Matthew Clarke

[Streak]

Now that CJ plays for another team and can't get a kick I think we can all agree that he is a potato.

The bigger spud by a long way is the person who advised him to go to North.

If CJ was ever going to make it, he needed guys up the ground who could win the footy and deliver it half decently.

He is a dead man walking at North. What chances come his way in their forward line are going to be few and far between half chances at best, and he is simply not a good enough contested mark or mobile enough on the ground to make enough of those count.

So my guess is he will play a lot of ruck, for which he looks undersized quite frankly.

 

[The_General]

Now that CJ plays for another team and can't get a kick I think we can all agree that he is a potato.

One game mate. I'd wait until the season is well self truly understudy before solving a fork in him.
North need some time to build their midfield as a unit. They've got lots of very skilled youngsters. Give them time.

 

[Streak]

One game mate. I'd wait until the season is well self truly understudy before solving a fork in him.
North need some time to build their midfield as a unit. They've got lots of very skilled youngsters. Give them time.

Tend to agree General but I fear North is the Richmond of the early 90's.

A graveyard for young careers.

 

[St Kevin]

The bigger spud by a long way is the person who advised him to go to North.

If CJ was ever going to make it, he needed guys up the ground who could win the footy and deliver it half decently.

He is a dead man walking at North. What chances come his way in their forward line are going to be few and far between half chances at best, and he is simply not a good enough contested mark or mobile enough on the ground to make enough of those count.

So my guess is he will play a lot of ruck, for which he looks undersized quite frankly.

The problem for CCJ is Xerri looks to have taken a pretty big leap as ruck, and spent more time in there than Goldstein who they have also been playing forward alongside Larkey and Zurhaar. So if he wanted to play as a ruckman, someone has leapfrogged him in the space of one offseason. Agree with your comments regarding him playing forward in a side like North. He'd be close to the VFL if Noble decides that they're too tall.

 

[Leysy Days]

Hindsight is easy people. 17 a bust? Fruitcake city. We won the flag! by definition the draft was the most difficult for us. Us. We got Balta. In our mitt. He's in the side. Walk up start. That means we won the draft, statistically, objectively. I'll say it again, statistically, objectively.

But thats not all folks, we got Higgins who we got evens for on a trade, and regardless of what you think of him, is still playing seniors. Ditto CCJ.

It ain't the vibe, its data dummy. We remain ahead of the curve.

Ridiculous.

Our drafting overall over the past few years has been very underwhelming though. Even without high end picks a few of our more recent drafts are looking like us ending up below par and sucking our thumb.

The 2018 and 2019 drafts where we did invest heavily numbers wise could well end up near complete wipeouts with no bankable's yet coming through. We need that crop influencing games now.

A real risk it leaves:

1) Us without enough young talent pushing through to challenge this year and next
2) Longer term a hole in our list age demographic wise

Definitely a concern.

 

[Dev Tiger]

You look at Sydney and they have added Rowbottom, McInerney, Stephens and Warner accross those 2018 and 2019 drafts. Only Stephens was an early pick. That has allowed them to play Kennedy a lot off the half back flank. We still have to flog the Chimp in the midfield.

 

[tigersnake]

Our drafting overall over the past few years has been very underwhelming though. Even without high end picks a few of our more recent drafts are looking like us ending up below par and sucking our thumb.

The 2018 and 2019 drafts where we did invest heavily numbers wise could well end up near complete wipeouts with no bankable's yet coming through. We need that crop influencing games now.

A real risk it leaves:

1) Us without enough young talent pushing through to challenge this year and next
2) Longer term a hole in our list age demographic wise

Definitely a concern.

I agree we haven't drafted many stars lately, or even decent players. I agree with 1 and 2, that our lack of drafted talent has brought us back to the pack.

I disagree about the reasons. To me our drafting hasn't been bad, we just haven't had the picks (or the cap). The 17 Draft was very good IMO, Balta is a player and potential star, Higgins and CCJ considered to be decent players as reflected in games played or draft currency. Since then not much, but that is explained by the picks. (Baker, Pickett, Mansell and Parker not included on that table and are in the mix). Look at the numbers in Dyer'eres table above, ie the pick number, I'd say we are par for those numbers, might be a bit above or below but thats by the by. For a number of reasons, retirements, the 2021 draft, maybe sliding this year and the fact we still have a good core, we can regen and go again pretty quickly.

 

[spook]

Whether Higlet and CJ are decent players, they were the wrong players.

 

[tigersnake]

Whether Higlet and CJ are decent players, they were the wrong players.

Maybe. Thats not the point AFAIC. We got Balta from that draft. That draft is a win on that alone. In any given draft, if you get one good and one decent player, statistically, its above par and a win.

edit, I mean any given standard or average club draft. Of course there are outliers when a wooden spooner goes all in like us 04, etc etc.

 

[Redford]

Whether Higlet and CJ are decent players, they were the wrong players.

The “no dheads” policy seemed to go out the door, maybe, with those two.

 

[spook]

Maybe. Thats not the point AFAIC. We got Balta from that draft. That draft is a win on that alone. In any given draft, if you get one good and one decent player, statistically, its above par and a win.

edit, I mean any given standard or average club draft. Of course there are outliers when a wooden spooner goes all in like us 04, etc etc.

Selecting the right players/types is always the point. A short, slow, fatty who couldn't kick and a short ruckman who couldn't jump were the wrong picks. Mistakes. Errors of judgement.

 

[tigersnake]

Selecting the right players/types is always the point. A short, slow, fatty who couldn't kick and a short ruckman who couldn't jump were the wrong picks. Mistakes. Errors of judgement.

Hindsight is easy. And the fact is, taking out all context, errors of judgement happen. But the fact is they weren't total busts. They might be for the clubs they went to. Higgins hasn't done what the saints had hoped so you can say he's a bust for them. And my money is on CCJ being a bust for Norf. But they weren't busts for us.

 

[spook]

Hindsight is easy. And the fact is, taking out all context, errors of judgement happen. But the fact is they weren't total busts. They might be for the clubs they went to. Higgins hasn't done what the saints had hoped so you can say he's a bust for them. And my money is on CCJ being a bust for Norf. But they weren't busts for us.

Hindsight, schmidsight. A recruiter is judged on foresight.

 

[Redford]

Where other clubs are concerned, I like big busts I cannot lie, (you other brothers can not deny either.)

 

[tigersnake]

Hindsight, schmidsight. A recruiter is judged on foresight.

Ha ha. So whats your pass mark? and what is it based on?

 

[spook]

Ha ha. So whats your pass mark? and what is it based on?

Judgement is based on: did the recruiter bring in a player who is going to improve the team? Does the player have qualities we value and which are required in the modern game?

We got our money back on those two. But if I asked you to give me $1000 today on the guarantee I'd give you $1000 two years from now, are you happy?

 

[tigersnake]

Judgement is based on: did the recruiter bring in a player who is going to improve the team? Does the player have qualities we value and which are required in the modern game?

We got our money back on those two. But if I asked you to give me $1000 today on the guarantee I'd give you $1000 two years from now, are you happy?

In the uber high risk caper of drafting, and considering the whole context, yep I'm happy. I'm happy if I come home from the races after only losing $50. If they are delisted after playing 3 or 4 games without firing a shot, thats a bust, I'm not happy.

Also I'd argue both players improved our team, maybe not dramatically, maybe not long terms but the draft picks we got for them will come into that.. Higgins played some great games in some big games in the top side. CCJ was knocking on the door and putting pressure on JR and TL. The 'end the CCJ farce' was a strong theme on here for a long time.

 

[spook]

In the uber high risk caper of drafting, and considering the whole context, yep I'm happy. I'm happy if I come home from the races after only losing $50. If they are delisted after playing 3 or 4 games without firing a shot, thats a bust, I'm not happy.

Can I have $1000?

 

[tigersnake]

Can I have $1000?

Ha ha, like I said, in the uber high risk world....

 

[spook]

Ha ha, like I said, in the uber high risk world....

Fair enough. My opinion is we pay Matt Clarke to be able to project that short, fat, slow, Jack Higgins who couldn't hit the side of a jam jar but took a year off everything but footy to prepare for the draft, was still going to be short, fat, slow and a horrendous kick once he got to the bigs, and we would therefore be more prudent spending pick 17 on someone with greater upside, as well as need. He might have projected Higlet to be a midfielder, because under-18 numbers. He was wrong. He stated in an interview a couple of years later that he liked Higgins because he'd overcome his limitations. But he didn't account for those limitations continuing to limit Higgo for football eternity.

Not every pick is going to be a success. But the thinking on Higgo and CJ was muddled. Like Jack says, glad to see we look to have corrected our course, this latest crop looks a beauty. More along these lines, please Matt.