No excuse
Higgins went before 5 A grade players. Taylor, Ryan, Allen, Powell and Kelly.
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IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
Once In a Generation Rebuild
- Thread starter blofield
- Start date
Higgins went before 5 A grade players. Taylor, Ryan, Allen, Powell and Kelly.
You can play that game every year. Higgins was a sound pick, will be a good player.
Not for us.
He is a average footballer.
Not a first rounder and not better then the next 10 players selected after him.
We ballsed up another first rounder.
You've made my point.
Being -that those 3 elite players have allowed us to achieve the glory that we have.
This time around - we don't have that luxury. No mini rebuild.
In order to gain access to such talent again - means we'll have to finish near bottom for the next few years.
In 5 years time those 16 players I've listed won't be on the list.
We are already seeing the dramatic decline in overall team performance - when a number of those players aren't in the side.
IMO those players you've mentioned - wont be able to fill the void at a leadership level.
Good team players they are and they play to the best of their abilities when they're surrounded by elite talent.
Alot of them go missing - they will be found out when our leaders retire.
Better than some picked ahead of him, also. He was an OK pick; not great, not terrible. A bit sad that we invested three years of development, though.
For better or worse we're aiming to repeat Geelong's perennial contender performance. Taking your approach to the nth degree, we could trade out everyone with ability and start again with a GWS-like hand at the draft. And maybe end up like a Gold Coast.
Was it a bad year or the end of the road? Not sure myself.
In short: you must bottom out for some time in order to obtain elite new long term talent
Just trying to be a realist Lee and not sugar coat things.
Not suggesting at all to trade out our better younger talent.
In an expanded national competition - where only the mediocre are rewarded - the only way to replenish your elite talent is bottoming out.
It's a price we have to pay for being so consistent/successful these last 9 years.
Ah I'm not sugar-coating. There are some signs that the era is over and it's no good pretending we will simply bounce back as a matter of course. The club will know the reasons for this year's failure, how much each contributed and whether they can be fixed. I'm neither optimistic nor pessimistic about next year. Well, maybe a touch pessimistic.
I don't think you can run a club entering a full rebuild with where our list is at. You are pretty much saying to everyone over 25 that you're not going to play in a premiership here.
In the last 10 years there have been 40 premiership medals won by players in their 30's. Don't think you can say to Martin/Grimes/Riewoldt/Edwards/Lambert that we've stopped trying.
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We’ve consistently kept our draft picks and developed from within for nearly 20 years and it’s worked pretty well.
It’s not like we had to mortgage our future by trading away picks to build this list.
In fact, we did the opposite in 2017 - we traded away a current star player for a future draft pick that we had yet to receive, so we won that flag with the bank owing us!
Relax, we’re in a good position to consistently contend over the coming decade.
It’s not like we had to mortgage our future by trading away picks to build this list.
In fact, we did the opposite in 2017 - we traded away a current star player for a future draft pick that we had yet to receive, so we won that flag with the bank owing us!
Relax, we’re in a good position to consistently contend over the coming decade.
Bollocks. Age mid next year? So when they've nearly played another full season?
These guys have at least a couple of years in them of footy left in them:
Martin 30
Grimes 30
Astbury 30
Lambert 29
Pickett 29
Caddy 29
Lynch 28
Prestia 28
Broad 28
Mcintosh 27
Vlastuin 27
Nankervis 26
Yes, we need to build. For sure. We have a few good pick this year to kick things off. Pinch a free agent or two and we're right back in it next year.
But having Nick and Toby in your retiree list is rich, they're barely in the second half of their careers. And there some great talent in the bottom half of the age list (and some players who need to go, but that's true of every list, every year). Things need to turn over but done well from here, it's entirely possible to stay near the top.
True but you also have to nail the draft picks & then develop the players. We nailed the picks with Cotchin, Martin, Rance & Riewoldt. Rance in particular then had lots of development - first 30-40 games were terrible really.
Not really. We won several premierships with a (small) core of high picks, a well-chosen set of rookie-listers, and a bunch of sound recruits. Even as we lose some top talent, we have some good picks to potentially fill that hole, and there's a free agent or two every year who would want to play for us. As a big club, it can be managed. There's a club probably going to win the premiership this year who has done exactly that - a year after the retirement of the best player of his generation.
The most successful clubs manage their mix best; picks are a factor but not critical. I'd love to see a matrix of picks correlation to success. Given they've all gone to Carlton, GC, Brissy and GWS for a decade (with what, 1 grand final appearance between them?), I'm confident that the most important factors are good mid-late drafting and playing the trading game best.
This not a total rebuild not by any stretch. However there are red lights flashing in all 3 key areas of the ground. I don't think we can turn all 3 to green in one draft. Maybe 2. Certainly 3.
Said it before but we need to finish 13th so that we get to play the GCS, Carlton, Hawthorn etc twice next season. That married with good list management in drafting and trading should see us back in the final 8 in 2022.
It is going to be a critical off season. We need to review all aspects of the club very carefully. Assistant coaches, fitness and conditioning and list management. It has been a horrible year and it needs to be carefully reviewed and not let the recent success hide what is going wrong right now.
I think similar to 2016 we need to bring in some players who can help us compete around the ball. We have looked like grade 7 kids playing against grade 10 kids for a lot of this year. If we aren't going to trade out our early picks for guns at least try and get a Dunstan or a Crouch to help in the contest. Sure they aren't world beaters but they would help us compete better around clearances. We have been putrid in that area all season.
I would defineitely change all the assistants except for maybe Kingsley. He could move back to the midfield stoppage area. It's time for some fresh voices to challenge Dimma.
It's time for Benny and Balmey to get to work and carefully review the wreckage of 2021. We don't want to fade off into being irrelevant again.
I think similar to 2016 we need to bring in some players who can help us compete around the ball. We have looked like grade 7 kids playing against grade 10 kids for a lot of this year. If we aren't going to trade out our early picks for guns at least try and get a Dunstan or a Crouch to help in the contest. Sure they aren't world beaters but they would help us compete better around clearances. We have been putrid in that area all season.
I would defineitely change all the assistants except for maybe Kingsley. He could move back to the midfield stoppage area. It's time for some fresh voices to challenge Dimma.
It's time for Benny and Balmey to get to work and carefully review the wreckage of 2021. We don't want to fade off into being irrelevant again.
Got some good early picks this year 5 in the top 50 including 2 first rounders some good kids coming through and some good young talent already playing. We need some good coaches to replace McCrae, Leppitch and Caracalla, think we are lacking in this department.
Well said hutstar.
Look at Geesook's list. Half their players are in their mid 30's and they are challenging for the Flag this year!!
Our players looked tired and lethargic all year. For most of the season the oppo looked bigger faster stronger than us. That hasn't been the case since 2017. Hoping it's just a matter of preparation and our short preseason. Or the loss of Innis or both. Hoping we can fix this soon and significantly improve our fitness and conditioning otherwise we are a bottom 4 side on recent performances.
I wasn't at all suggesting the players at the lower end of the list would retire.
It was indicative of the ageing list.
The age marker for mid next year - was to highlight the extreme age of our core senior group. Not too many successful lists or any lists for that matter - have the majority of their leadership group that old - 31/32 plus. let alone 33+.
Many of those players you've listed are now starting to be hit by injuries(especially soft tissue) and out for considerable periods. Something that comes naturally when you hit 29+. Week to week propositions in fact.
Also there's every indication their best form is behind them - Again something that is natural for the 29+ Age band.
With those 2 last points - You're starting to see that in the dramatic fall off/inconsistency in our form. Players out at times. Yes. But that just highlights my previous point.
If you're expecting the same output from those players next year - from that of the 3 flags - you're dreamin'
Plus taking the presence(not form) of Cotchin/Riewoldt/Edwards out the team is immeasurable.
With Astbury on the verge of retirement - If Grimes goes down next year - Who are you going to call on.
