America, will they ever learn? (Gun Control Debate) | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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America, will they ever learn? (Gun Control Debate)

Re: America, will they ever learn?

mrposhman said:
Its scary how unaffected Americans have become to this sort of stuff. If this happened in Australia (either one of the shootings over the weekend) the outrage would have been out of the stratosphere.

I grew up in the UK and the more of these shootings that occur in America the more it reminds of when the wars began in Afghanistan and Iraq. Initially every time a soldier was killed, it was the first news story on every channel, it was on every front page. As the war continued on the news stories of soldiers slowly kept creeping further back into the news programmes and the newspapers and people seemed to become desensitised to the death that was occurring. The US is going through this now. These killings will (as with all the others) have no effect on a country drunk on guns and with a psyche that is ingrained from a young age that gun culture is fine.

I was reading comments earlier on facebook related to the Cristina Grimmie killing, an American claimed that banning guns would have no affect on murdering people as they would find other ways to do so. When challenged on what isn't occurring in other western countries he said that they would kill people with incendiary devices, yes incendiary devices. For all of the ludicrous things I had thought I had heard about gun culture in the US this is clearly the craziest. I mean how do we live in our great country with gun laws whilst all these bombs are going off murdering people we want to murder!!

What they don't seem to grasp is that guns do not provide an opportunity to rethink what you want to do. Someone posted a few pages back of a shooting in a cinema over something so small. If that was Australia, words would have been said, popcorn would have been thrown and both parties would likely just sit down and watch the movie but the US end up with a dead body.

There is evidence that shooting a gun desensitises even the person shooting it. That person if they so wished would find it harder to murder someone with a knife or through sheer physical strength as its far more personal.

The US is a great country in a lot of ways, but a seriously scary country in other ways.
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Good post.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

LeeToRainesToRoach said:
So if he makes a call to emergency services before the incident and swears allegiance to ISIS, it's got nothing to do with terrorism? Riiiiiiiiiight.....
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are you serious? just because he claims to have supported ISIS doesn't make him a terrorist. the FBI investigated him and cleared him. he was wannabe terrorist with no links to any organisation and received no instructions form any terrorist organisation to perform an act of terror. he saw 2 guys kiss and was disgusted by it. that was his motivation.

also, I wonder if the right wing nutters in the USA see the irony about how easily it was for a Muslim (the group many of them want out of their country) to take advantage of their weak gun laws.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Ian4 said:
also, I wonder if the right wing nutters in the USA see the irony about how easily it was for a Muslim (the group many of them want out of their country) to take advantage of their weak gun laws.
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they won't see any Irony. They say gun ownership was enshrined in the constitution, so was slave ownership originally. They make no connection to that. They rejects and dismiss all counter arguments, regardless of logic, data, none of it matters. More people need to get bigger guns is the solution to everything.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Obama saying something needs to be done. What's he been doing?
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Ian4 said:
are you serious? just because he claims to have supported ISIS doesn't make him a terrorist. the FBI investigated him and cleared him. he was wannabe terrorist with no links to any organisation and received no instructions form any terrorist organisation to perform an act of terror. he saw 2 guys kiss and was disgusted by it. that was his motivation.
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Whether he's defined as a terrorist, extremist, nutcase or whatever is irrelevant. (The politics of the left often focus on labels.) His religious beliefs are directly responsible for this atrocity.

This is why America wants Trump. Many people seek a return to abandoned values, including straight talking. Call it Western fundamentalism if you like.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

It appears as though ( just like Man Moris) he clamied his "allegiance" to ISIS as a way of scaring and venting. Doesn't really matter does it? He still killed 49 people.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

LeeToRainesToRoach said:
His religious beliefs are directly responsible for this atrocity.
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Not really. Its homophobia. Sure you can connect that to Islam, you just as easily connect it to Christainity, Hinduism. And if this blokes' religeous beliefs are directly responsible, are all the other mass murderers as well? Been plenty of massacres by Christians in the US, are they less bad because they are members of the home side?

Agree with Tim
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

LeeToRainesToRoach said:
Whether he's defined as a terrorist, extremist, nutcase or whatever is irrelevant. (The politics of the left often focus on labels.) His religious beliefs are directly responsible for this atrocity.
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it is relevant when politicians try to make political mileage out of it, which what was I was arguing. I found both Turnbull and Shortens comments yesterday disgusting.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Ian4 said:
it is relevant when politicians try to make political mileage out of it, which what was I was arguing. I found both Turnbull and Shortens comments yesterday disgusting.
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agree. Much longer way to go on gay equality than I thought.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Psycho homophobe who got influenced to mass kill by ISIS. Don't think many anti gay groups would advise to mass kill.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Harry said:
Psycho homophobe who got influenced to mass kill by ISIS. Don't think many anti gay groups would advise to mass kill.
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serious? US christian (edit, extremist groups) groups have come out and said that a massacre of gay people is a good thing. Don't want to post a link because I don't want to provide tham any oxygen, but it wasn't surprising to me. Also news is emerging that the killer was a regular visitor and big drinker at the club.

Also, I think you're correct, proportionally not many anti-gay groups would advise to mass kill, just like not many anti-gay muslims would advise to mass kill
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Harry said:
Psycho homophobe who got influenced to mass kill by ISIS. Don't think many anti gay groups would advise to mass kill.
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read the bible dude. all gays deserve to die.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

tigersnake said:
Not really. Its homophobia. Sure you can connect that to Islam, you just as easily connect it to Christainity, Hinduism. And if this blokes' religeous beliefs are directly responsible, are all the other mass murderers as well? Been plenty of massacres by Christians in the US, are they less bad because they are members of the home side?

Agree with Tim
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"God will punish those involved in homosexuality."

- shooter's father
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

tigersnake said:
serious? US christian (edit, extremist groups) groups have come out and said that a massacre of gay people is a good thing.
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Has it ever happened before? Have anti gays taken responsibility for mass shootings? Could be wrong but dont think there has been a case. ISIS have and is the no. 1 thing they promote. Not sure how you can say theres no link.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

LeeToRainesToRoach said:
"God will punish those involved in homosexuality."

- shooter's father
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what does that prove L2,? Muslim, Christian, Jewish, they all sing from the same old-testament songsheet.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

tigersnake said:
what does that prove L2,? Muslim, Christian, Jewish, they all sing from the same old-testament songsheet.
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Not sure that other faiths actively persecute homosexuals. They just forbid them to participate. Will stand corrected if wrong.
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

Ian4 said:
read the bible dude. all gays deserve to die.
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When was the last time a christian walked into a gay nightclub and shot dead 50 people? 10 people?
 
Re: America, will they ever learn?

brigadiertiger said:
When was the last time a christian walked into a gay nightclub and shot dead 50 people? 10 people?
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Sadly, has happened a fair few times from a google, included this list:

http://www.towleroad.com/2016/06/gay-bar-attacks/
 
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