Coronavirus | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
  • IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.

Coronavirus

MD Jazz said:
Not quite right. Those agitating for golf were seen as selfish despite little evidence it represented a transmission risk. There was no logic to it, it was more a "just suck it up" attitude. The fact that every other state allowed golf without incurring outbreaks was ignored. The health and well-being benefits of golf were ignored. Sam Newman had a good point but because of his antics and the fact it was Newman they were dismissed.

I doubt if they impose further restrictions that golf would again be banned.
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But those telling golfers to suck it up weren't being hysterical, they were exhibiting the quintessential Australian trait of compliance. Whether or not golf was safe was not the point, we'd been told we couldn't play so we went, "yeah, alright". It's always been the Aussie way to pull outliers into line - we're convicts afraid of the whip (and/or ANZACs doing it for the team), not rebels convinced of our righteousness like our US cousins. That's why our gun control was so successful - there were enough angry gun toters for Howard to wear a bullet-proof vest, but the greater community attitude of, "Mate, pull your head in. We need to stop mass shootings more than you need an AK-47" prevailed.

Believe me, our national conformity and compliance frustrate me plenty, but they're also key reasons we got on top of this thing so well so quickly.
 
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antman said:
yeah, restricted travel, continued social distancing while opening up within Australia as much as possible for the economy and hope not too many oldies get infected, overload the health system and cark it. Won't be fun.

On the other hand at least employers will be more open to peeps working from home at least part time now, depending on type of occupation of course.
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For how long would we continue with that? I mean if we don't have a vaccine and I'm playing devils advocate here, how long would we retain restrictions for? Restrictions are short term measures, they cannot be retained for the long term, or other issues will ultimately result in more people dying from other causes such as suicide.

A vaccine is not a guarantee that we will not get it, flu still kills hundreds of thousands of people annually but we live with that. Even if we have a vaccine we will need to live with some form of Covid for the rest of our lives, so my question stands, do you retain being cut off from the rest of the world forever if lets say we have it controlled in Australia and the rest of the world doesn't?
 
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LeeToRainesToRoach said:
Herd immunity was proven by Sweden to be a failed theory. Only 6.1% of the population has antibodies, and they need at least 60% for it to work. This is a classic example of scientific modelling by very smart people being way, way off target.

As terrible as the outcome for the UK has been, if they had proceeded down this path it would've been far worse.
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I'm not talking short term strategies here, I'm probing peoples views on long term strategies if we cannot get a vaccine.
 
My question around this came from what I saw from Dr Fauci in the last few days. He made a comment that he was very optimistic that we would have a vaccine by the end of 2020 and for distribution in Q1 2021 - Great.

What he also seemed to indicate was if we didn't have 1 by then, we may never have one. The amount of resources that appear to be going into vaccine development is on an unprecedented scale. If all these geniuses worldwide cannot come up with a virus by then, then strategy needs to be reviewed.

We either hole up in our bunkers for the rest of our lives or we come up with a Plan B. Thats what my question was around, not around what we should have done, should we have gone down the herd immunity route straightaway. I supported the lockdown, I probably supported a harder lockdown than we got but there you go, but I am asking for thoughts on a what if. What if we don't get a vaccine within the next 6 months, do we just lock ourselves off from the world, or do we then change tact, and take some short term pain (and unfortunately this will result in loss of life). Its not an easy decision but 1 that our country (and many others) may need to be making within the next 6-9 months.
 
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mrposhman said:
My question around this came from what I saw from Dr Fauci in the last few days. He made a comment that he was very optimistic that we would have a vaccine by the end of 2020 and for distribution in Q1 2021 - Great.

What he also seemed to indicate was if we didn't have 1 by then, we may never have one. The amount of resources that appear to be going into vaccine development is on an unprecedented scale. If all these geniuses worldwide cannot come up with a virus by then, then strategy needs to be reviewed.

We either hole up in our bunkers for the rest of our lives or we come up with a Plan B. Thats what my question was around, not around what we should have done, should we have gone down the herd immunity route straightaway. I supported the lockdown, I probably supported a harder lockdown than we got but there you go, but I am asking for thoughts on a what if. What if we don't get a vaccine within the next 6 months, do we just lock ourselves off from the world, or do we then change tact, and take some short term pain (and unfortunately this will result in loss of life). Its not an easy decision but 1 that our country (and many others) may need to be making within the next 6-9 months.
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All valid points but a couple of comments.

Vaccines take a long time to develop. Having one within a year is almost unprecedented, especially for a virus we are still learning about and is so complex.

The answer is not only a vaccine. For instance there is no vaccine for HIV. What is happening is also enormous amounts of work on treatments so that if people get the virus it’s mortality rate is reduced.

We live with viruses (the common cold is a virus) , the key without a vaccine is learning how to treat it so that the vast majority survive.
 
Sintiger said:
All valid points but a couple of comments.

Vaccines take a long time to develop. Having one within a year is almost unprecedented, especially for a virus we are still learning about and is so complex.

The answer is not only a vaccine. For instance there is no vaccine for HIV.
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Donald Trump invented an HIV vaccine!

 
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Sintiger said:
All valid points but a couple of comments.

Vaccines take a long time to develop. Having one within a year is almost unprecedented, especially for a virus we are still learning about and is so complex.

The answer is not only a vaccine. For instance there is no vaccine for HIV. What is happening is also enormous amounts of work on treatments so that if people get the virus it’s mortality rate is reduced.

We live with viruses (the common cold is a virus) , the key without a vaccine is learning how to treat it so that the vast majority survive.
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This is such a tricky issue.

I must say I find the optimism Dr Fauci shows a bit surprising, my understanding is that we don't currently have a vaccine for any Corona Virus.

Treatment options is certainly a big factor, this virus does seem to be very easy to catch and has a long period of incubation which makes it hard to identify carriers. But if it can be effectively treated it becomes much less of a problem.

We can see that the concentration at the moment has been flattening the curve followed by possibly eradicating the virus. They must be looking at what we do if the virus is still circulating and some countries have close to eradicated it while others haven't. Although I suspect there is a factor of not overloading everyone with more messages about what happens later, I also suspect they have little to say on this as it is a thorny issue and any answer is not going to be good - do we open up with the virus still circulating, do we have restricted opening with the idea we control the spread? Keeping international borders closed is not sustainable in the medium to long term so at some point decisions will have to be made and it looks likely that it will be a choice between bad options.

DS
 
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There was a story a couple of months back to the tune of, but for the Yanks pulling a million bucks or two from an Aussie research project they'd already ploughed heaps of millions into, we'd have a vaccine soon if not now.
 
Tigers of Old said:
33 new cases overnight in Victoria. :(
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I think its gonna continue to rise for another week while they target test those cluster suburbs. The biggest concern will be is if they don't start flattening within 8-10 days. The govt might have to consider heavy lockdowns of those regions if it doesn't flattern after that.
 
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Wow talk about smashing an entire council area. Casey is one of if not the biggest council area within the Greater Melbourne area. By stating all of the council area for days when the only suburb showing spikes is Hallam seems unhelpful to me. My kids go to school in the Casey area, but this is at least 30kms from Hallam. Cardinia shire is similar but Pakenham is one of the biggest urban areas within the Cardinia area.
 
DavidSSS said:
This is such a tricky issue.

I must say I find the optimism Dr Fauci shows a bit surprising, my understanding is that we don't currently have a vaccine for any Corona Virus.
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it been said previous attempts to find vaccines for corana viruses have all been stopped because the threat has passed- so the funding has dried up.
so perhaps this time the efforts will have more chance, cos the funding wont dry up any time soon.
 
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Brodders17 said:
it been said previous attempts to find vaccines for corana viruses have all been stopped because the threat has passed- so the funding has dried up.
so perhaps this time the efforts will have more chance, cos the funding wont dry up any time soon.
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I think the threat also passed with viruses becoming less virulent.

But I bloody hope you are right and they do manage it this time.

DS
 
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