Is PC a euphemism for 'nice?' | PUNT ROAD END | Richmond Tigers Forum
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Is PC a euphemism for 'nice?'

Giardiasis said:
And how do we decide what is considered discriminatory? By your reasoning anyone that takes offence to something can argue they are being discriminated against. "That physics professor said that women aren't as good physicists as men, he is discriminating against women! We need a government appointed team of workplace equality experts to review the professor's hiring practices and if he can't prove otherwise he must face legal prosecution!". Regardless of whether or not the professor is right or wrong in his judgement (it's not really open to objective measurement in any case), he should be entitled to his opinion, and be free from fear of prosecution for having an opinion. Chris Nelson potentially facing jail time for sending NPK a racist tirade is a recent example of how far backwards we have gone as a society.
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You know, 200 years ago to say black people (or Asian people, or anyone other than white) were equal in potential to white people was "politically incorrect". To say that Irish Catholics should have the same rights as anglo-saxon protestants was politically incorrect. To say that women should have the vote was politically incorrect. 250 years ago to say that black people should not be slaves was politically incorrect. To say that homosexual people shouldn't go to jail for consensual sex was politically incorrect.

Lots of people went to jail or died because they said these "politically incorrect" things.

Yep, society sure has gone backwards since those days.
 
antman said:
You've got nothing, have you?
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Lol, well perhaps you could first address your argumentative fallacies. Where did I make the comparison from today to over 200 years ago? Oh and thanks for making some astute arguments for the anti politically correct side.
 
Giardiasis said:
Regardless of whether or not the professor is right or wrong in his judgement (it's not really open to objective measurement in any case), he should be entitled to his opinion, and be free from fear of prosecution for having an opinion.
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Of course its open to objective measurement. Basic 1 week desktop research project. Look up undergrad enrollments and graduations for male and female students, honours and PhD enrollments and results. Published articles. Easy. Happens all the time.
 
antman said:
You know, 200 years ago to say black people (or Asian people, or anyone other than white) were equal in potential to white people was "politically incorrect". To say that Irish Catholics should have the same rights as anglo-saxon protestants was politically incorrect. To say that women should have the vote was politically incorrect. 250 years ago to say that black people should not be slaves was politically incorrect. To say that homosexual people shouldn't go to jail for consensual sex was politically incorrect.

Lots of people went to jail or died because they said these "politically incorrect" things.

Yep, society sure has gone backwards since those days.
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Good post ant. Yes, it used to be politically correct to speak of foreign, black or gay people as sub-human. And in my parents and grandparents lifetime.

Political correctness is mostly innocuous, occasionally a bit annoying, but also stopping and thinking about why you're a bit annoyed can be a useful exercise.

Shouldn't the thread be titled 'PC is a synonym for nice'?
 
tigersnake said:
Of course its open to objective measurement. Basic 1 week desktop research project. Look up undergrad enrollments and graduations for male and female students, honours and PhD enrollments and results. Published articles. Easy. Happens all the time.
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You can use statistics to base your opinion on but the opinion that men are better physicists than women is a subjective value judgement.
 
Giardiasis said:
You can use statistics to base your opinion on but the opinion that men are better physicists than women is a subjective value judgement.
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I'm saying it isn't. And you can't just explain it away as statistics. Proportions of men and women who excel, which will all be on the record and readily available, will tell the tale. Its very simple to measure and assess. Especially something like elite physicists, that's about as easy to objectively measure gender balance and performance as it gets.
 
Giardiasis said:
Lol, well perhaps you could first address your argumentative fallacies. Where did I make the comparison from today to over 200 years ago? Oh and thanks for making some astute arguments for the anti politically correct side.
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Many of these things still happened far less time ago than that. The point is you only care about political correctness that goes against your world view. That which doesn't is hunky dory eh?

And your absurd point about society going backwards due to PC is laughable. Culture and politics change constantly for better and for worse.
 
tigersnake said:
I'm saying it isn't. And you can't just explain it away as statistics. Proportions of men and women who excel, which will all be on the record and readily available, will tell the tale. Its very simple to measure and assess. Especially something like elite physicists, that's about as easy to objectively measure gender balance and performance as it gets.
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You can objectively say, "there are more men than women" or "on average, men scored higher marks". But to say something is better than something else is a ordinal measurement, not a cardinal measurement.
 
antman said:
Many of these things still happened far less time ago than that. The point is you only care about political correctness that goes against your world view. That which doesn't is hunky dory eh?

And your absurd point about society going backwards due to PC is laughable. Culture and politics change constantly for better and for worse.
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Hunky dory? I want people to be able to say whatever they want within the bounds of private property (e.g. falsely yelling fire in a theatre should be illegal). Do you think this is hypocritical and if so why?

Yeah perhaps backwards isn't the right way to describe it in terms of history, but it is certainly not conducive to advancing society and I'd argue that it can lead to deleterious consequences such as strengthening extreme sentiment.
 
Giardiasis said:
You can objectively say, "there are more men than women" or "on average, men scored higher marks". But to say something is better than something else is a ordinal measurement, not a cardinal measurement.
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Whatever. Companies, governments, footy clubs make assessments and act on objective measurements of achievemtns all the time. The point doesn't really relate to your original one. A physics professor can say men are better than women, and that would easily be disproven by Honours, PhDs Prizes, professorships etc. But now you seem to be saying that a physics professor might say that man Nobel prize winning professor is better than that woman winning one, the point of which I'm not sure of, pointless? Its like saying Michael Voss is better than Mark Ruccuitto, they are both Brownlow, flag winning superstars. An Adelaide supporter would probably say Ruccuito is better, And vice versa, who cares?
 
Giardiasis said:
Hunky dory? I want people to be able to say whatever they want within the bounds of private property (e.g. falsely yelling fire in a theatre should be illegal). Do you think this is hypocritical and if so why?

Yeah perhaps backwards isn't the right way to describe it in terms of history, but it is certainly not conducive to advancing society and I'd argue that it can lead to deleterious consequences such as strengthening extreme sentiment.
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I don't think your first point is hypocritical - did I ever say it was? It's a position.

Personally I'm of the "give themselves enough rope to hang themselves" and get it all out in the open - I can see that unfortunately at times this can mean when people say stupid things it empowers others to act stupidly and carry out assaults and so on.

Accept your clarification on the backwards thing.
 
antman said:
I don't think your first point is hypocritical - did I ever say it was? It's a position.

Personally I'm of the "give themselves enough rope to hang themselves" and get it all out in the open - I can see that unfortunately at times this can mean when people say stupid things it empowers others to act stupidly and carry out assaults and so on.

Accept your clarification on the backwards thing.
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Well you said, "The point is you only care about political correctness that goes against your world view. That which doesn't is hunky dory eh?", which sounded like an accusation of hypocrisy. What sort of political correctness do you think I consider hunky dory?
 
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