Re: Adam Goodes | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Re: Adam Goodes

willo said:
Well I've been called a "big ape" before. I'm neither black nor look anything like an ape (my opinion). I didn't take offence as to whether I was big, or a Neanderthal type, primate looking or whatever.
To split hairs a bit (no pun intended), I've never heard Indigenous people called apes before, but I remember a few years back when Australian cricketer Andrew Symonds was taunted with monkey chants when playing in India. I think Harbhajan Singh may have said something to him as well? It caused a little ripple but nothing much eventuated.
There have been numerous incidents in soccer with black players (mainly overseas, in Europe) getting monkey chants and bananas thrown on the pitch. Is calling someone an ape the same? It may well be to some.

But the question has been raised before, if it was a grand final and it was a close game, would Goodes have walked off? I guess we'll never know. Didn't Goodes state that he'd heard worse or similar before? Why hadn't he raised the issue? Was it because it was the Indigenous Round that it brought it to a head, or did he want to imitate Nicky Winmar to some degree? (cynical?) there was even a photo with Goodes emulating Winwars pose, he may have been p!ssed off with what was said, but my opinion (for what it's worth) was it a massive over reaction, with his pointing the finger and storming off.I think a finger waggle would have got the point across, rather than security escorting and holding the young girl for a couple of hours.
The other point, and I'm only going by the footage, was of the collingwood "supporter" yelling out to the umpire, "give it Goodes, he's black" and "give to Jetta, he's black" and "it's Indigenous round umpire". It's been highlighted in the media as racist comments. For the life of me, I don't see it as racist. As I said, I'm only going on what was shown or printed, if he called them black @&$?!s, I could accept it as racist comments or vilification.
Maybe I need educating on what's racist about those remarks, I'm open to it.

Totally agree willo. Massive over-reaction. The other supporter was shouting sarcasm not racism, but the media just want to add fuel to the fire......

If the naïve want to learn what racism is, look at what Nicky Winmar did in an unpretentious way. Goodes was all 'me'.
 
willo said:
So were Eddie's action and reaction on Friday night, his personal, deeply held belief or actions to protect the "collingwood brand"
"The face of racism" has just got older and more purple

Gold, Willo. Will the real Eddie please stand up?

Good luck with the wet ball on that glass deck you've prepared for yourself, Ed. Your best hope is that we're Daryl Cullinan.
 
Tigers of Old said:
Not mine but someone's very quick.

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Gold.
 
rosy23 said:
I've asked if there are any precedents for indigenous players being called apes, or any other examples of the term being used racially. Nobody has responded. Considering it's claimed it's been a problem for decades there should be plenty of documentation. I am not for one second denying it could have happened. I'm just interested to read the context, reactions and the comments at the time.

The "ape" comments/ideologies go back as far as 1600AD. Now in terms of this sort of thing happening to indigenous players, whether there is "documentation" or not it doesn't detract anything from the argument that its wrong to call non-whites "apes" or anything similar.
 
Jason King said:
The "ape" comments/ideologies go back as far as 1600AD. Now in terms of this sort of thing happening to indigenous players, whether there is "documentation" or not it doesn't detract anything from the argument that its wrong to call non-whites "apes" or anything similar.

I have never claimed it's ok to call non-whites apes. I don't think it's ok to call people apes, dumb moles, morons, spastics, rent boys, *smile* whatever. I don't believe in name calling and I think it shows a real weakness on the part of the person who feels the need to do it.

I also didn't suggest documentation would detract from the issue. It was mentioned on here and I was interested enough to read more about it. Nothing more, nothing less. OK?

My point, that some seem to want to paint me racist for, is that there is an element of doubt the girl called Goodes an ape in a racist way. Maybe it's the mother in me but I can imagine how I'd feel if I had a 13yo daughter being exposed the way this girl is. People claim she knew what she was saying and did it intentionally. It's impossible to know that from what I've read. I have never suggested for one second that her behaviour was acceptable though. It wasn't.
 
tigergollywog said:
nothing personal of course Rosy, but I find these kind of Rumpole-of-the-Bailey routines really pointless. The issue as i see it, boils down to the question "are most Australians racist, even without really knowing it?". I answer a resounding YES. Im figuring you answer NO, but I dont wanna second guess you.

You don't want to second guess me but you offer your opinion anyway? ::)

How would I know if "most" Australians are racist? Are there any stats for it. I've come across a minuscule percentage of our population in my life so aren't qualified to comment on that. Yes, unfortunately and disappointingly, there is racism in every race and culture I've experienced...it's not all one way traffic.
 
rosy23 said:
that some seem to want to paint me racist for

Theres the elephant in the room. I think we are all racist to varying degrees. Its a toughy. Personally, I hold a pretty strong belief that dispossession, rape, murder and slavery are a pretty big cultural burden to carry. This burden perpetuates a sense of worthlessness and hopelessness amongst aboriginal people. Then it becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy. Its an ugly, confrontational, and overwhelming problem our nation faces. I cope with the overwhelming frustration, guilt, remorse and pity by giving black fellas the benefit of the doubt and trying to show them I respect them in subtle ways whenever I can.
 
tigergollywog said:
Theres the elephant in the room.

It's a pretty ordinary elephant and I am disgusted.

tigergollywog said:
I cope with the overwhelming frustration, guilt, remorse and pity by giving black fellas the benefit of the doubt and trying to show them I respect them in subtle ways whenever I can.

There's the difference in us then. I don't think any one race deserves the benefit of the doubt more than any other. I try to treat everyone with respect and judge situations on their merits.
 
rosy23 said:
It's a pretty ordinary elephant and I am disgusted.

There's the difference in us then. I don't think any one race deserves the benefit of the doubt more than any other. I try to treat everyone with respect and judge situations on their merits.

maybe theres 2 elephants :shakehead

fair enough.
 
Will Eddie cancel his own membership like they rightfully did to the Collingwood member who abused Gold Coast's Joel Wikinson?? Lot of people not very happy with Ed.
 
Harry O on Eddie:
It doesn't matter if you are a school teacher, a doctor or even the president of my football club I will not tolerate racism, nor should we as a society. Im extremely disappointed with Eddie's comments and do not care what position he holds, I disagree with what came out his mouth this morning on radio. To me Eddie's comments are reflective of common attitudes that we as a society face. To me Australia is very casual with racism, I would argue that many people in this country would not think what Eddie or the 13yr old girl said last friday is 'bad'. In my opinion race relations in this country is systematically a national disgrace and we have a long way to go to reach a more harmonious and empathetic society.
 
Brodders17 said:
Harry O on Eddie:
It doesn't matter if you are a school teacher, a doctor or even the president of my football club I will not tolerate racism, nor should we as a society. Im extremely disappointed with Eddie's comments and do not care what position he holds, I disagree with what came out his mouth this morning on radio. To me Eddie's comments are reflective of common attitudes that we as a society face. To me Australia is very casual with racism, I would argue that many people in this country would not think what Eddie or the 13yr old girl said last friday is 'bad'. In my opinion race relations in this country is systematically a national disgrace and we have a long way to go to reach a more harmonious and empathetic society.

Geez with the way Bucks is going, it must be real furore at the black and white Pies..... ;D
 
Brodders17 said:
Harry O on Eddie:
It doesn't matter if you are a school teacher, a doctor or even the president of my football club I will not tolerate racism, nor should we as a society. Im extremely disappointed with Eddie's comments and do not care what position he holds, I disagree with what came out his mouth this morning on radio. To me Eddie's comments are reflective of common attitudes that we as a society face. To me Australia is very casual with racism, I would argue that many people in this country would not think what Eddie or the 13yr old girl said last friday is 'bad'. In my opinion race relations in this country is systematically a national disgrace and we have a long way to go to reach a more harmonious and empathetic society.
I read this on FB and I just wondered if this really was Harry.
 
Caro's article says Eddie apologised but Goodes hasn't accepted it. Sorry to say but this bloke is a true sook. Can't stand him.
 
Why should he immediately accept this apology?

He accepted an apology on Friday night on behalf of the Collingwood Football Club delivered personally by the president. The president then trashes that apology with his remarks to a vast listening audience. Then tries to apologise.

If Goodes now feels neither apology to be genuine then that is completely understandable. Unfortunate, yes, but Goodes has the right to make up his own mind based on what has now happened.
 
TigerForce said:
Caro's article says Eddie apologised but Goodes hasn't accepted it. Sorry to say but this bloke is a true sook. Can't stand him.

Caro says: "However, it is believed that Goodes sees the situation differently" ie. not factual.