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Also for Carts and Spook can't agree that players should influence coaching appointments to the degree they have. By that reckoning In 6 months if they aren't happy again do we make another change??

This is how it should be:

“Never in my time as a player did [we], as a playing group, influence what a board was thinking as far as appointments,” Ponting said.

And:

I might have got asked an opinion here or there on a certain coach, but it seems like the players and, maybe, a couple of other personnel around the Australian cricket team might have influenced Cricket Australia into making the decision that they have.”
 
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End of the day rate him or not. Langer and Paine for that matter should have been given the support and honesty by CA and walked off Bellerive oval arm in arm after winning the ashes and into the sunset head helds high.

It could do easily have been that way.

But when you have gutless weak spineless cowards leading your organisation this is what occurs.

No one wins, Langer, Paine, nearly all recent ex champion players are all bitter, or the new coach (NSW Bayliss incoming)who is on a hiding to nothing.

The sooner Fuckley goes the better. Cricket Tas for one will hold a party.
 
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Very hard to understand how there could be so much resentment towards him from players. But ultimately if you don't have the support of the majority of the players its essentially an untenable situation.

He's given so much to the game its a disappointing way for him to finish his Australian cricket participation.
 
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MD Jazz said:
Very hard to understand how there could be so much resentment towards him from players. But ultimately if you don't have the support of the majority of the players its essentially an untenable situation.
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True.
Simple solution in this situation is for the board to turn to Langer n say. Thank you very much, but we're done here see you later. Months of speculation n bull *smile* through the media followed by more dribble n *smile* after the test series was done and then they turn around n offer him an insulting 6 months extension. Nothing short of a gutless performance by the board in a desperate attempt to pretend their hands were all shiny clean.
 
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Leysy Days said:
Also for Carts and Spook can't agree that players should influence coaching appointments to the degree they have. By that reckoning In 6 months if they aren't happy again do we make another change??

This is how it should be:

“Never in my time as a player did [we], as a playing group, influence what a board was thinking as far as appointments,” Ponting said.

And:

I might have got asked an opinion here or there on a certain coach, but it seems like the players and, maybe, a couple of other personnel around the Australian cricket team might have influenced Cricket Australia into making the decision that they have.”
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Leysy, I have no doubt in my mind Langer totally misused our bowling cartel during the home India tour. they have been off-side since then. I believe they have been pretty much coaching themselves.

so when Cummins became captain, Langer was DOA.

the proof will be in the pudding. the players liked and respected Paine but they love P Cummins.

expect our performances to now truly reflect a team with limitless fast bowling depth, a sublimely skilled and attacking wicketkeeper batsman, GOAT offie and a batting lineup marshaling the powers of 3 top 10 international batsman along with emerging talent in Head and Green.
 
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There are plenty of examples of player power pushing out a coach or at least putting a lot of pressure on one to go.
Kohli and Kumble, ganguly and Chappell, Arthur and homework-gate. Shane Warne and Buchanan had a spat but can’t remember if it led to his demise. Even Taylor and Simpson years ago.

It’s really hard from the bleachers to have an opinion but a happy team is a good team ..
 
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Carter said:
Leysy, I have no doubt in my mind Langer totally misused our bowling cartel during the home India tour. they have been off-side since then. I believe they have been pretty much coaching themselves.
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Carts, I'm curios what do you mean that "Langer totally misused our bowling cartel during the home India tour."

The selectors choose the side, and Paine, the captain uses them as he thinks best. I don't understand how Langer can be at fault.
Also when you say "I believe they have been pretty much coaching themselves." Ronny McDonald is the bowling coach, and it's my understanding that he and the players get on very well.
 
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tigerman said:
Carts, I'm curios what do you mean that "Langer totally misused our bowling cartel during the home India tour."

The selectors choose the side, and Paine, the captain uses them as he thinks best. I don't understand how Langer can be at fault.
Also when you say "I believe they have been pretty much coaching themselves." Ronny McDonald is the bowling coach, and it's my understanding that he and the players get on very well.
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JL was head coach and he is a micro manager. All players are impacted by this and if what I’m hearing is true, several are overjoyed he’s out.

I reckon Langer’s combative approach wasn’t suited to supportive brotherhood our very strong bowling ranks have become. Just my opinion from watching the game closely. Pure speculation and happy to be corrected if you have more detailed intel Tigerman.
 
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Carter said:
I reckon Langer’s combative approach wasn’t suited to supportive brotherhood our very strong bowling ranks have become.
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Would that be the brotherhood of Cummins, Stark, Hazelwood n Lyon who all had no idea the ball was being " scuffed " in Sth Africa?
 
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Carter said:
I reckon Langer’s combative approach wasn’t suited to supportive brotherhood our very strong bowling ranks have become. Just my opinion from watching the game closely. Pure speculation and happy to be corrected if you have more detailed intel Tigerman.
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I agree that Langer’s “combative” style is not suited for this age of cricket and sport in general, it worked for him individually as a player.
I just not understand how you could blame him for “misusing” the bowlers, if that had occurred it would be on Paine.
I would not be surprised if he has upset the bowlers though.
 
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tigerman said:
I agree that Langer’s “combative” style is not suited for this age of cricket and sport in general, it worked for him individually as a player.
I just not understand how you could blame him for “misusing” the bowlers, if that had occurred it would be own Paine.
I would not be surprised if he has upset the bowlers though.
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Yeah I suppose Langer and Paine would’ve had plans along with the bowling coach.

To be clear, I wasn’t overly convinced of Paine’s overall value either.
 
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Leysy Days said:
Nah mate sport rightly doesn't work like that.

You can't give the credit on your wins to other people and just the losses to the coach. Pure bias.

It's one or the other.

Also don't downplay retaining the ashes in england. We've been belting up the poms at home for a decade but it was the first time in 20 years we've gone there and came back with the urn. It's not easy.
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Mate, how can you call me biased and then quote Ponting, one of Langer's best mates?

It's been stated that Langer stepped back and McDonald and Finch ran the show for the T20 World Cup, and McDonald and DiVenuto for The Ashes.

The 2019 result was all down to Smith (and Labuschagne and Wade to a much lesser extent) and the bowlers. Smith had one of the greatest series of all time: 774 runs in 7 innings while Warner, Harris, Bancroft, Head, Khawaja, Paine and Marsh combined for 731 from 46.

But for Paine burning his last review on a ball that pitched two feet outside leg, and sending the opposition in when his bowlers hadn't had sufficient rest from the previous Test, it should have been 4-0. But equally, if not for Smith we would have lost 4-0. To Stokes, Archer, Broad, Root, and a bunch of clubbies.

As for 'tail wagging the dog' complaints, the day a coach loses the players is the day he should begin updating his resume.

Sport is about the players, not the coach. Especially cricket. Everything you read says Langer had to go.

But I am with you 100% on how terribly it was handled by CA, and that Fockley and Oliver and the board should go too.
 
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spook said:
Mate, how can you call me biased and then quote Ponting, one of Langer's best mates?

It's been stated that Langer stepped back and McDonald and Finch ran the show for the T20 World Cup, and McDonald and DiVenuto for The Ashes.

The 2019 result was all down to Smith (and Labuschagne and Wade to a much lesser extent) and the bowlers. Smith had one of the greatest series of all time: 774 runs in 7 innings while Warner, Harris, Bancroft, Head, Khawaja, Paine and Marsh combined for 731 from 46.

But for Paine burning his last review on a ball that pitched two feet outside leg, and sending the opposition in when his bowlers hadn't had sufficient rest from the previous Test, it should have been 4-0. But equally, if not for Smith we would have lost 4-0. To Stokes, Archer, Broad, Root, and a bunch of clubbies.

As for 'tail wagging the dog' complaints, the day a coach loses the players is the day he should begin updating his resume.

Sport is about the players, not the coach. Especially cricket. Everything you read says Langer had to go.

But I am with you 100% on how terribly it was handled by CA, and that Fockley and Oliver and the board should go too.
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well said brother

players hated him, had to go
 
Any word on what's going to happen with team manager Gavin Dovey. He's been in the role over 10 years and has survived Mickey Arthur, Boof Lehman and Langer? There's been a few controversies in that time.

​

 
Carter said:
players hated him, had to go
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Comment in the Hun suggesting J.L. stuck it up a few players more interested in playing IPL for big shekels rather than playing for Aust against the minnows some time ago. Reckon the old hip pocket nerve would've put a few noses out of joint.
Gunna be very interesting to see how our whizz bang super stars perform in sub ideal conditions over the next few months. All well n good cruising down the boulevarde in premium conditions, lets see how they go when they've gotta navigate a shitty old mountain goat track with a big drop on the side.
 
CA has learnt nothing the last 5 years.
May as well give it back to Boof.
Players would be happy with that.
Shrek 2.0

Actually Eng and Aus should swap coaches.
Eng need toughening up = JL.
Aus need mellowing out = Silverwood.

Win/win.
Or is that Loss/loss.

What a cluster *smile*!
 
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