Coronavirus

[AngryAnt]

Not quite right lamby. The below article explains it better below.

The free covid testing that they are removing are free rapid testing kits that gets them into certain sites (like sports stadiums / bars etc), with the replacement essentially being vaccination. This isn't because they aren't interested in case numbers, but because this is actually deterring Germans from being vaccinated, they have seen a significant decline in the vaccination rate per day recently and this is designed to increase the vaccination rate, rather than people relying on rapid antigen testing to get them into these sites.

Good try though.

Germany to abolish free Covid testing in bid to get more people vaccinated

New regulations part of government efforts to incentivise those without jabs amid a rapidly rising case rate

www.theguardian.com

Lamb jumping too early on a good conspiracy theory? Who'd have thunk it.

 

[AngryAnt]

Just on the Joe Rogan instance stated above by Lamby.

He claims to have taken Ivermectin as well as monoclonal antibodies (as well as a bunch of other stuff).

Funnily enough monoclonal antibodies are approved by the FDA for treatment of Covid.

Anti-SARS-CoV-2 Monoclonal Antibodies | COVID-19 Treatment Guidelines

Read information about anti-SARS-CoV-2 monoclonal antibodies and COVID-19.

www.covid19treatmentguidelines.nih.gov

How does he know it was Ivermectin and not the monoclinal antibodies that defeated Covid?

Or that he was one of great majority who show symptoms but don't get seriously ill. Anecdotal evidence.

 

[lamb22]

Lamby I get that you are fully behind Ivermectin. I'm not a scientist, nor profess to be one and haven't done anywhere near as much research as others, but as I said in another post, a lot of the research into Ivermectin appears to be anecdotal and not in closed conditions. Even the article you reference there about Joe Rogan it says "Among the many medications he used, he said, was ivermectin, a drug used to deworm horses.". So why then has he only spoken about Ivermectin, when it clearly says "among the many medications".

So essentially he threw a cocktail of drugs together, got better (which may have been related to his age as he is still young and healthy), but claims that the only one that seemed to benefit was Ivermectin.

This is why there is a need for closed studies. I believe Ozford University is conducting one right now.

I'm certainly not against any drug that makes things better but a lot of the studies seem to be anecdotal. Do you disagree with that or do you have better info that shows closed trials?

Poshy, I dont think Rogan claimed anything. It was a horrible article full of distortions seeking to make Joe out to be misinformed or a dinosaur. Critical care doctors have set out protocols to tackle Covid. We don't have a cure but we have potential treatments. Joe would most likely have thrown Vitamin C and D in because they assist the immune response. Vitamin D in fact modulates the inflammatory response. Zinc would be part of the solution as it fights the virus. The hype behind Hydroxychloroquin was that it makes the cell more permeable to allow zinc in to fight the virus. Aspirin would be part of the regime as clotting is a common feature in the more serious Covid infections. He probably took Quercertin (which I keep up through eating berries daily) He might have thrown in some anti androgens as there is some promising research coming out of Brazil. Interestingly because Ivermectin is so commonly used in Brazil when they do the anti androgen trials Ivermectin is actually part of the control group or "standard of care".

However the most effective anti viral based on the medical literature is Ivermectin and that would be key in any treatment. I posted a video yesterday on its mechanisms which has supporting evidence. You should have a look if you get the time.

BTW HIV is treated (quite successfully) through a cocktail of anti viral and other drugs. There is no silver bullet but each treatment adds a little to your body's fight against the disease.

 

[Ian4]

If NSW is the model of what lies in store for all of us, then serious discussions are needed. Doherty Institute modelling predicts, even with 70% of the population vaccinated, 80 people will die each day six months after the outbreak. That’s 2,240 who will die each month.

which supports what I have been arguing about the failures of the Doherty Report in recent days. Palasczuk is panicking, because she rightly knows that NSW will be hitting 10,000 cases per day in a few weeks and it’s a certainty Delta will leak into to QLD, like it has in VIC.

 

[lamb22]

If Joe did take Monoclonal antibodies it is possible that they were as effective or more effective than Ivermectin in his case. It is invasive though and only effective if given early in the stages of the disease. Also standard of care here as I keep telling everyone is go home and isolate and don't go to hospital until you get sick. People like Joe KNOW that EARLY treatment increases the likelihood of a positive outcome.

That's the beauty of being rich though. You usually get access to the best information and can afford it all.

 

[jb03]

I thought we had agreed on this thread that the Doherty modelling is nonsense and shouldn't be referenced.

 

[AngryAnt]

If Joe did take Monoclonal antibodies it is possible that they were as effective or more effective than Ivermectin in his case. It is invasive though and only effective if given early in the stages of the disease. Also standard of care here as I keep telling everyone is go home and isolate and don't go to hospital until you get sick. People like Joe KNOW that EARLY treatment increases the likelihood of a positive outcome.

That's the beauty of being rich though. You usually get access to the best information and can afford it all.

And your exposure is low because you don't live in one room with 5 family members, and you don't have to go out and work on the streets to feed that family. Like the vast majority of the world's population.

People like Joe Rogan and Donald Trump "beating" Covid really doesn't impress me.

 

[mrposhman]

Poshy, I dont think Rogan claimed anything. It was a horrible article full of distortions seeking to make Joe out to be misinformed or a dinosaur. Critical care doctors have set out protocols to tackle Covid. We don't have a cure but we have potential treatments. Joe would most likely have thrown Vitamin C and D in because they assist the immune response. Vitamin D in fact modulates the inflammatory response. Zinc would be part of the solution as it fights the virus. The hype behind Hydroxychloroquin was that it makes the cell more permeable to allow zinc in to fight the virus. Aspirin would be part of the regime as clotting is a common feature in the more serious Covid infections. He probably took Quercertin (which I keep up through eating berries daily) He might have thrown in some anti androgens as there is some promising research coming out of Brazil. Interestingly because Ivermectin is so commonly used in Brazil when they do the anti androgen trials Ivermectin is actually part of the control group or "standard of care".

However the most effective anti viral based on the medical literature is Ivermectin and that would be key in any treatment. I posted a video yesterday on its mechanisms which has supporting evidence. You should have a look if you get the time.

BTW HIV is treated (quite successfully) through a cocktail of anti viral and other drugs. There is no silver bullet but each treatment adds a little to your body's fight against the disease.

Rogan did claim something. Its on an instagram video shown in this CNN clip of it.

You are making assumptions of what he took. He took 4 specific drugs of which at least 2 (possibly 3) of them have been approved for emergency use by the CDC and FDA. You know which one hasn't I assume.

 

[AngryAnt]

Joe Rogan knows his audience.

 

[22nd Man]

I have to ask should I know who Joe Rogan is? (WIll look him up now)

 

[DavidSSS]

Geebus, a lot of you guys really binge on the blue pills. I gave you a study of 1195 health workers which clearly shows ivermectin has an effect on Covid with standard dosing. How can you just dismiss it? Some of the 'nut jobs' who support it are pre eminent interventionist medicine experts and scientists including by the way Satoshi Amura 2015 Nobel prize winner for MEDICINE!!

Nice of you to quote my post, but you forgot this bit:

So Lamb, you are a big advocate for Ivermectin - are you taking it or are you all talk?

My question remains, apparently you can use the Horse Parasite treatment as a prophylactic, so, are you? Or are you all talk?

Anecdotal evidence is not accepted in scientific circles for very good reasons. Find me a double blind, peer reviewed, test of Ivermectin in which it is the only treatment and we will start to get somewhere. YouTube videos simply don't cut it.

All the vaccines were tested in this way and it is grossly irresponsible to promote this drug without the scientific evidence to back up your case. There are very good reasons why we get new drugs and new vaccines extensively tested before they are recommended.

DS

 

[mrposhman]

Nice of you to quote my post, but you forgot this bit:



My question remains, apparently you can use the Horse Parasite treatment as a prophylactic, so, are you? Or are you all talk?

Anecdotal evidence is not accepted in scientific circles for very good reasons. Find me a double blind, peer reviewed, test of Ivermectin in which it is the only treatment and we will start to get somewhere. YouTube videos simply don't cut it.

All the vaccines were tested in this way and it is grossly irresponsible to promote this drug without the scientific evidence to back up your case. There are very good reasons why we get new drugs and new vaccines extensively tested before they are recommended.

DS

We may find out soon, in a proper controlled trial whether the anecdotal benefits that have been seen are due to Ivermectin or due to something else.

Ivermectin to be investigated as a possible treatment for COVID-19 in Oxford’s PRINCIPLE trial | University of Oxford

23 June 2021

www.ox.ac.uk

 

[Redford]

I have to ask should I know who Joe Rogan is? (WIll look him up now)

Your brain will never be the same again.

 

[taztiger4]

Re this Ivermectin talk & reference to being used for Horse parasite treatment.

Are people aware its used by 1000s of humans daily as a treatment for rosacea ?

Obviously not ingested by applied topically.

 

[Sintiger]

Note the Palasczuk tweet below. The Doherty modelling predicts 80 deaths a day at 70% fully vaccinated. Vaccines are vital but need help!



Annastacia Palaszczuk
@AnnastaciaMP
·
3h

If NSW is the model of what lies in store for all of us, then serious discussions are needed. Doherty Institute modelling predicts, even with 70% of the population vaccinated, 80 people will die each day six months after the outbreak. That’s 2,240 who will die each month.

I am not sure that is right although I stand to be corrected. My understanding is that it says that without some form of lockdown at 70% vaccination the RO is still above 1 and therefore case numbers will still grow and then hospitalisation rates are still high and people die . At 80% vaccination the need for lockdown is not there but we still need some public health measures, such as some mask wearing and social distancing

 

[AngryAnt]

Re this Ivermectin talk & reference to being used for Horse parasite treatment.

Are people aware its used by 1000s of humans daily as a treatment for rosacea ?

Obviously not ingested by applied topically.

Yes. Ivermectin has been used as a human treatment for parasites for decades, that's not in dispute.

 

[lamb22]

And your exposure is low because you don't live in one room with 5 family members, and you don't have to go out and work on the streets to feed that family. Like the vast majority of the world's population.

People like Joe Rogan and Donald Trump "beating" Covid really doesn't impress me.

Agree not really impressive. Tens of millions in Uttar Pradesh on the other hand, very impressive.

 

[AngryAnt]

Agree not really impressive. Tens of millions in Uttar Pradesh on the other hand, very impressive.

Agree Lamby. I'm sceptical it's all down to a little ivermectin supplement in kits that will run out in a few days and more down to all the other things they did, but I'm a sceptical guy.

When real evidence from high quality trials comes in, then I'll be begging your forgiveness.

 

[DavidSSS]

Ivermectin not exactly healthy when taken on the advice of social media: https://www.theguardian.com/austral...erdosing-on-ivermectin-and-other-online-cures

Here's a few quotes:

From Westmead Hospital's toxicologist:

“There’s no evidence to support the use of ivermectin to treat Covid-19. Don’t look for magic cures online, and don’t rely on what’s being peddled on the internet, because none of them work.”

From Australia's Chief Medical Officer Prof Paul Kelly:

“The reality is, there are many trials that have been done into ivermectin, not a single one of them have shown to be effective,” he said.

“Now, in the future, maybe that will change. We’ve learnt to be nimble in our appraisal of the scientific evidence right throughout this pandemic, but absolutely and categorically please do not take unproven medicine at this time.”

“It is ineffective and not safe.”

From the FDA in the USA:

The FDA warned side-effects from taking ivermectin could include “skin rash, nausea, vomiting, diarrhoea, stomach pain, facial or limb swelling, neurologic adverse events (dizziness, seizures, confusion), sudden drop in blood pressure, severe skin rash potentially requiring hospitalisation, and liver injury (hepatitis).

“Laboratory test abnormalities include decrease in white cell count and elevated liver tests. Any use of ivermectin for the prevention or treatment of Covid-19 should be avoided.”

Go ahead, take it for River Blindness (haven't noticed a lot of that in Aus) but this is an unproven drug for COVID and it does have side effects.

DS

 

[lamb22]

Brian Stelter

https://www.thewrap.com/cnn-brian-stelter-shredded-by-own-guest-michael-wolff-video/

Prednizone is interesting. You wouldn't take it unless you had significant breathing issues. It's a steroid and used in moderate to severe covid. Probably an overkill if he only had mild symptoms.

That CNN piece was embarrassing. The pause when the 'medical expert' was asked about safety was telling. She totally avoided human medication (approved by FDA) and started waffling on about horse medication.

CNN are real pimps for their owners, board members and major advertisers. I suppose it's what you guys consider real news.

BTW the medical expert in that CNN clip was an example of a 'biostitute' (great term )