But the were screwed even when McDonald and co were around.
There drafting surpassed us as the worse in in the comp Topmass, Watts and Blease
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Richmond vs St Kilda - Game Day Thread
- Thread starter Bullarto Tiger
- Start date
There drafting surpassed us as the worse in in the comp Topmass, Watts and Blease
In the context of what this man has done for this club, the second last paragraph is the only one that means anything..in this meaningless disrespectful post.
Our midfield is so thin he is still trying to carry it. Ideally he would be spending time forward or back like Pendles. Trying his heart out and you write speculation about his motives - just playing for the cash (if so, so?) - and his future after footy. This stuff would be better off in some gossip mag. 2 mercs, wowee..!
I'm glad Twang Russell's mentioned that fake handball by the Aints player yesterday should've been called play on and not penalised as 50 against us. Stupid, amateur umpiring.
BTW, the Aints supporters shouldn't get carried away with that win because it was Richmond losing and not St Kilda winning. We opened the door for them just like we did for Carlton.
BTW, the Aints supporters shouldn't get carried away with that win because it was Richmond losing and not St Kilda winning. We opened the door for them just like we did for Carlton.
On the other hand Clarkson tipped out Lewis, Mitchell, Hodge and Birchall at exactly the right time which meant they could give games to their kids and work out who would make it and who wouldn't.
Heavily criticized at the time but in hindsight it was exactly the right thing to do.
They were all performing at a higher level than the likes to Cotchin, Riewoldt and Shedda are now when they left also.
What evidence is there to suggest that has been a success? 14th and 15th last 2 years, 9th before that.
They played Kangas round 1, Port who haven’t won a game then were 8 goals down at 1/4 time.
They may win the flag, but can’t point to those decisions as evidence of the right thing to do. Not to mention Richmond will make there own decisions made by there own values
It wasn't the right thing to do, he went way to scorched earth. Paid no regard to the benefits of experience in terms of teaching and leadership, and also culture. I said it at the time and I still believe it.
Dave and Bacher last year, 2 or maybe even 3 of Cotch, Jack and Shed this year, that very rapid transition in anyones book, but you're jumping up and down as if they are all hanging on 'til 40.
Besides, where's any evidence it was the right thing to do? Clarkson, your man, is out the door, they aren't threatening, hardly compelling KPIs.
You can look at scorched earth v orderly respectful transition when we can compare both sides time taken if and when they return to contending.
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What a ridiculous post, you wouldn't have a clue what their motivation is.
These fade outs have been around since last year.
Didn't Collingwood over run us?
Didn't WC kick 4 goals in 7 minutes?
Didn't Freo kick the winning goal late in the game?
The arrogance of not bringing in players to help to win the next flag had come back and knocked them for 6.
We started the cook book to success.
Introduce players from other clubs.
Nakas, Caddy, Prestia, Towner & Lynch.
To go into a trade period with 5 quality picks and not use at least one to bring in team filler like Mitchell or Omeara has ended our season in round 3.
What's Teague doing at the club. Can't believe we are paying him.
Didn't Collingwood over run us?
Didn't WC kick 4 goals in 7 minutes?
Didn't Freo kick the winning goal late in the game?
The arrogance of not bringing in players to help to win the next flag had come back and knocked them for 6.
We started the cook book to success.
Introduce players from other clubs.
Nakas, Caddy, Prestia, Towner & Lynch.
To go into a trade period with 5 quality picks and not use at least one to bring in team filler like Mitchell or Omeara has ended our season in round 3.
What's Teague doing at the club. Can't believe we are paying him.
Sometimes you need to go backwards to go forward, the current system is designed so that clubs cannot stay at the top for ever. We have had our fun but now we have to be patient and start again.
Would have thought with our longer pre season we wouldn't be fading out of games so badly. Yes we are undermanned but those same players were getting us a lead to start with.
And how has that panned out for the Hawks? 1 finals appearance since 2016. He also tipped out those stars for some injury prone players and threw away endless draft picks. O'meara, Wingard, Mitchell etc.
If want to talk about re-builds, there's should have started after 2016 but in effect it started last year. We have come off 3 premierships and are well ahead of them in terms of list profile considering how much we too invested in last years draft.
I agree with most of your thoughts Smoking but you are way off the mark if you think the Hawks are behind us on the rebuild path.
They are at least 2 maybe 3 years ahead of us with 6-8 young guns.
Mitch Lewis, Will Day, Jiath, Moore, Newcombe, Scrimshaw and Ward are all going to be top level players. They have also moved on the majority of their older players whilst we still need to do that.
We also have problematic legacy contacts to all of Lynch, Prestia and Dusty that will stall our rebuild that the hawks don't have. Hartley should almost be sacked for resigning Prestia on big coin for 3 years when he hasn't been able to get on the park.
We only have Bolton, Balta and Baker and that's it. Gibcus is showing promise but got slaughtered by King yesterday so the jury remains out. I also have no confidence in Clarke to make the right calls on draft night. His record is terrible and if we don't see enough from the 2021 draft crop by year end he needs to be moved on before he stuffs up another 3 early selections.
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Am not sure if your serious or taking this *smile* here.
Hawthorn are the worst possible argument and case study you can make as to how you come out the other side of a dynasty lol.
They would have been far better off keeping a couple of the first three all time greats and leaders of the club (Hodge, Mitchell, Lewis) you mentioned on and ensuring the culture of the place didn't completely erode like it did.
Like Chimp they had the types of on and off-field actions you want your kids to emulate.
Instead Hawthorn traded out young players like Jed Anderson, Brad Hill.
Brought in O'Meara at a huge draft cost, in fact traded out of every draft.
And brought in soft footballers on big money (Wingard, Vickery) that actually instill the exact opposite leadership, culture and influence that Hodge, Mitchell would have by playing a season or two more.
If we do everything the opposite of what Hawthorn did at the back end of there flags we would automatically be infinitely better off.
Its true their trading has been poor but their drafting has been spot on. The few early picks they've had they've nailed and they've found gold with later picks.
I maintain the view that their list is in much better place than ours right now. What's this say about our club, recruiting and list management team?
Can Leysy bookmark the bolded? Some more "grass is greener" glasses here. Crazy talk.
No way you can argue Hawthorn's youth is ahead of ours. This was top 7 in last years B & F in a woeful team:
- Tom Mitchell (161 votes)
- Blake Hardwick (126)
- Jaeger O'Meara (121)
- Dylan Moore (101)
- Chad Wingard (100)
- Sam Frost (95)
- Daniel Howe (83)
So if I offered you a straight swap of lists right now you'd still take ours?
I like you're loyalty but if we tested that with a knowledgeable and independent audience I'd be willing to back that the majority would take the Hawks list over ours
If I included the coaches in the swap also I reckon that strengthens the hawks case despite the fact that I can't stand Mitchell. Arrogant, little tosser that he is.
KK those players you mentioned for the Hawks, are good players but you are underselling our young players. Bolton and Balta alone cover those blokes. Moore? I might as well add Dow or Ross if we are going down that path.
Jury out for Gibcus? Please KK. Now you are really taking the *smile*. Blind Freddy can see this kid can play. He was up against a key forward who has been in the game for 4 years.
Last year they drafted Ward, Butler, Macdonald. But have not addressed their big man stocks.
On the flip side we have our bookends covered with Balta and Gibcus.
We ain't going to agree on this.
Agree Gibcus can play and needs time so I'll retract that one but if you think Ross is in the same class as any of the Hawks players I've mentioned then we are poles apart on talent identification.
They have Grainger-Barrass who I didn't mention as their key back and Lewis as their key forward so equally as well placed as us with young talls, whilst their mids and flankers are better. Ward and McDonald are already showing enough to know they are good picks. Our mids and flankers are in the ressies whilst our seniors are a team that should be pretty easy to break into.
