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IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
Poll on Hardwick as our coach
- Thread starter Ghost of Punt Road
- Start date
toby64 said:
Yes it was.
Griffiths missed two he should've kicked. So did Cotchin. Arnot kicked one from the boundary when he normally can't get it over a jam tin. Why are we quibbling over 3-4 goals when we got beaten so convincingly on the scoreboard?
We should be beating these teams comfortably, with a much better F50 conversion. Instead we get beaten by five goals by a team who looked dangerous every time the ball went in their F50.
Forget about individual players. We have plenty of talent.
The question is - why are we far, far less than the sum of our parts?
That, my friend, is the coach's domain. And he has failed.
toby64 said:
That's fine mate but he has been here 6 years, his game plan and the players he uses are the same year after year. He doesn't innovate, he doesn't develop or harness guys natural flair and ability, he plays the same battlers week in week out regardless of the fact they can't kick, are old, slow and the game has passed them.
You keep blaming the players but he picks them and instructs them to play a certain way. I think we have some blokes on our list like Elton, Lennon, McBean etc that could have been given more opportunity to play in the firsts last year over the likes of Chaplin, Newman etc who are guys that are not getting us anywhere (I know they didn't play on the weekend, I am talking long term).
Hardwick has to go.
Colonel said:
I'm not saying that Hardwick is a good coach. Don't think I have ever said it.
The reality is he has had six years, he will have coached by the end of the season the 4th most games in our history and won't have a finals win to show for it. Pretty damning. I agree his time is up. No arguments from me.
But I am not buying into the groupthink by people who completely overrated our prospects at the start of the year that bad coaching is all that is stopping us from being a contender.
So many here seem to think that our list is better than it is. That a new coach will suddenly turn us into a contender. Its 1980's thinking. And look where that got us.
The problem is more than just Damien Hardwick.
How can people think we are still overreacting??!!!
I cannot remember the last time a RFC coach had been given financial, personnel, administration and facilities support of the same ilk that Dimma has been afforded. Frawley was working with peanuts, was a DUD and still took us further than Dimma has. There are no more excuses for Dimma. He has been given all the tools required and after 6 patient years he has slowly moulded a team that is now looking that is need of some sort of rebuild!!! Hinkley takes over a basket case and in 2 years has his teams pushing for a premiership. Beveridge in one off season has turned a basket case of a club with no funds into an exciting team that looks they have gone past us.
The writing was on the wall when Dimma decided to start bringing in other peoples trash. It all started with the recruitement of Miller and has been on a downhill ever since. Imagine he had put his faith in the draft these last couple of years and the Houli's, Grigg's and Thomas' of this world where young players with potential who would of had 3-4 years in the system now would be ready to take the next step. Instead we have blokes like Pettered, Grigg and Houli being gifted games at the expense of development. As far as im concerned he has dug his own hole.
The only issue is that this club DOES NOT and since the GR days HAS NOT got the BALLS to make the tough call.
I cannot remember the last time a RFC coach had been given financial, personnel, administration and facilities support of the same ilk that Dimma has been afforded. Frawley was working with peanuts, was a DUD and still took us further than Dimma has. There are no more excuses for Dimma. He has been given all the tools required and after 6 patient years he has slowly moulded a team that is now looking that is need of some sort of rebuild!!! Hinkley takes over a basket case and in 2 years has his teams pushing for a premiership. Beveridge in one off season has turned a basket case of a club with no funds into an exciting team that looks they have gone past us.
The writing was on the wall when Dimma decided to start bringing in other peoples trash. It all started with the recruitement of Miller and has been on a downhill ever since. Imagine he had put his faith in the draft these last couple of years and the Houli's, Grigg's and Thomas' of this world where young players with potential who would of had 3-4 years in the system now would be ready to take the next step. Instead we have blokes like Pettered, Grigg and Houli being gifted games at the expense of development. As far as im concerned he has dug his own hole.
The only issue is that this club DOES NOT and since the GR days HAS NOT got the BALLS to make the tough call.
Performance-based assessment can only be applied from 2012/2013 onwards. It hasn't been 6 years of poor coaching; he was just what we needed early on regardless of performance.
But this was happening last year, too. So Hardwick is aware that his players have issues when kicking gettable shots, yet nothing has really changed, so he's done nothing to change it? Jack had problems with set shots in 2009, he went out over summer with Danny Daly and practiced goal kicking, over and over. He won the Coleman in 2010. Our forward coach is still Mark Williams the Lesser. It's a combination of players and coach, but the coach is the one who directs the players and its the one who is responsible for using the resources at his command to iron out obvious imperfections in their game.toby64 said:
I fall into the "Not sure, but keep him" at this stage.
I know at the end of the day, the buck stops with him and the pressure is on, but this is a new season and he started it as coach, so I think it is premature after only four games and a couple of poor results, to talk of changing him.
Yes I am aware of last years result against the Dees, the 3 & 10 situation last year and our two ignominious exits from finals, but this is 2015. At the mid season break, after the next 6 weeks where wins are going to hard to come by, is a more appropriate time to address where we are at for the season.
I don't know what the problem with the Tigers is. I accept Dimma is part of the problem because it is his responsibility to put a competitive team on the park each week, but as a general comment; our skills, composure, toughness both mental and physical and on field leadership are woeful, our depth is not that of a top 8 team IMO and we have a poor record of developing youngsters. I think the clubs issues are far deeper than just the coach, although I suspect he will be in trouble at the mid year break.
I know at the end of the day, the buck stops with him and the pressure is on, but this is a new season and he started it as coach, so I think it is premature after only four games and a couple of poor results, to talk of changing him.
Yes I am aware of last years result against the Dees, the 3 & 10 situation last year and our two ignominious exits from finals, but this is 2015. At the mid season break, after the next 6 weeks where wins are going to hard to come by, is a more appropriate time to address where we are at for the season.
I don't know what the problem with the Tigers is. I accept Dimma is part of the problem because it is his responsibility to put a competitive team on the park each week, but as a general comment; our skills, composure, toughness both mental and physical and on field leadership are woeful, our depth is not that of a top 8 team IMO and we have a poor record of developing youngsters. I think the clubs issues are far deeper than just the coach, although I suspect he will be in trouble at the mid year break.
Just thought I'd dredge up one of polls we had on Hardwick staying on as coach this year seeing there is a lot of talk of a contract extension early next year.
This poll was just after our worst loss in 2015 and the one that should never ever have happened, the embarrassing shameful loss against that deadbeat, basket case Rabblebourne.
I put the blame of that disgraceful loss solely on Hardwicks shoulders as I guess most of the 167 punters on here did.
Things worked out in the end as we stuck with Hardwick and he redeemed himself by getting us in the finals again.
Hardwick has my support but I'd like to see the board hold off offering him an extension until the 2016 ANZAC eve game against that pile of festering sh!t.
We lose that, then Hardwick should become persona non grata at Tigerland, I just can't see anyone supporting a coach that couldn't get our team up against crap like Rabblebourne three years in a row!
Bag away!
This poll was just after our worst loss in 2015 and the one that should never ever have happened, the embarrassing shameful loss against that deadbeat, basket case Rabblebourne.
I put the blame of that disgraceful loss solely on Hardwicks shoulders as I guess most of the 167 punters on here did.
Things worked out in the end as we stuck with Hardwick and he redeemed himself by getting us in the finals again.
Hardwick has my support but I'd like to see the board hold off offering him an extension until the 2016 ANZAC eve game against that pile of festering sh!t.
We lose that, then Hardwick should become persona non grata at Tigerland, I just can't see anyone supporting a coach that couldn't get our team up against crap like Rabblebourne three years in a row!
Bag away!
Top 4 is the minimum for him. He has developed the team enough and now it's action time. We can't procrastinate anymore were in our premiership window and we need to keep improving. Top 4 with a win in 2016 ( maybe a gf appearance?) but in 17 and beyond we should be winning premierships...
To respond to a few posts-
We just don't play well against Melbourne (got a much better record against the Hawks)
We get slaughtered almost every time we play North Melbourne
Not sure we have the list to get to top 4 - maybe, relying a lot on Yarren wearing his undies on the outside of his shorts
As for finals success, our ruck division, inside ability and midfield size hasn't really changed unless a fringe player does a Miles
Are our bogey men appropriate measures to judge Harwick's performance?
Well why not.
We just don't play well against Melbourne (got a much better record against the Hawks)
We get slaughtered almost every time we play North Melbourne
Not sure we have the list to get to top 4 - maybe, relying a lot on Yarren wearing his undies on the outside of his shorts
As for finals success, our ruck division, inside ability and midfield size hasn't really changed unless a fringe player does a Miles
Are our bogey men appropriate measures to judge Harwick's performance?
Well why not.
A very ham fisted way of saying we don't score enough which I agree with. The fact is Dimma is our coach this year whatever happens so let's look at whether the club recognises that very fundamental issue during 2016.ToraToraTora said:
On the basis of the recruiting the answer seems to be positive so far. To me there are 2 ways we are going to score more. One is to increase the speed of our ball movement from the back half and on the flanks and we seem to have recognised that with our off season and 2014 as well, Yarran, Drummond, Castagna, Broad etc. The statements about Cotchin being more outside are positive and we have recruited midfield grunt to allow that to happen.
The other way is more spark, speed and crumbing power in the forward line and we have recruited for that as well.
So to me the language of the club is the right language but the proof will come on the field. It's who we pick and how we play that will be the important thing so let's see.
If we added 12-15 points a game in scoring we would be top 4 and that has to be the aim.
Tommy Gun said:
The on-field problems are obvious despite the denial by a lot of people posting here.
Hardwick - and this includes the overall coaching regime - has, apart from one solitary year, failed to have a team adequately prepared to compete at Round 1. It is totally unacceptable to continually go through pre-seasons and have a team so unprepared at the start of virtually every season - this clearly shows a failed strategy that has not improved over his tenure. The "Goldfish memory" of most people may quickly forget how bad we are at the start of seasons but that is when you can set up the difference between finishing in the top 4 or not.
The overall failure in high-pressure matches - which include all of our finals losses - is another ongoing issue. If we don't have the game plan to win the big matches or are constantly out-coached by the top sides then what is the point of continuing with the same strategy?
Hardwick may have actually done as best as anyone could getting the current squad to where it is right now, but I have serious reservations as to whether we can take the next step and if the club wasn't so obsessed with their unnecessary "Extend contracts to avoid hard decisions later" policy we'd wait until half-way through the 2016 season to decide if it is justified to give him a new contract.
I agree that it is a problem but not the goldfish memories part. If you look around in posts you will see posting that states we have a 15-18 record in first half of the last 3 seasons and a 27-6 record in the latter half.David C said:
It is definitely a problem that needs addressing and maybe our failure in EFs has something to do with whatever we have had to do to get there ?
