai Tiger]

You've selectively quoted me and by doing so have missed my point. Not sure if that's intentional or not.

The last 15 pages tells me its intentional. Boy is it intentional.

For some reason this guy (bruntonave) is like a bee sting on the arse, he just wont go away and stop demanding responses from anyone daring to post on this thread.

Go back and have a look 'mate', correct me if I'm wrong (you'll have a go for sure).

Righteous or not, you are a broken record of complete nagging annoyance.

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

Wonder if Goodesy thanked Richmond FC for its support last night?

 

[Rantnrave]

Today at work everyone was tipping the Tigers to win tonight
My freind asked why and we agreed that when richmond was the first club to stand up on the goodes issue and announce their support it was such a move that everyone realised that this is now a very very solid and string club that believes in itself so much it's leading the way ... In a nutshell their stance spoke volumes about the strenghts and believes of the club.......on Wednesday I knew we,d win...there was no doubt

 

[glantone]

Wonder if Goodesy thanked Richmond FC for its support last night?

….do you think Goodes should thank the Richmond football club for their support or are you just wondering out aloud?

 

[Rantnrave]

….do you think Goodes should thank the Richmond football club for their support or are you just wondering out aloud?

I rang the swans footy club....and I can tell ya they moved and thankful for all the gestures all of which were passed onto goodes " this support we've had means the world to Adam and the swans .."

 

[Rosy]

I didn't say I'd stop contributing Rosy, I said I wouldn't answer your posts. Nice cherry-picking of my quote by the way. :-*

I know you didn't say you'd stop contributing and I never indicated that. You're jumping at shadows. You had a crack about the thread still going and I responded to that comment. No cherry picking at all. Nothing to do with your previous posting. It's the fact people are interested enough to post on it that keeps the thread going...your post included.

 

[Rosy]

it is not my definition. it is from the webster dictionary. and as far as i can tell the list of definitions you give all define racism as believing your race is superior, not just different.

i think some are booing because they dont like an Indigenous person being outspoken on race issues.
do you think it is all innocent that one player is booed, called a monkey and told to go back to the zoo?

Ok I'll re-phrase Brodders. I meant by the definition you used. I knew you got it from the dictionary. I don't know what you mean by innocent booing and slagging. Adam has said he's been called things like an ape etc all his career. That is pre-outspokeness. The 2 racist incidents highlighted don't give the impression it's an epidemic. Not acceptable in the least but not a strong link to him being outspoken.

Do you think it was acceptable that Adam deliberately tried to intimidate the crowd? What about him claiming he wouldn't do it to an indigenous player on the opposition team? The so called "war", and I don't think for one second think war is a term that should be applied to a game, is on-field not in the crowd imo. Did it do him, AFL in general or the Indigenous population any favours whatsoever?

I can see two sides to this. Many seem not willing to say a negative word about Aboriginals. We've seen it PRE discussion a lot in the past. I'd prefer to see some balance. To me Adam Goodes has chosen to use the dying stages of his career as a political soap box. He's made a conscious decision to intimidate people and draw attention to himself. I don't like the booing but I don't like some of Adam's behaviour, both on an off the field, either. I didn't like the booing of Jobe Watson, who was also deeply affected by it, either. I don't like the booing of Matty White that others said they understood.

 

[Rosy]

What question is that ? Would the Matty White booing be racist if he was black ? A hypothetical question because a) Matty's not White and b) the booing was nowhere near the scale, veracity and length of time that Goodes is copping. And it would only have come from RFC supporters. Goodes is copping it from the supporters of every team.

A rhetorical question. Obviously hypothetical but Matty is white. Interesting point about the scale and the group booing comes from. I don't think it makes boing any more acceptable. That kind of abuse can have a negative impact on anyone.

As I said above in a response to ninja, but must have got missed in the traffic, if the Goodes booing was only happening when he did something to displease people on the park then I don't think anyone a real handle to call it race related. But the constant, angry abuse he cops everytime he has the ball is over the top.

Of course it's over the top. No doubt in my mind it's a mob mentality, as Jason Mifsud described, rather than a pack of racists. It's become a very unfortunate and unacceptable game.

......
To me it is a simple matter of ignorance. Not deliberate ignorance but ignorance none the less. My parents struggle with my Asian wife. They don't mean to be racist, they are genuinely enquiring about things because they don't know any better. My wife understands the context and is fine by it. But it certainly has made me cringe at times.

......

No doubt done in ignorance. The difference with your wife is the fact Adam has chosen to be in peoples' faces and put himself front and centre.

.......
A bit like blackface. People don't know why it's wrong so they believe it's fine when in fact it's wrong. A bit like half-caste. "caste" is a class system, not a racial system. The connotations of half-caste is that the person is over a lower class. But not knowing that doesn't make a person deliberately racist or mean, but I would hope that once pointed out that it's taken onboard and not misused.

I once called an Englishman of Indian descent and I called him a Paki. I was shocked and the anger that generated. Another guy took my aside and explained what the term "Paki" typicaly meant in England. Despite knowing I had no intention at all to be racist, I went up, apologised and I have, done it since. I was ignorant.

You've highlighted my ignorance Baloo but despite your opinions you still called a player a "short arsed wog" recently on this thread. How is that acceptable. It's an extremely offensive word to some people. A word based on gollywog. A word that could remind people of their heritage and race and an unpleasant not so distant past. Unfortunately I learned how offensive and hurtful it was early in my life.

Edit...I found it very interesting, in the context of this discussion, that nobody commented on the use of the word wog...unless I missed it in traffic.

 

[Baloo]

Short arsed wog was used the same way African Americans use the word nigger. I'm a short arsed wog.

But the term wog has also been reclaimed by the Italians. It used to be offensive until we took ownership of it and wore like a badge of pride. Wogs out of Work had a lot to do with it.

But still, the word can be used to offend so it's in the context and manner it's delivered. Very blurred lines and as such I shouldn't have tried lighting up the mood of this thread with the term wog.

 

[Rosy]

I'd never call anyone a nigger no matter how African Americans use the word. Some may take it lightly and others not. It can be the same with derogative names for indigenous Australians. We have an aboriginal elder friend who calls Aboriginals darkies. I think there would be war if anyone called an indigenous player that. Our neighbours call themselves the wogs. I'd never call anyone of other races terms like that that could offend...the level of offense depends on the individual and their experiences.