Trade Targeting this year. | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Trade Targeting this year.

U2Tigers

U2Tigers

Tiger Legend
Nov 10, 2005
7,167
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Adelaide
Our number 1 must get type has to be a decent ruckman - One who can compete round 1 in 2011.

and unfortunately I reckon we need to do a Sydney ( no offense to swans as they trade better then anyone) and over pay if we have to. surely we have the room in the cap - and will have even more when others are booted and front ended contracts lessen as they get further into their contracts.

We need a ruckman who competes and we need one we can use for a few more years yet.

I know other positions need to be filled - but its the rucks where IMO we just can't cover.

Lets Trade hard in the trade period for a ruckman and be prepared to pay over the odds if we have to ( nice not to obviously though)

we have limited value - so we may need to anyway.

thoughts - who may be available?
 
Barnzy said:
Sam Jacobs, Shaun Hampson.
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No Way
If we need a ruck man , the best is BEN MCKEVOY
and lets not give away picks for duds that cant get a game at there current club, eg: thompson, farmer
We dont need anything from any other club till we start putting a side together... whats the point!!












n
 
josh fraser might be out of a job come years end, he would do the job for a few seasons
 
zippadeee said:
No Way
If we need a ruck man , the best is BEN MCKEVOY
and lets not give away picks for duds that cant get a game at there current club, eg: thompson, farmer
We dont need anything from any other club till we start putting a side together... whats the point!!
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They're hardly 'duds'. Both would be our 1st ruckman if they stepped into our team this week. Hampson was a 1st round draft pick and certainly has a lot of potential. He's like a poor man's Nic Nat - has crazy athleticism for his size but his football background is limited. Trouble is being a first-rounder they would want our first-rounder which is off-limits thus the only way we could get him is if we lure him with big $$$ to the PSD and offer him a guaranteed spot in the side. I'm not sure on the PSD rules for this year though, don't GC get first couple picks in that too?

As for Jacobs, he's on their rookie list so he would come much cheaper and he has plenty of potential from what I've seen. On McEvoy, yep he would be a good target but also would be very hard to get. The Saints will start giving him more and more games this year as King/Gardiner are ageing and coming to the end. He will be right in their future plans whereas the 2 I mentioned are behind Kreuzer/Warnock.
 
When are we going to address the backline? It's our weakest link at the moment. Thursfield and maybe Moore are the only 2 guys we should hold onto moving forward. Newman will be 30 before we start seeing results and wont be part of any future success. Who will take our kickouts? Who will be our Fullback? I would love to get a Hurley type and also a Ruckman in the trade period. We need someone who sets up the play from defence who is an extremely reliable kick and has a calm head.
 
mad_doggy911 said:
When are we going to address the backline? It's our weakest link at the moment. Thursfield and maybe Moore are the only 2 guys we should hold onto moving forward. Newman will be 30 before we start seeing results and wont be part of any future success. Who will take our kickouts? Who will be our Fullback? I would love to get a Hurley type and also a Ruckman in the trade period. We need someone who sets up the play from defence who is an extremely reliable kick and has a calm head.
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If he stays off the lunatic soup, Dan Connors is the kick out man I think. Gourdis could develop into the full back.
 
Thursfield and Moore as 2nd and 3rd defenders. Who would be our FB? I just don't know about Gourdis at this stage. I hope we recruit a creative defender this draft.
 
I did touch on this point a couple of years ago, but the more i think of the cost and time it takes to develop a ruckman from draft day as an 18 y/o, it's almost better in Richmond's case to try and pick up a bloke who has already had 3-4 years in the system, to at least just be a developed big body? It made me think about when Geelong traded Steven King, well he was not so much traded as simply cast aside. St.Kilda offered pick 90 for him (and Charlie Gardiner) and Geelong didn't even use the pick! Steven King would at least have been a competitive big man with a developed body that could be there while the likes of Vickery/Browne/Graham developed.

Put it this way, getting King for essentially zero would have been much more beneficial than spending our pick 19 on Jordan McMahon, a player who was never of any real value to Richmond insofar as to what he brings to the table.

But anyway, some of the ruckman around the traps who perhaps are on the 'List clogger' table Luke Darcy showed on One week at a time would surely come cheap, and would at least give more of a contest than poor Simmonds, whose body is just unable to cut it nowadays in modern footy. Say a Jake Spencer at Melbourne, Trent West at Geelong (maybe Mumford Mark II), Jonathon Griffen of Adelaide, just a big player who has been in the system for a few years already, who perhaps is crying out for a chance! Jamar this year, in his 8th season has broken out and is playing his best footy. Spider Burton played his best footy at North Melbourne after being in the system for several years at Freo. Dean Cox was rookie listed at the Eagles in 2000, and blossomed four or so seasons later. It would make much more sense i reckon, just 'skip' the development time and use our draft picks on quality mids/KPP's if available.

I just reckon it might almost be a case that ruckmen should almost say be drafted maybe at age 21, enabling them to play senior footy at WAFL/SANFL or even VFL level for a couple of years to establish themselves first. At 18 unless they are an exception like a Nic Natanui they are in the main too skinny, too raw to ever have a meaningful impact for a few years. Even Mark Blake at Geelong, it wasn't until about 2007 that he played regular footy, his 4th year at the club. I know he's hardly a poster boy for a super-quality ruckman, but he IS a very good tap ruckman, who is qualitatively better at that role than Mumford was in 2009.

Just reckon this is the way to go while we try and grab quality players in other areas for our list. What do others think of this?
 
U2Tigers said:
and unfortunately I reckon we need to do a Sydney ( no offense to swans as they trade better then anyone) and over pay if we have to. surely we have the room in the cap - and will have even more when others are booted and front ended contracts lessen as they get further into their contracts.
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I know where you are coming from here U2, but I must say that I am not sure Sydney have overpaid for a ruckman. They have done very well out of trading for ruckmen in the past, and it is obviously a recruiting strategy they are comfortable with. One thing they have shown is that a good ruckman (not neccessarily great) is still a key player in today's game.

I reckon good ruckmen are very valuable commodoties. Clubs often invest 3-4 years of development in these guys, so to prise one loose you need to offer up something substantial.

It remains to be seen whether Seaby is going to come on like they hope he will, but I think when we were interested in him, West Coast asked for a realistic price. We just were not prepared to pay what they wanted.
 
What is in our favour is that we will have the $$$ at years end to lure 1 if not 2 decent names to the club.

The issue is of course who or what we would actually target (ie player type/player position) and if these targets would need to fit in to our current youth policy.

I agree that one of these targeted players needs to be a ruckman, someone who can actually play.

I am very disappointed that Gus seems to have taken a backwards step this season as he showed some good signs last year, and even kicked some goals when resting up forward - he really looked the goods during a few games last year. Browne has so far failed to impress also. I really hope these two can turn it around if not only to gain some trade value come season end (Graham or Browne combined with McGuane for a GC late 1st rounder maybe ;D).

I think a young ruck such as Mitch Clark would be a good pick-up as at this point in time Luenberger has his measure at the Lions. Clark hasn't been playing that crash hot so far so maybe his end of year value may be less than what it was last year. We will see. The Lions also have Charman recovering from injury (probably won't do too much anyway) and also McCulloch who the Lions have high hopes of. Will the Lions let Clark go - who knows??

As Barnzy stated, both Hampson and Jacobs aren't too shabby. Their recent VFL form has been quite good and are both close to promotion to seniors. The good thing with either of these is that their value would be relatively lower compared to that of Clark plus they will both get better as they play more games.

At the end of the day, we need a ruckman who can actually contest the ruck. If they can do other things around the ground then that's a bonus. The fact that Simmonds is our primary ruck shows how deficient we are in that area. TV will be good but needs a couple more years to handle the role full time.

Which leads us to the 2nd player we should target - any ideas??
 
davesexton said:
I did touch on this point a couple of years ago, but the more i think of the cost and time it takes to develop a ruckman from draft day as an 18 y/o, it's almost better in Richmond's case to try and pick up a bloke who has already had 3-4 years in the system, to at least just be a developed big body? It made me think about when Geelong traded Steven King, well he was not so much traded as simply cast aside. St.Kilda offered pick 90 for him (and Charlie Gardiner) and Geelong didn't even use the pick! Steven King would at least have been a competitive big man with a developed body that could be there while the likes of Vickery/Browne/Graham developed.

Put it this way, getting King for essentially zero would have been much more beneficial than spending our pick 19 on Jordan McMahon, a player who was never of any real value to Richmond insofar as to what he brings to the table.

But anyway, some of the ruckman around the traps who perhaps are on the 'List clogger' table Luke Darcy showed on One week at a time would surely come cheap, and would at least give more of a contest than poor Simmonds, whose body is just unable to cut it nowadays in modern footy. Say a Jake Spencer at Melbourne, Trent West at Geelong (maybe Mumford Mark II), Jonathon Griffen of Adelaide, just a big player who has been in the system for a few years already, who perhaps is crying out for a chance! Jamar this year, in his 8th season has broken out and is playing his best footy. Spider Burton played his best footy at North Melbourne after being in the system for several years at Freo. Dean Cox was rookie listed at the Eagles in 2000, and blossomed four or so seasons later. It would make much more sense i reckon, just 'skip' the development time and use our draft picks on quality mids/KPP's if available.

I just reckon it might almost be a case that ruckmen should almost say be drafted maybe at age 21, enabling them to play senior footy at WAFL/SANFL or even VFL level for a couple of years to establish themselves first. At 18 unless they are an exception like a Nic Natanui they are in the main too skinny, too raw to ever have a meaningful impact for a few years. Even Mark Blake at Geelong, it wasn't until about 2007 that he played regular footy, his 4th year at the club. I know he's hardly a poster boy for a super-quality ruckman, but he IS a very good tap ruckman, who is qualitatively better at that role than Mumford was in 2009.

Just reckon this is the way to go while we try and grab quality players in other areas for our list. What do others think of this?
Click to expand...

This is a very good post. I agree lets stock up other areas on our list and trade to top up or Rookie a few each year from the state leagues.
 
I'd like the club to take a good look at Mathew Leuenburger of Brisbane. He is 22 and just beginning to find his way in the game. He is competing with a few at the Lions for a share of the jam and he comes from the west and therefore may have fewer connections in Qld, to take into account in making such a move.

If he could get to us for a reasonable trade, like an ex Qld player who wanted to go home, I'd have no difficulty if he was to become our best paid player in 2011.
 
any talk of getting the likes of Leuenberger or McEvoy needs to be tempered with the reality that both clubs will demand (IMO) a first round pick PLUS a player, and that is even if they are willing to talk - personally given they are the future rucks for Brissy and the Saints I highly doubt it.

U2 is right, Swans paid high for Seaby, but you always do with rucks. Even that tool Wood was traded for a first round pick.

IMO even an average ruck will still command a second round (normal time) pick, but in the compromised draft that may be juiced to first round. This is because rucks are the worst to develop, and they are the one position most clubs tend to be vulnerable to being short on.

As for picking up a player in the PSD, don't forget GC17 and GWS. They can get one uncontracted player from each club, so if we convince a guy to remain uncontracted, we will have to fight against the GC17 dollars to even get them into the PSD.

Not saying its impossible, but it will be bloody hard.

Also I am extraordinarily reluctant to give up our first round pick
 
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