Atheism

[Six Pack]

I guess that this is another reason why Christians believe that Homosexuality is wrong. .

Jay, you should say 'some christians.'

Not all christians believe that homosexuality is wrong. some Christians are homosexual. Some aren't. Some believe it's wrong, others don't.

And likewise with people who have other spiritual beliefs. And those with no set beliefs.

It's not so black and white as you suggest.

 

[hutstar]

Some atheists claim the universe itself is infinite. There's not much difference between that and claiming that an infinite God created it is there? In facts it's basically the same theory without the superfluous god.

Well something, someone must be responsible for creation. We need to get to the bottom of this.

I have always thought that this is a real differentiator - God explains the inexplicable, even if it does it badly. Those of us willing to go along with a scientific model of understanding accept that we are limited in what we know and are willing to change our beliefs based on evidence- thus 'open minded' Vs 'narrow-minded'. Now i know the auto comback to this (geeze we have been debating this for a while) will be that even though we accept that we don't know everything we dismiss a god based theory; just as narrow minded. No, its not. We have given the God and creation theory a considerable amount of consideration before dismissing it out of hand and decided that based on the evidence and the logic involved, it just does not sound either plausible or possible to a degree that we can accept. Could there be a creator etc? sure, could be, but as pantera said, could be pink elephants or Jack Dyer but almost certainly nothing at all BASED ON OUR CURRENT KNOWLEDGE AND THE EVIDENCE PRESENTED TO US, combined with our intelligence or lack there of.
(tired, need beer.)

 

[Rosy]

Hi Guys, so where are we up to?

Trying to make sense of Harry's comment below.

If you are an atheist you have to beleive that there is life elsewhere.

Why?

 

[hutstar]

BTW, cant we just combine this with the other thread? We should start one on Hinduism or something too- we are far more likely to reach agreement on that one.

 

[Disco08]

Yeah, this one hasn't really turned out like I hoped just yet, but it still might.

 

[tigerdave]

BTW, cant we just combine this with the other thread? We should start one on Hinduism or something too- we are far more likely to reach agreement on that one.

Or, Buddha isn't really fat! ;D

 

[RemoteTiger]

BTW, cant we just combine this with the other thread? We should start one on Hinduism or something too- we are far more likely to reach agreement on that one.

Or, Buddha isn't really fat! ;D

He must be!

'cause my wife says I've got the body of a God...........................Buddha!

 

[evo]

Buddha was actually skinny as a rake.

Wouldn't you be after sitting under a Fig tree for 2 years?

Buddha is a likely to be a big fat dude as Jesus is to look like a blond haired Ayrian.

 

[Harry]

Hi Guys, so where are we up to?

Trying to make sense of Harry's comment below.

If you are an atheist you have to beleive that there is life elsewhere.

Why?

If we are not God's creation and we just happen to exist from a big bang, then the chances of other life forms living on other planets in this infinite Universe would be huge, if not 100%.

 

[tigerdave]

BTW, cant we just combine this with the other thread? We should start one on Hinduism or something too- we are far more likely to reach agreement on that one.

Or, Buddha isn't really fat! ;D

He must be!

'cause my wife says I've got the body of a God...........................Buddha!

Magnificent!!! :hihi

 

[Rosy]

If we are not God's creation and we just happen to exist from a big bang, then the chances of other life forms living on other planets in this infinite Universe would be huge, if not 100%.

I still don't follow the logic Harry. The chances of other life may well be huge but as yet we haven't seen much evidence to prove it does exist. I don't see why it's something people who don't believe in God must believe in.

I have no evidence of either God or other lifeforms and thus remain open minded about both. Maybe we need an agnosticism thread. :hihi

 

[Djevv]

Hi Guys, so where are we up to?

Trying to make sense of Harry's comment below.

If you are an atheist you have to beleive that there is life elsewhere.

Why?

If we are not God's creation and we just happen to exist from a big bang, then the chances of other life forms living on other planets in this infinite Universe would be huge, if not 100%.

Spot on Harry, this is why the Martian probes spent so much investigating for life. They were trying to support evolutionary ideas (if it happened once on Earth we should see it everywhere as it is the normal outcome of chemical processes). No evidence was found. SETI hasn't uncovered any yet either. In fact this is a major prediction of Evolution which has not validated the 'warm pond' theory.

BTW on another track, I'm not sure evolution predicts species either. Why are there species? Shouldn't the entire globe be filled with viable transitional forms all evolving into their little niche? Especially after 570 million years of multicellular organisms. Creationism, on the other hand, predicts species.

 

[Panthera tigris FC]

Hi Guys, so where are we up to?

Trying to make sense of Harry's comment below.

If you are an atheist you have to beleive that there is life elsewhere.

Why?

If we are not God's creation and we just happen to exist from a big bang, then the chances of other life forms living on other planets in this infinite Universe would be huge, if not 100%.

Spot on Harry, this is why the Martian probes spent so much investigating for life. They were trying to support evolutionary ideas (if it happened once on Earth we should see it everywhere as it is the normal outcome of chemical processes). No evidence was found. SETI hasn't uncovered any yet either. In fact this is a major prediction of Evolution which has not validated the 'warm pond' theory.

BTW on another track, I'm not sure evolution predicts species either. Why are there species? Shouldn't the entire globe be filled with viable transitional forms all evolving into their little niche? Especially after 570 million years of multicellular organisms. Creationism, on the other hand, predicts species.

Define "species"

 

[Disco08]

In biology, a species is one of the basic units of biological classification. A species is often defined as a group of organisms capable of interbreeding and producing fertile offspring. While in many cases this definition is adequate, more precise or differing measures are often used, such as based on similarity of DNA or on the presence of specific locally-adapted traits

 

[Rosy]

Spot on Harry, this is why the Martian probes spent so much investigating for life. They were trying to support evolutionary ideas (if it happened once on Earth we should see it everywhere as it is the normal outcome of chemical processes). No evidence was found.

So there's no evidence of life on Mars at this stage but that's neither here nor there. Maybe there's far more out there than anyone could imagine in their wildest dreams...then again maybe what we have is all there is. I'm certainly happy to live with that until proven otherwise but I imagine several others would be pretty disappointed if that's the case.

 

[Disco08]

Spot on Harry, this is why the Martian probes spent so much investigating for life. They were trying to support evolutionary ideas (if it happened once on Earth we should see it everywhere as it is the normal outcome of chemical processes). No evidence was found. SETI hasn't uncovered any yet either. In fact this is a major prediction of Evolution which has not validated the 'warm pond' theory.

Firstly, scientists do not predict that life should spring up everywhere because it happened on Earth. They recognise that it is highly improbable for all the parameters required for life to begin to occur together as they did on Earth. The sheer number of star systems in the seeable universe means that weight of numbers says that the same conditions will have occurred elsewhere but that does not guarantee life flourished as it has here nor that species will have developed intelligence to overcome the difficulties of space travel.

Secondly, how many planets do you think man has been able to explore so far? What percentage of the universe's planets would that number represent?

Lastly, a large proportion of the space exploration undertaken by mankind so far has been approved and funded by US administrations voted in and controlled by America's large christian population. How you draw the conclusion that these programs had a major objective of finding evidence to support evolution is beyond me.

BTW on another track, I'm not sure evolution predicts species either. Why are there species? Shouldn't the entire globe be filled with viable transitional forms all evolving into their little niche? Especially after 570 million years of multicellular organisms. Creationism, on the other hand, predicts species.

Only a minute amount of actual life is fossilised, so expecting 'the entire globe be filled with viable transitional forms' is ridiculous. Here's a page which describes examples of transitional fossils including reptile-birds, reptile-mammals, ape-humans and legged sea creatures.

How does creation account for these specimens?

 

[jayfox]

If something is infinite, then it can't have been created. So you see the christian theory is bogus on that account also because they claim god to be infinite.

What? God is infinite and Christians don't ever claim that he was created. He is not held by time and space. He is beyond time and space. If you define 'existance' as a human does, i.e. something that is measurable by time and space, then God doesn't exist in the way that we understand existance.

 

[jayfox]

I guess that this is another reason why Christians believe that Homosexuality is wrong. .

Jay, you should say 'some christians.'

Not all christians believe that homosexuality is wrong. some Christians are homosexual. Some aren't. Some believe it's wrong, others don't.

And likewise with people who have other spiritual beliefs. And those with no set beliefs.

It's not so black and white as you suggest.

You're right. I should have clarified to state that those Christians who regard the Bible as the word of God consider homosexuality to be wrong. But then, anyone who doesn't believe that the Bible is the word of God is not a true Christian.

 

[Disco08]

God is infinite.... He is not held by time and space. He is beyond time and space.

In your opinion.

 

[Six Pack]

Jay, I try to understand where you are coming from, but your blinkered and dogmatic approach does you no favors. You can't be so dismissive of the fact that many christians, committed as you are or even more so, don't take the bible so fundamentally.