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Russia Invades Ukraine
- Thread starter Tigers of Old
- Start date
I am a leftie
But I can also be contrarian!
Plus, I like provoking debate.
I'm not saying Russia and Putin are right to argue that they should get all the territories the Russian Empire held in 1914, what I am saying is that if the West wants to accuse Russia of expansionism, then Russia has grounds to throw the same accusation back at the West.
There are plenty of other factors one can throw in. Wasn't the West involved in overthrowing one of the previous governments in Ukraine? So it isn't just Russia trying to intervene in Ukranian affairs, the West has done the same and is no doubt still doing so. Both sides want a compliant regime in Ukraine.
I don't have a very high opinion of "representative democracy", it sure beats authoritarianism but I don't see it as particularly democratic. Those independence votes would not have been totally free and fair, manipulation would have been going on all over the place. I'm all for self-determination, but I don't delude myself that somehow acts of self-determination occur in some unadulterated environment of total freedom.
Not a crazy response, a response which recognises that there are many sides to any conflict. A response which also seeks to understand where both sides are coming from. If we truly want to stop a full blown war in Ukraine, we have to understand what is driving the various actors in the conflict. Simply labelling Putin as insane or the like is useless and Putin does not strike me as unhinged, he strikes me as a cunning and smart operator. This is not a whim, this is Putin trying to expand his interests and his power. No doubt he is also playing domestic politics too. Plus, he looks like he will get away with whatever he is up to unless someone has some way of stopping him which is actually within the realms of possibility.
In terms of our own independence, I seem to recall that a Brit is our Head of State!
DS
Lets roll back the British Empire then whilst we are at it shall we???
Just because a country has been in control in the past, does not give it an current ownership allowances. Before Russia took control of Ukraine in the 1700's, it was controlled by Poland. So Poland had it before, so surely they can take it back then from Russia.
Its very clear what Putins aim is, he wants access to Ukraines natural reserves, he wants to control the movement of Russian gas into the EU (which goes through pipelines that run through Ukraine). This is not some sort of salvation for the people of Ukraine, this is all about controlling Ukraines natural assets.
He probably will get away with this IMO, though with massive sanctions. If he wants to take Ukraine, it doesn't sound like the West have any will to send troops in so it comes down to how much the Ukrainians want to defend their borders.
What is the most significant part of this video you've posted, for those of us who don't have an hour and 20 minutes to watch some random YouTube podcast?
First 20 mins will do , just thought it was something some might find worth a look
Why stop there, Mr P? I’m sure the Ottomans, the Mongols and the Romans would like some of the territory they once held dominion over back.
hand to hand combat with a battalion of neanderthals wouldn't be for the feint hearted.
Speaking of neanderthals, these economic sanctions seem to be aimed at individuals?
The Oligarchs.
The gang of fat blokes in gold chains, sitting on the beach, gulping Moscow Mules at a Thai kiddy brothel.
As if its season 5 on Netflix.
I reckon its a way for The West to keep their economies ticking away indirectly with The USSR (sic),
while seizing some beach front real estate in Gold Coast, Florida and Soho at the same time?
Cue gold and bitcoin,
as The Oligarchs run away laughing
a perfect segway into Season 6
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Fantastic. Abramavich has effectively been expelled.
Now for the removal of Chelsea as well….
Now for the removal of Chelsea as well….
Chelsea owner Roman Abramovich 'has been BARRED from living in UK'
Senior security sources reportedly say it is unlikely that the 55-year-old will ever be allowed to live in Britain again, after he withdrew his application for a Tier 1 visa in 2018.
www.dailymail.co.uk
anyone empathising with Putin,
really need to reflect on their POV I reckon.
yeah it takes 2 to tango,
but if half the pair is a psycho with 6000 nukes,
you don't applaud
if your predisposed to backing wrong horses,
review MAGA, Qanon, Canberra Convoys POV on Putin,
and invert it.
Yeah the lack of condemnation on this thread, from many left leaners, of a corrupt, brutal, murdering, despotic, fascist dictator is very surprising. Bewildering.
Anyway, I'd be very concerned if I was a citizen of Georgia, Azerbaijan, Armenia, Kazakhstan, Uzbekistan etc etc. Vlad wants the gang back together; the old Soviet Union. The Baltic states will be thanking their lucky stars that they were granted Nato membership.
Exactly. I also don't understand somes views. I imagine some of those that seemingly support Putins actions (with his reasoning based on lies of genocide and Nazism - the Ukraine's president is a jew by the way) didn't support the war in Iraq because it was based on lies. The hypocrisy there is astounding.
I agree on the Baltics, especially those not in NATO. There was a reason Ukraine was desperate to join NATO and that was due to Article 5 - an attack on 1 is an attack on all members - so IMO those other Baltic countries not currently in NATO will be very worried about what the future holds for their countries.
Not backing anyone but it's a bit rich of the US and the West to condemn what's happening now after the invasions of Iraq and Kosovo. Where was the worldwide condemnation then?
