Damien Hardwick

[RoarEmotion]

Like any employee. The data would be owned by the employer. If he leaves and we lose 20 years worth of IP, we may as well shut the club down for incompetence.

You missed my point and/or I didn’t make it very well

I’d imagine it’s a bespoke database that he built. I doubt anyone else knows how to drive it really well. And beyond that it’s not the data it’s the wealth of experience and mistakes that you learn from that won’t just get instantly replaced. (This is on the presumption he was really good at what he does of which I have no idea.)

 

[Smoking Aces]

I can’t understand why there aren’t clauses in contracts held by those in important positions where they cannot take staff with them if they move to another club.

 

[HKTigerB]

.......

I’d imagine it’s a bespoke database that he built. I doubt anyone else knows how to drive it really well. And beyond that it’s not the data it’s the wealth of experience and mistakes that you learn from that won’t just get instantly replaced. (This is on the presumption he was really good at what he does of which I have no idea.)

Spot on. It is a bespoke DB. Plus he understood data and causality. Basically became a data scientist in his role. It's funny on the recruiting threads we now have Francis Jackson regarded as a very good recruiter. Hayden built the DB (from scratch) that identified the potential recruits. In the 2006 draft Hayden provided the data and analysis from a technical perspective that made Shane Edwards pick 26. Francis and Greg Miller presented to a group of us (Phantom was there) and Hayden was the 3rd spoke in the wheel.

And before anyone piles in, yes I know there have been misses, but the level of insight into gameplans, skills, potential, capability that the level of data he developed is second to none in the AFL. And that will be in his head not documented formally.

Yeah I'm a wannabee data scientist. I'm not one, but I understand the insight that they can provide. So I value his skill very, very highly.

 

[seven]

You missed my point and/or I didn’t make it very well

I’d imagine it’s a bespoke database that he built. I doubt anyone else knows how to drive it really well. And beyond that it’s not the data it’s the wealth of experience and mistakes that you learn from that won’t just get instantly replaced. (This is on the presumption he was really good at what he does of which I have no idea.)

Did he have an assistant?

We need the next Peter Brand from moneyball

 

[The_General]

Spot on. It is a bespoke DB. Plus he understood data and causality. Basically became a data scientist in his role. It's funny on the recruiting threads we now have Francis Jackson regarded as a very good recruiter. Hayden built the DB (from scratch) that identified the potential recruits. In the 2006 draft Hayden provided the data and analysis from a technical perspective that made Shane Edwards pick 26. Francis and Greg Miller presented to a group of us (Phantom was there) and Hayden was the 3rd spoke in the wheel.

And before anyone piles in, yes I know there have been misses, but the level of insight into gameplans, skills, potential, capability that the level of data he developed is second to none in the AFL. And that will be in his head not documented formally.

Yeah I'm a wannabee data scientist. I'm not one, but I understand the insight that they can provide. So I value his skill very, very highly.

I was there the same night. Hayden was putting the DB together though on request from Frank. So I think Frank had the requirements in his head, he just needed
someone to make them useable. I remember them having players grouped up and compared to players in a similiar position via height/weight and athletic performance/ratings. A bit of "Player X is like that player". I'm sure there's a lot of folks who can do data mining - and Richmond can employ one.

It'll take a long time I'm guessing to make them as useful as HH - hence I think they need to try steal one from Champion data or another one of those organisations potentially outside clubland.

 

[eddazol]

Whos Left


2017- 2019 - 2020.

Martin

Nank

Grimes

Broad

Vlastuin

D Rioli

Prestia


2019 - 2020

Lynch

Bolton

Baker

Pickett

Short


2017 - 2020

Graham

McIntosh


2020 -

Balta

Soldo 2019 ?

 

[TonyJewell'sPiercing]

look, they're a good side. But we will focus on what we can control

Dreamtime.
We always look forward to the clash of the sash.

 

[TonyJewell'sPiercing]

Watching a snippet of the Collingwood game.
They have stripmined our tactics with the running formation.
It's depressing to see, but still everyone has the right to copy I guess.

 

[HKTigerB]

I was there the same night. Hayden was putting the DB together though on request from Frank. So I think Frank had the requirements in his head, he just needed
someone to make them useable. I remember them having players grouped up and compared to players in a similiar position via height/weight and athletic performance/ratings. A bit of "Player X is like that player". I'm sure there's a lot of folks who can do data mining - and Richmond can employ one.

It'll take a long time I'm guessing to make them as useful as HH - hence I think they need to try steal one from Champion data or another one of those organisations potentially outside clubland.

Yeah was interesting stuff comparing 17 year old's wrist diameter to 23 year old and 30 year old players and identifying potential growth. I will accept that Frank had idea's in his head and HH structured that but you could see the filters that he was applying and thus identifying trends. And this was in the era when data mining was just starting and was expensive. HH was trying t create that DB. That is part intuitive and part learned and that learning is long. This is not easily taught or transferred. It's why teh good analysts at merchant banks and share traders make all the money.

 

[davidc0055]

Watching a snippet of the Collingwood game.
They have stripmined our tactics with the running formation.
It's depressing to see, but still everyone has the right to copy I guess.

GWS as well under Kingsley

 

[craig]

Soldo 2019 ?

Cheers amended

 

[Stig]

So not a fan, Stig?

Nope
He worked under Frawley , Plough and Dimma
Reason he has gone with Dimma as he is so far up his backside he had to go .
Needed operation to seperate

 

[Stig]

Hayden Hill is a great loss. He built IP from scratch. I've seen it up close. His evaluation of player skill sets is probably what has helped identify many of our lower draft picks. Whilst the club owns the technical IP you can't own something in someone's head. the ability to analyse and understand data and data links and causality and trends. Hayden has that and loads more.

A big loss.

Really a big loss ? Ah no
Dusty would be a big loss
Lynch was a big loss this year
Craig McCrae huge loss as was Leppa
Hayden isn’t a big loss !
Been at the club for 22 years . Tell me how he went for first 15 years
Oh dear
Rob Innes big loss ! Recovery never been the same over past 3 years

 

[The_General]

In a Tigers Facebook group, there's claims (by multiple people) that it was "well known" Hayden and his family had been saying they wanted to move to Queensland for several years. Easy pick for Dimma if true.

 

[gutfull]

Dimma can go forth right now he is no longer a Richmond man .
To me he is tbe opposition so he can go forth ....

 

[The Mole]

Dimma can go forth right now he is no longer a Richmond man .
To me he is tbe opposition so he can go forth ....

That’s the spirit! Love the past Dimma and will remember him fondly, but plastic future Dimma I can’t stand.

 

[Brodders17]

I can’t understand why there aren’t clauses in contracts held by those in important positions where they cannot take staff with them if they move to another club.

Im guessing for a start cos Hardwick isnt employing him, the Suns are. It would be pretty restrictive to stop guys in those positions moving to another club.

 

[TT33]

I can’t understand why there aren’t clauses in contracts held by those in important positions where they cannot take staff with them if they move to another club.

It'd be almost impossible to enforce. An individual is allowed to change their place of employment. Thats the way its always been.

We've got many folks from other clubs the same way.

 

[MD Jazz]

I can’t understand why there aren’t clauses in contracts held by those in important positions where they cannot take staff with them if they move to another club.

Huh. Restraint of trade ring a bell?

You missed my point and/or I didn’t make it very well

I’d imagine it’s a bespoke database that he built. I doubt anyone else knows how to drive it really well. And beyond that it’s not the data it’s the wealth of experience and mistakes that you learn from that won’t just get instantly replaced. (This is on the presumption he was really good at what he does of which I have no idea.)

I doubt it's that sophisticated that no one else on the planet knows how it works!

 

[taztiger4]

Hayden Hill is a great loss. He built IP from scratch. I've seen it up close. His evaluation of player skill sets is probably what has helped identify many of our lower draft picks. Whilst the club owns the technical IP you can't own something in someone's head. the ability to analyse and understand data and data links and causality and trends. Hayden has that and loads more.

A big loss.

Na, I dont think thats correct.

The software / system we use for recruitment is not what HH did

I have seen both at work

I think the recruitment program was called Playtrack or similar