Legend & Frawley

[MC24]

MC24 - My criteria is not about signing coaches. It's about knowing when they cant coach.

How much of a go do you want to give him? I would have thought 4 years was a fair crack of the whip.

You're criteria seems to change an awful lot RFC not KFC. Funnily enough, always to suit your own argument.

I'm just repeating myself now, but here goes anyway.

The support Danny now has behind him has only been put in place this season. Not four years ago, this season.

You can all but dismiss the previous three years, because it was only after last season that the Club worked through all the areas that needed extra support or attention and are now doing something about them.

If you and others don't want to hear that then I can't make you.

 

[RFC not KFC]

MC24 - where has this criteria changed? It has only ever referred to the 1st four years of coaching and pre coaching. As I see it you plan on having him there at least another 2 years, based on what?

Dean3 - I want ot see a clean out of the list. I dont expect to see us winning flags next year. All I'm saying is let's get a decent coach to oversee this process. Frawley is NOT the man for the job.

nwonash - Chaffey, I'd call it natural progression.
Hall - Are talking about the same Ray Hall
Johnson - He was a star before Frawley met him
Zantuck - Has pedigree.
Tivendale - Natural progression for a talented player.
Rodan - champion under 18 player, would be even better currently with a decent coach and more genuine game time earlier
Krak - Has pedigree and should have been given more game time earlier.
Stafford - Had one bad year at Sydney due to injuries. Frawley's done nothing to make him a better player
Coughlan - This kid would be a champion with a moron like me coaching him. Every so often they do come along.

Frawley may well be responsible some of the development shown by these players but Ill take any bets that he never coaches an AFL premiership team.

 

[Harry]

MC24 - a few questions for you. Whats your opinion on the current style of football we play? Are you happy with the way the team has been playing considering we've been able to field our best players lately besides Gaspar and Campbell. If you can say yes than by all means support the coach.

Besides stability, past sacking of coaches, the image we will portray, and all that , what positives have you got to say about the way the team has been playing? Say we haven't sacked a coach for 10 years, what would your opinion be of the coach then?

Don't answer with - RFC are in a better position than us to know what is best for the club - what is your opinion?

You say that the list and its depth is our problem? For the second half of the season Frawely has had our best 20 at his disposal. You cannot use depth of the list as an excuse because he hasn't needed to utilise the fringe players. If depth of the list is used as an excuse then list must be absolutely shocking and Frawely must be held accountable for this.

My opinion is that our list is not as bad as people are saying. We have a much much better list than Carlton, Geelong, and North yet we couldn't manage to beat them with our best team on the park. Under Frawely the team plays disorganised, with no confidence, basically not as a team.

My concern is that if RFC tear apart the team and introduce alot of young blood and persist with Frawely and his style of play then we will be worse than we are now because the young faces will lose complete confidence playing under his unorganised, unimaginative game plan.

 

[MC24]

MC24 - where has this criteria changed? It has only ever referred to the 1st four years of coaching and pre coaching. As I see it you plan on having him there at least another 2 years, based on what?

Maybe the criteria hasn't changed RFC not KFC, but it seems that you steer it in the direction to suit your own argument. In the end, what does any of it really prove? It's proof enough for you, but not for me. Are you right and I'm wrong, or round the other way? It depends on what you want to believe.

And how come you've ignored my comment about the support put in place this year?

Also, I don't know where I said I plan on having Danny as the Coach for the next two years. I have said previously that whatever the Club decides is fine by me. If he should go, I'm fine with that. If he should stay, I'm fine with that too.

They have done the necessary ground work and I am prepared to be patient to see the results of those changes.

Obviously you're determined that Danny is the wrong man for the job.

Maybe he is. But there's nothing either of us can do about it. So I'll support whatever decision the Club makes.

 

[RFC not KFC]

MC24 - I'll continue to ignore your comments about the support structure until you let us all know what happens at the end of next year if we dont improve under Frawley. On the logic you've used so far you'd be in favour of keeping him as the situation would be the same as current. This is the basis of me thinking you'll give him another 2 years.

As for supporting the club in any decisions it makes, what would you do if they decided to merge? Support them because they know best? Walt Disney made a great movie about Lemmings that you should watch.

 

[Koalalill]

You say that the list and its depth is our problem? For the second half of the season Frawely has had our best 20 at his disposal. You cannot use depth of the list as an excuse because he hasn't needed to utilise the fringe players.

Harry, this is where you confuse me.

You say we have had our best 20 available in the second hafl of the season. Isn't that part of the problem? The reality some of our "so called" best 20 wouldn't get a game with most other sides. You have highlighted them Harry on previous occassions.

Look at Saturday night - there were some who wouldn't get a game anywhere else.

Example: On a previous thread you have said that Flemming has to go. Duncan Kellaway you said he should go too - both of them played Saturday.

Look at the last 10 weeks - we have had King, Biddescombe, Houlihan play - surely they are not in the best 20. You say he hasn't had to utilise the fringe players - aren't these blokes those fringe players you speak of?

Our list lacks depth - there is huge gap between our best 15-16 and the rest of the list.

 

[shawry]

Gaspar would be in out best 20, I would have thought.

 

[Harry]

Its one thing to use depth as an excuse when you have alot of injuries but you cannot use it as an excuse when you have only 2 major injuries - Campbell and Gaspar.

If there is a huge gap between our best 15 and the rest, then Frawely has introduced, developed and persisted with 25 incapable players.

How can you possibly say its not the coaches fault for this?

 

[Koalalill]

That's the fundamental difference between us Harry.

You only blame our current coach for our current plight and no-one else.

There are many people Harry that have got us into the crap situation we find ourselves in.

I hold the RFC past and to a degree the Present responsible for the crap situation we find ourselves. Because as a Club they haven't made tough decisions - they have now. That is why they have my strong support on this whole issue.

I will repeat this again - Finally we as a club have bitten the bullet and said we have to start thinking long term rather going for these short term solutions of fingers crossed and hope this works.

Now no matter if people want to admit it or not we have not been in that position since the early 1990's when we had no choice.

A decision has been made by those in charge and I will continue to support tham any way I can

 

[MC24]

MC24 - I'll continue to ignore your comments about the support structure until you let us all know what happens at the end of next year if we dont improve under Frawley. On the logic you've used so far you'd be in favour of keeping him as the situation would be the same as current. This is the basis of me thinking you'll give him another 2 years.

As for supporting the club in any decisions it makes, what would you do if they decided to merge? Support them because they know best? Walt Disney made a great movie about Lemmings that you should watch.

I support whatever I believe in RFC not KFC.

Why should I continue to answer any of your questions when I've put forward some of my own. How many have you responded to?

Basically, I don't care who the coach is. I just want a footy Club that is going in the right direction. I can't help it if people don't want to see what is going on and have no patience.

You people will believe whatever you want to believe, even if I answer every single question. I have answered till I am blue in the face. Believe whatever you want to believe. Nothing I say will make any difference to you.

You all choose to ignore the areas that defeat your arguments. So why should I continue to debate with people who don't want to see any side other than their own?

 

[Harry]

I hold the RFC past and to a degree the Present responsible for the crap situation we find ourselves.

KL - did you give your full support to the past RFC administration because you seem to blame them alot.

KL - is it the past administrations fault for getting Nicholls and Fleming to the club, for extending Kings contract, for giving biddiscombe a ridiculous contract, for backing out of a trade with freo which would have seen sinclair swapped for bourke, for giving Holland and Gaspar unbeleivable amounts which resulted in us going short on our list, and for all other stupid decisions I am not aware of.

I guess its the past administrations fault for the ugly, predictable way the team plays the game currently.

You can always blame the past but until you actually see what is happening at the present, you will not make the correct decisions.

 

[Bunnerz]

we need sheedy
he was so close to coming 4 years ago

 

[Koalalill]

KL - is it the past administrations fault for getting Nicholls and Fleming to the club, for extending Kings contract, for giving biddiscombe a ridiculous contract, for backing out of a trade with freo which would have seen sinclair swapped for bourke, for giving Holland and Gaspar unbeleivable amounts which resulted in us going short on our list, and for all other stupid decisions I am not aware of.

Nicholls Fleming - No!

Contracts given to *smile* & Holland - Yes. You seem to convienently forget Harry - that Mark Brayshaw negotiated those contracts. The Coach says who he wants to keep on the list - but at the RFC up until this season contracts were negotiated by the CEO - Mark Brayshaw. The length and $$ were negotiated by Brayshaw not Frawley. So if we are over paying these plays - who is to blame? Don't forget that the Club had a chance to re-sign *smile* to a significantly lower $$ contract before the end of 2001 but they botched it.

Regarding Bidders contract - coming off arguably his best season - again negotiated by Brayshaw after the manager did the normal stand over garbage. King - coming of his best season in the eyes of many (not mine) they extened his contract. I agree with you on this the King contract was wrong.

Contracts are now negotiated by Greg Miller. So these days of players and player managers trying to hold the Club to ransom are long gone.

Harry,

I am quite aware as to what is happening at present - but I am also acutely aware of what the has happened in the past that has led us to where we are now. A decision has been made by the Club that I happen to agree with and you don't. What is happening at present is the Club has decided the way the move forward is to address the state of our list. I for one think it the right decision and think it is long over due.

Finally, no Harry I have not always supported the decisions the CLub had made. The passion (anger)you show on this issue - is the passion(anger) I have had with many decision made in the past (Appointing Gieschen for example). I have said this before but I will repeat it - I have made every effort this season to find out what they are trying to do and from the information I have gathered the people I spoken to I have reached my own conclusion and that is why I am so strong in my support of the Club and the direction they are taking

 

[UntamedTiger]

Hey guys and gals,

I think all of us what the RFC to be successful. What we have read on this thread is a clear indication of many differing opinions on the method/approach to take. What I fear is that several people on this site are prepared to accept decisions by the RFC lock, stock and barrel. Considering previous decisions by this and previous admins, I make no apologies in having no faith in them making the right decision(s).

 

[the claw]

mc24 ask yourself 2 questions is there somebody else out there capable of doing a better job than frawley with a proven record? and how do you judge a coaches success is it win loss ratio tactical nouse or bility to get the best out of players or is it being capable of introducing a flexible game plan orblooding & nurturing youngsters into a team in my book frawley has failed in all these areas and yes there are better credentalled people out there than the dud ive asked these questions of the head in the sand crowd before and not got an answer oh given that nothing improves net year just how long do we keep frawley for