-
IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
Ivan Maric
- Thread starter Tigertool
- Start date
If you read my comment correctly you would have realized that I added 1 goal per game for the fact that next year Vickery will get to stay forward as opposed to being asked to play more in the ruck.GoodOne said:
So, I think that if we had had just a solid competitive ruck this year we would have been on average a 2-3 goal better team per game. So, yes, if Maric is a solid competitive ruck and he had played for us this year in all 22 games then I feel no doubt that we would have one several more games. As for just adding 2-3 goals each game and retallying the scores that is just stupid. It is an average. I wasn't highlighting Graham's stats and hit outs I was simply highlighting his and Browne's ability to positively and negatively influence a game. And they were atrocious in 2011. Very little positive influences during the four quarters and a ridiculous amount of uncompetitive efforts that were un afl-like.
I have been very positive about our future for some time but a realist about where we were at and was very confident we would finish down where we did even after the good start. But next year, if we are healthy, I feel there is no way we will not make the 8. A competitive ruck was the last missing piece for us to take the next step and become a lower top 8 team. If Maric is competitive, or Graham or Browne come good and we have a good run with injuries, look out. We will not be a premiership contender, but top 8 absolutely, because of our match winners who will start to really influence games more.
frangalis4eva said:
Granted at times Troy Simmonds seemed to take forever to pick up the flight of the ball, we shouldn't forget that he was almost All Australian for us at one point. The end came quickly with leg injuries preventing him (a shortish ruckman) from getting off the ground.
frickenel said:
Even then his endevour couldnt be questioned. Good old Troy busted his ass trying to get his speed back, he even took sprinting lessons.
Jason King said:
I don't think the blood clot problem or whatever wouldve helped either.
We should never have given him a 5 year deal but having said that he gave his all for the club.
If Simmo hadn't had the injury he would have been a very good ruckman for more years than he was and the side wouldn't be in its current mess in the ruck. Even with the limited service Simmo gave the Tigers they still did the best out of that deal. Fiora didn't last long at the Saints and Black hardly played for Freo.
Losing Troy Simmonds to injury at the time we did, is one of this sides biggest losses at the time.
structure wise he was just about our most important player.
I was a big fan, especially when he got close to AA. was very good to watch.
One negative, He was definately the same as most rucks we train, he also jumped early in ruck contests.
structure wise he was just about our most important player.
I was a big fan, especially when he got close to AA. was very good to watch.
One negative, He was definately the same as most rucks we train, he also jumped early in ruck contests.
Juffaricho said:
Fair enough but Vickery didn't play in the ruck much this year anyway. And I don't think it's wise to not give Vickery some time in the ruck. He's only 21 and still the best ruck prospect on our list by a mile and needs to continue his development.
Juffaricho said:
K so you say we'd be better of by an average of 3-4 goals a game (slipped down by a goal now I see) but then don't want anyone to apply that theory to our results to test how realistic that would be.
Juffaricho said:
You said our worst ruck performance in 20 years. I simply don't agree. Who in the past few years has been able to positivly influence our games in the ruck. And how often has Maric done so far for you to come to this conclusion? Our ruck was poor but far from atrocious as the previous stats I provided atest.
Juffaricho said:
The best teams (see Collingwood's hitout stat for this year, last in differential for hitous) have midfields that will overcome poor rucks, however of course it is beneficial to have a top ruckman in the side. We will need to wait and see whether Maric will become that ruckman. Our ruck is not why we didn't make finals this year. I believe the number of injuries to key backline players had a higher influence on our end result. If Maric can give a bit more AND our up-and-coming key defenders remain fit AND our younger players continue to improve to the next level next year then we will be serious top 8 material.
GoodOne said:
He jumped early because he was 196-197cm and his leap was his way of competing. If he tried to outreach his opponents he would have lost every time.
Lennox Street said:
if you were using your superior leap surely you still want to time it so that you reach the top of your jump rather than being on the way down when the ball reaches the right spot? I still think it's a negative tactic when you know you even chance of winning the tap is lower.
GoodOne said:
No, you use percentage, so adding 15 points per game (2-3 goals) puts our percentage at 100%, simimar to Kangaroos, 9th and Essendon 8th this year.
GoodOne said:
Simmonds was very very good until the end of 2008 when I asked to trade him and cash in on his value. Since then it has gone progressively worse, But a slowed Simmonds as much better than those 2 this year. You think they were bad, I think they were absolutely horrendous.... fine we have different opinions...who cares.
Again your focusing on the stats too much. When the Collingwood ruck man were losing a tap out they still compete and influence where the ball goes through body contact. Graham and Browne were giving "free shots" to the ruck men and they were regularly putting it on a platter. And how many times did we see Graham himself put it directly in the hands of the opposition for a clean breakaway. And don't forget the frees against for just walking into the opponent. It was a farce. Those things are what made our ruck work atrocious and the worst I have seen in 20 years.GoodOne said:
And after all your insight you give the same summary. I said "if" we get a competitive ruck (I don't give a crap if it is Maric or someone else - just someone competitive) and I said exactly the same thing about our back line and young guys. Thanks for the amazing insight.
GoodOne said:
The idea back then was to jump early and get your knee onto the opponent's hip, thus getting extra lift from the opponent - much the same as a player who gets a ride on someone's back and gets sprung further into the air as their ride also tries to leave the ground.
These days i think you'd get pinged for shepparding!
Lade had a habit of checking an opponent's position before going up and seems to have passed this on to our rucks. It worked for him at the time, but in this day and age it seems that even looking at your opponent gets you penalized on the basis that the umpire assumes you ain't watching the ball therefore you're shepparding your opponent out of the competition.
In fairness to Gumpus, he got pinged for this so often it was almost comical. Umpires paid no respect to the fact that he'd contest the hit out, but first check an opponents position - which surely can't be illegal under the current rules.
TheCan said:
There will be another Mitch Clark available in 2 or 3 years when we are a premiership contender. He is a very good player but no champion.
But it would be better ti have a couple more mids before we sell the house.
And don't forget, if Griffiths comes good as the coaches think he will then you may find Vickery becomes a top tier ruck in 2 or 3 years anyway.
Steady growth is the key. Let's not go too early like in the past.
<
Rd 1 2021
|
MRJ and No.17
>
