Indigenous History Debate

[graystar1]

It seems there could be numerous parallels here with Marlion Pickett when he was growing up in his late teens and early 20s... note also Andrew Krakouer as another RFC player who was convicted of assault with intent to cause bodily harm in 2008 and subsequently did porridge in his early 20s.

I hope the RFC continues to support this young man's development both on and off the field.

Me, like all the other guessing pundits out there, do not have have a total handle on Sydney Stack's upbringing and those challenges he has faced in his short life. My apologies to those Aboriginal and Torres Strait Islanders who are RFC supporters who have much more than one iota of knowledge about those innumerable cultural and societal challenges their people face, especially for those young men like Sydney Stack and Marlion Pickett etc. before him.

Well said garcon. I also have little idea of aboriginal culture except what I read and hear on the media.

I might add here that we have just watched Tony Robinson's show of 6 episodes of Discover Australia.

That gives a good insight into what has happened, not only to the indigenous Australians but to all Aussies of every ilk.

These programmes should be compulsory subjects in schools for the children to learn a lot about our history, sadly lacking today.

 

[22nd Man]

Sadly lacking... forever. Hope your "today " didn't mean to imply it was part of curriculum in the past. Unless it was?

 

[gehring]

Sadly lacking... forever. Hope your "today " didn't mean to imply it was part of curriculum in the past. Unless it was?

I went to Thornbury High in the early 1960's the house names were "Blair, Nichols, Saunders and Onus" don't get caught up in general consensus that our indigenous history was not covered then in the curriculum. Like astronomy what was covered then is not what is considered fact now nor will it be the same in the future. All generations think they are smarter and more righteous than the previous ones, hope we all have good arguments when our grandchildren question our 'truths.'

 

[Althom]

I went to Thornbury High in the early 1960's the house names were "Blair, Nichols, Saunders and Onus" don't get caught up in general consensus that our indigenous history was not covered then in the curriculum. Like astronomy what was covered then is not what is considered fact now nor will it be the same in the future. All generations think they are smarter and more righteous than the previous ones, hope we all have good arguments when our grandchildren question our 'truths.'

The black armband view of history and collective guilt is this decade's "in thing".

 

[LeeToRainesToRoach]

These programmes should be compulsory subjects in schools for the children to learn a lot about our history, sadly lacking today.

History today is less objective fact than historical perversion of the sort that sees a little-known cricketer named Johnny Mullagh elevated to the Hall of Fame ahead of Bill Brown who averaged 50 as a Test opener. What the national team wouldn't do for a Bill Brown right now...

I guess there are two broad schools of thought here - one that believes the same basic standard of behaviour should apply to all players at the club, and another that insists on a form of apartheid to cater for some perceived inferiority. Before anyone goes throwing the word around, maybe have a think about who the true racists are.

 

[tigerman]

I went to Thornbury High in the early 1960's the house names were "Blair, Nichols, Saunders and Onus" don't get caught up in general consensus that our indigenous history was not covered then in the curriculum. Like astronomy what was covered then is not what is considered fact now nor will it be the same in the future. All generations think they are smarter and more righteous than the previous ones, hope we all have good arguments when our grandchildren question our 'truths.'

Not sure whether he was able to get the curriculum changed, but John Howard was not happy with how Aboriginal history was being taught in schools. He didn't like our kids learning the warts and all of Australia's early history

 

[seven]

View attachment 11415
They did.

WTF!
Why isn’t billy sitting at the kids table?

 

[Streak]

WTF!
Why isn’t billy sitting at the kids table?

For a second there I thought that was a dunny in the background. Assume it is actually a bath tub?

 

[tigertim]

Personally I have a third school of thought, that the same standards of behaviour apply to all people, but that as a white male, the racism that has been sustained and ingrained in my people over every generation, requires a level of understanding to my indigenous brothers that I cannot expect for myself.

Yes, racism is ingrained in white people......

 

[momentai]

Yes, racism is ingrained in white people......

Do you think white people would have tolerated the manner in which our indigenous people have been treated over 250 years, if it wasn't?

 

[tigertim]

Do you think white people would have tolerated the manner in which our indigenous people have been treated over 250 years, if it wasn't?

Your question still supposes all white people are racist, that's absurd.

 

[yandb]

Personally I have a third school of thought, that the same standards of behaviour apply to all people, but that as a white male, the racism that has been sustained and ingrained in my people over every generation, requires a level of understanding to my indigenous brothers that I cannot expect for myself.

Big Richo if you believe that you are racist that is something you have to deal with but don't project your guilt onto others of European decent.

 

[Brodders17]

I guess there are two broad schools of thought here - one that believes the same basic standard of behaviour should apply to all players at the club, and another that insists on a form of apartheid to cater for some perceived inferiority. Before anyone goes throwing the word around, maybe have a think about who the true racists are.

i think people, and this applies to footballers, should be treated as individuals and their life circumstances should be taken into consideration when responding to issues.
In Stack's case he shouldnt be given a free ride because he is Aboriginal, but his history and upbringing, which is reflective of the upbringing of many Indigenous Australians, must be a factor in how he is treated.

 

[Brodders17]

The black armband view of history and collective guilt is this decade's "in thing".

we should be celebrating the treatment of Indigenous Australians.

List of massacres of Indigenous Australians - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Slavery in Australia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Payslips found by chance at local dump lead to history-making class action

Years of payslips discovered by chance at a local dump helped Hans Pearson pursue the history-making class action that resulted in a $190 million settlement, as analysts claim the true cost of unpaid wages is closer to $500 million.

www.abc.net.au

(sorry for the wiki link- they were a quick google- they do link to proper research.)

 

[Brodders17]

we should be celebrating the treatment of Indigenous Australians.

List of massacres of Indigenous Australians - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Slavery in Australia - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Payslips found by chance at local dump lead to history-making class action

Years of payslips discovered by chance at a local dump helped Hans Pearson pursue the history-making class action that resulted in a $190 million settlement, as analysts claim the true cost of unpaid wages is closer to $500 million.

www.abc.net.au

(sorry for the wiki link- they were a quick google- they do link to proper research.)

but we should probably stop this discussion before we have another racial tolerance thread going.

 

[Althom]

View attachment 11415
They did.

Are the women in some sort of cult?

 

[tigertime2]

Personally I have a third school of thought, that the same standards of behaviour apply to all people, but that as a white male, the racism that has been sustained and ingrained in my people over every generation, requires a level of understanding to my indigenous brothers that I cannot expect for myself.

The English actually stepped up and spent the cold hard cash to develope the country that some now want to enjoy the benefits of for free!! its just about money. Selfish money hungry people...they come in all skin colours.

 

[Althom]

Personally I have a third school of thought, that the same standards of behaviour apply to all people, but that as a white male, the racism that has been sustained and ingrained in my people over every generation, requires a level of understanding to my indigenous brothers that I cannot expect for myself.

"my people"?
I take it you are speaking solely on behalf of yourself and your immediate family?

 

[yandb]

It's not to say that every white person is a racist. They're not and I'm not.

But as a white male I understand my people have an awful and shameful history of racism that has not completely been eradicated to this day. I don't shy away from taking responsibility for the behaviours of my ancestors.

I understand other people feel differently and that's fine. People have to live their own values.

From my perspective, after a very sheltered life I have been fortunate enough to get to know a lot of indigenous men in the past 10 years. I've heard their stories and gained an insight into who they are and how they feel. It's been a life affirming experience for me and something I wish everyone could do.

There you go again projecting Big Richo using the phrase 'My people', infering all white people have a shameful history of racism.

You can speak for yourself and your ancestors and if they engaged in acts of racism than that is your burden to bear.

Most Europeans emigrated here after federation so to paint them as racist because they are European makes no sense.

 

[Althom]

I certainly don't want to get involved in a debate, so I'll just say from my point of view there's no question of inference, it's just a fact.

After all, for 60 odd years after Federation Aboriginal people were not even universally given the right to participate in democracy by being allowed to cast a vote.

It's a difficult issue and probably not best suited to internet debate however, so I will respectfully agree to disagree and head back to footy chat.

"It's not to say that every white person is a racist. They're not and I'm not."
"so I'll just say from my point of view there's no question of inference, it's just a fact."

So which is it?

Are all white people racist or is it just every white person that's not you?