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IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
Life, The Universe and Everything Else
- Thread starter evo
- Start date
Re: Christianity
evo said:fair point.Tiger74 said:evo said:
for me yes, to be conscious of ones being dont you need to be aware?
Big assumption we are the only planet with sentient life Evo, Im actually a little disappointed in you
So can i assume you believe consciousness only exists if sentient beings are experiencing it?
Re: Christianity
Yes I believe it would Evo. Consciousness is energy. It can't be destroyed. Its vibrational frequency that operates on different levels. The result of your hypothetical would simply be the removal of all physical life forms.
evo said:
Yes I believe it would Evo. Consciousness is energy. It can't be destroyed. Its vibrational frequency that operates on different levels. The result of your hypothetical would simply be the removal of all physical life forms.
Re: Christianity
Energy is energy.And consciousness is consciousness.They're 2 different things.You invoked Aristotle a few pages back.His most important offering to mankind was A=A(the law of indentity)
your contention is A=B
Just to remind you of the definitions in the dictionary of consciousness.
con·scious·ness /ˈkɒnʃəsnɪs/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[kon-shuhs-nis] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun 1. the state of being conscious; awareness of one's own existence, sensations, thoughts, surroundings, etc.
2. the thoughts and feelings, collectively, of an individual or of an aggregate of people: the moral consciousness of a nation.
3. full activity of the mind and senses, as in waking life: to regain consciousness after fainting.
4. awareness of something for what it is; internal knowledge: consciousness of wrongdoing.
5. concern, interest, or acute awareness: class consciousness.
6. the mental activity of which a person is aware as contrasted with unconscious mental processes.
7. Philosophy. the mind or the mental faculties as characterized by thought, feelings, and volition.
One thing all those definitions have in common if it requires life to exist.
It requires the thinking to be thunk. ;D
Your position seems untenable to me.Stripes.Stripes said:
Energy is energy.And consciousness is consciousness.They're 2 different things.You invoked Aristotle a few pages back.His most important offering to mankind was A=A(the law of indentity)
your contention is A=B
Yes it can.When there are no sentient beings(thanks to tiger74) to practise it.
Different levels to what?Mind?
Just to remind you of the definitions in the dictionary of consciousness.
con·scious·ness /ˈkɒnʃəsnɪs/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[kon-shuhs-nis] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–noun 1. the state of being conscious; awareness of one's own existence, sensations, thoughts, surroundings, etc.
2. the thoughts and feelings, collectively, of an individual or of an aggregate of people: the moral consciousness of a nation.
3. full activity of the mind and senses, as in waking life: to regain consciousness after fainting.
4. awareness of something for what it is; internal knowledge: consciousness of wrongdoing.
5. concern, interest, or acute awareness: class consciousness.
6. the mental activity of which a person is aware as contrasted with unconscious mental processes.
7. Philosophy. the mind or the mental faculties as characterized by thought, feelings, and volition.
One thing all those definitions have in common if it requires life to exist.
It requires the thinking to be thunk. ;D
Life, the Universe, and Everything
Starting this up given the Christian thread was really supposed to be about Christianity only.
So if you want to talk about Stripes and his mystical energies or Red's freaky cult of bald headed bong smoking dancing monkeys, feel free to dump your views here.
I have one question for Stripes actually. In your world were our conscious engeries are all interconnected and part of a greater oneness, is there such a thing as "good" and "evil"?
Starting this up given the Christian thread was really supposed to be about Christianity only.
So if you want to talk about Stripes and his mystical energies or Red's freaky cult of bald headed bong smoking dancing monkeys, feel free to dump your views here.
I have one question for Stripes actually. In your world were our conscious engeries are all interconnected and part of a greater oneness, is there such a thing as "good" and "evil"?
Re: Christianity
Sometimes too much thinking can be a dangerous thing Evo my good man. ;Dolice:
I’m not entirely convinced that consciousness and energy are two different and distinct things but if they are then I’m not sure they operate independently from eachother.
I believe consciousness is a subtle form of energy intelligence of which the thinking/ego mind is merely a part. Eg, in states of pure consciousness (such as meditation) the thinking mind is absent. That state creates a void that I consider to be pure God like energy consciousness where there is no recognition of separateness but instead an awareness of the oneness of being. Is this void limited to the confines of your mind or physical body? I don't think so because consciousness expands beyond them. I also believe there are other subtle forms of energy intelligence that exist outside the dense, physical realm of sentient beings on Earth. They exist in other dimensions that I believe we are able to access through pure states of consciousness. This is what I meant by vibrational frequencies on different levels or planes (and yes that which is beyond the thinking mind!). But its just my belief.
What do we know about consciousness? Well its not physical (although it operates through the physical) so we can't see it, but we know it exists because we can feel its effects. We can't measure it either, only in terms of whether the sentient being is still alive/conscious. But that doesn't mean it can't and doesn't exist beyond death. I believe it does and that its infinite and immeasurable (much like the Universe). How can I prove it? I can't. Some things simply can't be explained, they just are! Just like I’ve experienced many alerted states of consciousness, out of body experiences and other psychic phenomenon but I can't prove any of it, nor does it prove the existence of consciousness beyond death. It’s a bit like trying to prove the existence of God! But I believe it does and can exist beyond the destruction of all sentient beings.
Sometimes too much thinking can be a dangerous thing Evo my good man. ;D
olice:I’m not entirely convinced that consciousness and energy are two different and distinct things but if they are then I’m not sure they operate independently from eachother.
I believe consciousness is a subtle form of energy intelligence of which the thinking/ego mind is merely a part. Eg, in states of pure consciousness (such as meditation) the thinking mind is absent. That state creates a void that I consider to be pure God like energy consciousness where there is no recognition of separateness but instead an awareness of the oneness of being. Is this void limited to the confines of your mind or physical body? I don't think so because consciousness expands beyond them. I also believe there are other subtle forms of energy intelligence that exist outside the dense, physical realm of sentient beings on Earth. They exist in other dimensions that I believe we are able to access through pure states of consciousness. This is what I meant by vibrational frequencies on different levels or planes (and yes that which is beyond the thinking mind!). But its just my belief.
What do we know about consciousness? Well its not physical (although it operates through the physical) so we can't see it, but we know it exists because we can feel its effects. We can't measure it either, only in terms of whether the sentient being is still alive/conscious. But that doesn't mean it can't and doesn't exist beyond death. I believe it does and that its infinite and immeasurable (much like the Universe). How can I prove it? I can't. Some things simply can't be explained, they just are! Just like I’ve experienced many alerted states of consciousness, out of body experiences and other psychic phenomenon but I can't prove any of it, nor does it prove the existence of consciousness beyond death. It’s a bit like trying to prove the existence of God! But I believe it does and can exist beyond the destruction of all sentient beings.
Re: Life, the Universe, and Everything
all you ever needed to know about good and evil but were too afraid to ask 8)
all you ever needed to know about good and evil but were too afraid to ask 8)
Re: Christianity
This is my first post on the Christianity thread and since I'm new, I haven't had time read 250 something of discussion. However, the consciousness is a topic that interests me greatly and is also a topic which I believe should be treated separately to religion.
The dictionary definition of consciousness given by evo is purely a psychological definition. There are no references that I can see in regards to the consciousness in a physical sense.
This is because no one knows what consciousness truly is (physically speaking)
Some believe that consciousness is directly related and/or part of the soul. Some also believe that the soul can exist completely independent without a biological body.
I like to think of it (maybe simplistic but works for me) like a car and driver. The car is useless without the driver but destroying all the cars won't destroy the drivers (Unless you're in it at the time but that's a physical limitation that the soul isn't subjected to.), the drivers will find something else to do.
The only point of possible disagreement (I don't know for sure) is whether consciousness can be destroyed or not. Matter cannot be created or destroyed, but can be converted into other types of matter. If it can, I'll corss that bridge when I come to it.
This is my first post on the Christianity thread and since I'm new, I haven't had time read 250 something of discussion. However, the consciousness is a topic that interests me greatly and is also a topic which I believe should be treated separately to religion.
The dictionary definition of consciousness given by evo is purely a psychological definition. There are no references that I can see in regards to the consciousness in a physical sense.
This is because no one knows what consciousness truly is (physically speaking)
Some believe that consciousness is directly related and/or part of the soul. Some also believe that the soul can exist completely independent without a biological body.
I like to think of it (maybe simplistic but works for me) like a car and driver. The car is useless without the driver but destroying all the cars won't destroy the drivers (Unless you're in it at the time but that's a physical limitation that the soul isn't subjected to.), the drivers will find something else to do.
The only point of possible disagreement (I don't know for sure) is whether consciousness can be destroyed or not. Matter cannot be created or destroyed, but can be converted into other types of matter. If it can, I'll corss that bridge when I come to it.
Re: Christianity
I don't think its faith Evo as I'm not attached to any particular outcome or set of beliefs. But when things resonate with me on a level that is beyond physical then I tend to take notice!
Its still a work in progress for me too btw. I think being fully present and consciously aware of every moment in your waking life is a good start. The cracks soon begin to appear in the illusion of reality! But its not an easy thing to do. :-\
evo said:Sounds awefully like faith, Stripes.
I do potentially agree with one thing you said about the 'oneness of being' although it's not quite complete yet,a work in progress.
I don't think its faith Evo as I'm not attached to any particular outcome or set of beliefs. But when things resonate with me on a level that is beyond physical then I tend to take notice!
Its still a work in progress for me too btw. I think being fully present and consciously aware of every moment in your waking life is a good start. The cracks soon begin to appear in the illusion of reality! But its not an easy thing to do. :-\
Re: Life, the Universe, and Everything
Nice break away thread T74! Would be an impossible task to carve up our cosmic discussions from the Christianity thread.
Firstly, I think the concept of "good" and "evil" is a human concept designed to strike fear into the hearts of many (aka certain religions have successfully done this). There are certainly darker energies that exist but I don't believe there are truly evil energies. Evil is an invention of the human ego mind IMO.
Darker energy gathers in lower emotional states such as hate, jealousy, anger, rage, etc just as lighter energy exists in higher emotional states like love, joy and happiness. The state I referred to on the Christianity thread (ie, pure consciousness and the oneness of being) is of such a high vibrational frequency and enlightened nature that I doubt darker energies could exist within it.
Tiger74 said:
Nice break away thread T74! Would be an impossible task to carve up our cosmic discussions from the Christianity thread.
Firstly, I think the concept of "good" and "evil" is a human concept designed to strike fear into the hearts of many (aka certain religions have successfully done this). There are certainly darker energies that exist but I don't believe there are truly evil energies. Evil is an invention of the human ego mind IMO.
Darker energy gathers in lower emotional states such as hate, jealousy, anger, rage, etc just as lighter energy exists in higher emotional states like love, joy and happiness. The state I referred to on the Christianity thread (ie, pure consciousness and the oneness of being) is of such a high vibrational frequency and enlightened nature that I doubt darker energies could exist within it.
