Coronavirus | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Coronavirus

Tigers of Old said:
Hate to have to spell out the obvious but there's a far higher risk of dying from COVID than any vaccine.
Hope like blazes that this highly infectious Delta variant doesn't spread through a vulnerable Australian community because this debate will quickly fade if it does. As will any concerns over lockdowns.

Whatever vaccine we go with, just get it out faster Slomo.
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I also believe that healthy young women are a much greater chance of developing blood clots from taking the birth control pill than anyone getting the AZ jab. Are we going to ban the birth control pill? Are we going to ban elective surgery because there is an extremely rare chance a patient could have a deadly reaction to anesthetic?

Bloody hell. There is risk everywhere in life. This overreaction and mass hysteria to the extremely rare chance of blood clots is a *smile* disgrace. The media reporting is over the top to say the least and the messaging from the government is pathetic; so ambiguous and creating mass reluctance and confusion.

We may as well all just stay in our houses for the rest of lives and waste our days away. What a joke this has become. Anyway I'm getting my second shot of AZ in about 9 weeks and looking forward to being fully vaccinated and doing my very small part towards getting us in a situation where we can live our lives without the spectre of these *smile* lockdowns looming over us all the time.
 
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Redford said:
....
You don’t care we’re so far behind in our roll out. By extension you then don’t care about the ongoing health risk and endless lockdowns, damage to the economy etc. either. Great outlook....
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Disagree to a degree

Only 1 state blameshifting Vic has done so much of devastaying economic damage. Yeah other do lockdowns but not at the harmful levels of this state.
Blame everyone but themselves. A holes.
Hiring a mates security coy for 30 mill with no skilled guards. then that guy has liquidated the coy. Dictator Dan hasnt paid all the inv. Funny thing liquidator seeking funds from Feds to sue Vic to recover $. Hope they do. This particular govt needs to resign in mass in its mishandling but are the elite with spin. 40 social media staff with 30 diff logons each. Dan bots. At times i feel we have a few here.

Lets see how NSW handle the outbreak. Small lockdowns arent tne issue.

160 +days plus and we're looming for a 5th lockdown. Get yr hatred slomo blinkers off.

yeah rollout is slow. I dont care either.
Vic is the worst of them all. Brought the country to its knees.

in areas we do agree, initially a huge big beat up in the news covoid In age care, hq, blah blah blah. There was the biggest opportunity to prove how effective vax are. All had mild symptoms. Perfect. Promote it. No all go back on the fear angle.

I do blv vax is the way to go but not at the expense of our democratic rights to chose. That stupidly will give our govts too much long term power that i dont want them to have. So Slomo be it. Dont care. Dictator / Chairman Dan is also been busy behind the scenes with the 3 a holes independent senators negotiating permanent powers for him.
Thats is something i worry about more than some slo rollout of vax & HQ
 
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TODAY.jpg

NSW "Gold Standard" contract tracing reputation destroyed in one fowl swoop. What’s alarming about this is that… what else have they missed?

On a sidenote, will the media grill Gladys about this today? I bet you my left nut they don’t.

TODAY1.jpg

I have always suspected the NSW government made decisions on COVID restrictions based on ideology as opposed to people’s health. Here is the smoking gun. In every state the CHO/CMO makes the final call on restrictions. In NSW, it’s the state health minister.
 
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Redford said:
You don’t care we’re so far behind in our roll out. By extension you then don’t care about the ongoing health risk and endless lockdowns, damage to the economy etc. either. Great outlook.
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Hate to break it to you but the UK has two-thirds vaccine coverage and has extended lockdown for another month. Don’t know how many times it needs saying, but vaccination isn’t the whole answer. You’re in a race where the road ahead is still being paved.
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach said:
Hate to break it to you but the UK has two-thirds vaccine coverage and has extended lockdown for another month. Don’t know how many times it needs saying, but vaccination isn’t the whole answer. You’re in a race where the road ahead is still being paved.
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UK has 80% of the population vaccinated with a single shot so far. Pfizer and AZ are only ~30% effective against Delta after 1 shot, but in the 90%s after 2 shots of the vaccine. Effective in this case is determined by the need for hospitalisation if the virus is contracted.

The UK knows it's a race to vaccinate. The difference there is the bulk of the media are all in lockstep and pushing the message that vaccination is the only way out of the lockdowns. Because it is. Everyone with a smidgen of common sense knows vaccination is the only answer.
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach said:
Hate to break it to you but the UK has two-thirds vaccine coverage and has extended lockdown for another month. Don’t know how many times it needs saying, but vaccination isn’t the whole answer. You’re in a race where the road ahead is still being paved.
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Wrong. The UK only has 47% fully vaccinated. 65% is inclusive of only a first dose - which isn't sufficient protection.

One dose only gives about a 33% protection rate to the new dominating Delta variant which isn't good enough and hence why they have an extended lockdown until they get two jabs into everyone. After that, Johnson says he'll lift the restrictions i.e. hate to break it to you Lee but whilst it isn't a complete panacea it's the major arterial highway out of this mess.

But hey, I get you're happy to take the fire trail route. Or it could just be you're no more than a Slo Mo fanboi looking for any ridiculous excuse for this unmitigated disaster.
 
If you want the experts view, Bowtell and Duckett explaining the strategic errors Slo Mo and Co. have made. It's pretty balanced in the sense that you're dealing with unknowns etc and other considerations, but points out some of the errors made never the less.

www.theage.com.au

Australia let down by failure to hedge bets on enough vaccines, experts say

The nation’s peak medical body and vaccine experts say the federal government made the right call at the time to back AstraZeneca, but public health specialists warn Australia was let down by a ‘narrow’ immunisation strategy.
www.theage.com.au www.theage.com.au
 
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Redford said:
But hey, I get you're happy to take the fire trail route. Or it could just be you're no more than a Slo Mo fanboi looking for any ridiculous excuse for this unmitigated disaster.
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Hahaha, it's you lot who are guilty of turning this thread into a political diatribe.
 
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Redford said:
If you want the experts view, Bowtell and Duckett explaining the strategic errors Slo Mo and Co. have made.

www.theage.com.au

Australia let down by failure to hedge bets on enough vaccines, experts say

The nation’s peak medical body and vaccine experts say the federal government made the right call at the time to back AstraZeneca, but public health specialists warn Australia was let down by a ‘narrow’ immunisation strategy.
www.theage.com.au www.theage.com.au
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Murdoch Children’s Research Institute vaccine uptake expert Margie Danchin said several countries around the world made the “very reasonable” decision to choose AstraZeneca last year, given it did not have cold-chain requirements like Pfizer did, which then could only be used if it was refrigerated at minus 70 degrees.

“It was an extremely appealing vaccine because it could be deployed easily and manufactured here in Australia,” she said.

“It had really good clinical drug trial data. In fact, in the clinical trials it had the lowest number of clots of all the vaccines in terms of adverse events that were being monitored for. Nobody could have ever anticipated this rare and serious adverse event clotting syndrome.”
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Unfortunate.
 
LeeToRainesToRoach said:
Hahaha, it's you lot who are guilty of this thread into a political diatribe.
Click to expand...

Not really. Those in favour of the slow down, championing the rights not to vaccinate, celebrating the AZ fuelled delays are only doing so because it masks the Governments complete *smile* up in it's responsibility to protect the country. There is no logic, fact or science that backs a "it's not a race" vaccine program.
 
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Tigers of Old said:
It really is a race.

www.abc.net.au

Nearly all COVID deaths in US are now among unvaccinated, analysis suggests

Nearly all COVID-19 deaths in the US are now in people who weren't vaccinated, according to analysis by the Associated Press.
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au
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Al Bundy said:
Disagree to a degree

Only 1 state blameshifting Vic has done so much of devastaying economic damage. Yeah other do lockdowns but not at the harmful levels of this state.
Blame everyone but themselves. A holes.
Hiring a mates security coy for 30 mill with no skilled guards. then that guy has liquidated the coy. Dictator Dan hasnt paid all the inv. Funny thing liquidator seeking funds from Feds to sue Vic to recover $. Hope they do. This particular govt needs to resign in mass in its mishandling but are the elite with spin. 40 social media staff with 30 diff logons each. Dan bots. At times i feel we have a few here.

Lets see how NSW handle the outbreak. Small lockdowns arent tne issue.

160 +days plus and we're looming for a 5th lockdown. Get yr hatred slomo blinkers off.

yeah rollout is slow. I dont care either.
Vic is the worst of them all. Brought the country to its knees.

in areas we do agree, initially a huge big beat up in the news covoid In age care, hq, blah blah blah. There was the biggest opportunity to prove how effective vax are. All had mild symptoms. Perfect. Promote it. No all go back on the fear angle.

I do blv vax is the way to go but not at the expense of our democratic rights to chose. That stupidly will give our govts too much long term power that i dont want them to have. So Slomo be it. Dont care. Dictator / Chairman Dan is also been busy behind the scenes with the 3 a holes independent senators negotiating permanent powers for him.
Thats is something i worry about more than some slo rollout of vax & HQ
Click to expand...

Sure, if you exclude the fact that international travel into Australia by tourists, students and business people is important for the economy. The faster we vax, the faster we can open up.
 
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Be good if we could stick to facts here and get away from name calling.

the realist in me says that whether or not people get AZ it will make little difference now to when we get full vaccination coverage given the governments actions and that this is independent of any individuals decision . I think this is crap and the lack of speed in our rollout is damning. Critical path should be delivery capacity and not supply. The lack of a plan for how we exit lockdown that is communicated (subject to change) is also annoying.

everyone’s health circumstances are different. I don’t know Lee’s personal risks for AZ and haven’t seen anyone ask - just judge. I always refer back to one of coveys seven rules - ‘seek to understand before being understood’. If we found out his risk of death was material I think everyone would be a bit embarrassed with their rants.

in general I find AZ hesitancy distasteful as for a typical person the risk of blood clot has the same number of morts as driving 400 in your car. I think the government has put together some good visuals that show in the event of an outbreak how many would die from covid va would die from AZ depending on the severity of the outbreak.


so the pragmatist / realist in me says that the risk of dying from covid is low as our government will manage that until everyone has a chance to get vaccinated. Give. Because of this I can see why some people will reject AZ on an emotional level vs a pure numbers level. The purist in me says that is a decision that prioritises the individual (generally) ahead of the community as it will prolong the rollout time (I’m guessing by two to three months.) which imposes its own costs on society.

if a significant number of people chose not to get vaccinated at all then shame on us as a society for not helping people understand it is in their own and societies best interest
 
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RoarEmotion said:
everyone’s health circumstances are different. I don’t know Lee’s personal risks for AZ and haven’t seen anyone ask - just judge. I always refer back to one of coveys seven rules - ‘seek to understand before being understood’. If we found out his risk of death was material I think everyone would be a bit embarrassed with their rants.
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By his own admission he's not getting vaccinated because he doesn't have too. If the gov open up the country then he'll get the jab. I'm never embarrassed when it comes to ranting against anti-vaxxers. In fact I think it's everyone's civic duty to call out anti-vaxxers for what they are, a clear and present danger to society.,
 
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