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IMPORTANT // Please look after your loved ones, yourself and be kind to others. If you are feeling that the world is too hard to handle there is always help - I implore you not to hesitate in contacting one of these wonderful organisations Lifeline and Beyond Blue ... and I'm sure reaching out to our PRE community we will find a way to help. T.
GREENS
- Thread starter dukeos
- Start date
Unless this country has a political revolution they're always going to battle. A lot of people who may otherwise consider voting for them will vote for one of the major parties because they know one of them is going to win. They really dislike one party so are realistic enough to know that the only way to help stop that party getting in is to vote for the other major party.
Here's their alphabetical list of policies http://greens.org.au/election/policy.php - as you can see they are about a lot more than climate change and pure environmental issues. Some of their policies I agree with - some I don't. Some I agree with the goal, but disagree with the mechanisms they propose to achieve the goal.
Some of their ideas for water are fantastic for example - they have a "think small" approach - spend a lot less money to save water in homes and industry with cheap readily available technologies (tanks and water recycling systems, lo-flow shower heads, regulations on water conservation/recycling systems in all newly built homes etc) rather than build extremely expensive dams and desalination plants. This has the same outcomes but costs less.
Another green policy - remove the subsidies on 4wd vehicles for city dwellers. Currently 4wd vehicles have more tariff protections and more subsidies - many city dwellers buy them for no good reason as they are comparatively more affordable than ordinary sedans and city type vehicles. They use more fuel and are more dangerous to other road users. Note this just brings the 4wd tariff regime into line with other vehicles - its not actually penalising people.
I'm far from a rabid greenie but support some of their ideas, and step in when I see people criticising unfairly when they have no idea about the policy scope or objectives that the greens actually offer.
Having said all that they did not increase their overall primary vote much and may squeak one or two extra senators in but may have the same level of power as they did before the election so that is a disappointing result for them really.
Some of their ideas for water are fantastic for example - they have a "think small" approach - spend a lot less money to save water in homes and industry with cheap readily available technologies (tanks and water recycling systems, lo-flow shower heads, regulations on water conservation/recycling systems in all newly built homes etc) rather than build extremely expensive dams and desalination plants. This has the same outcomes but costs less.
Another green policy - remove the subsidies on 4wd vehicles for city dwellers. Currently 4wd vehicles have more tariff protections and more subsidies - many city dwellers buy them for no good reason as they are comparatively more affordable than ordinary sedans and city type vehicles. They use more fuel and are more dangerous to other road users. Note this just brings the 4wd tariff regime into line with other vehicles - its not actually penalising people.
I'm far from a rabid greenie but support some of their ideas, and step in when I see people criticising unfairly when they have no idea about the policy scope or objectives that the greens actually offer.
Having said all that they did not increase their overall primary vote much and may squeak one or two extra senators in but may have the same level of power as they did before the election so that is a disappointing result for them really.
Disco08 said:
I actually disagree. With the ALP moving to the Centre, the door is right open for them to "own" the Socialist Left side of politics. They will never command Govt, but there is 10-20% of the population in that group, so they can make Govt.
bob is a knob.antsy the tarrif protections on 4wd was implemented by hawke and keating.ask ford why they kept reheating the xd ute that was designed 1977-79? ask holden why they dropped the wb line?cause they had to adhere to passenger car rules while toyota didnt have to and flooded the market.on the water issue,our great leader bracksy thought it was a great idea to tax the hell outa new blocks of land rather than make all new houses have water tanks.forward thinking that was.
ssstone said:
The stupid 4wd tariff discount is a joke, only in because poli's on both sides are petrified of farmer backlash. Give them a rebate at time of sale, and make the Toorak housewives pay more I say (its just about tariff parity to cars for me).
On water, water tanks are a drop in this solution. Getting our national irrigation network modernized is the big win, and this will cost billions. Most people don't realize the majority of irrigation channels are still of the same make as they were when they were created just after WWI. Not farmers fault this one, they cannot afford the massive cost involved, which is why we have to do something on a national level.
t74 tanks are the issue.if every new house built in the last 5 years had tanks our supplies would be much higher,remember here in vic we havnt added any water storage since the thompson was completed ,and our population was half of what it is now.and i know for a fact that they/we cant fill maroondah or the thompson even with the heaveist rain falls cause of 2nd rate containment walls.TRUE FACT.
ssstone said:
I forget the exact figure, but Bolt had the figure at to match a dam, 150m tanks are needed.
Tanks are a part of the solution, and I actually agree should be mandatory for all new homes. But they are not the final answer.
Disagree that it is nonsense (a bit hyped maybe but not nonsense) as if the Greens weren't there to give their preferences to Labour a different party could have been there to give preferences to the Libs. IMO this could have made for a different outcome in a number of the very close seats we ended up with, one being Bennelong.mb64 said:
As for if they will "wash away with the Democrats" I truly hope not! If they do it will be a big win for big business, something we don't need to happen.
K3 said:
There will always be a "left" party. Be it the Communists, the ALP, the DLP, the Democrats, the Greens, or whoever, the socialist left in the electorate will always have some to vote for. With the Greens, their longevity will be determined by how well they manage the conflicting issues of staying true to their Green credentials, but at the same time having the policy flexibility needed when managing the balance of power.
As for "someone else could preference Libs", this is tosh. As long as the ALP is more left than the Libs are, they will always get the bulk of Green preferences (unless they go nuclear or reintroduce whaling).
Agree with some of what you're saying Tiger74, and don't with others. To me it sounds like you are promoting a Left is left is left is left theory. To me this generalisation doesn't work with any political philosophy as there are many variations of everything, normally created to push a certain persons/parties agenda and it is this which leads me to feel that without the Greens things could have been different.Tiger74 said:
And just out of curiosity, what exactly is 'tosh'?
yes antsy i agree with tis policy.ive been talking about this for ten plus years.all new houses should have tanks connected to the mains ,so only in extreme circumstances will they top their tanks up from the mainsantman said:
im for tarrifs on EVERY imported car/4wd.remember this post in ten years antman when our auto industry that is unique in the modern world goes the way of the british car industry..its not only the designers/enginners/or the assembley workers but the companys that provide the outsourced things.like ajax fasteners of a few years ago.for a country of 20+ mill we open ourselves up to self inflicted rape by trying to be the world leaders on zero tarrifs ,in 1980's holden built commodore/statesman/ute/gemini/one tonner in aus.ford built laser/falcon/ute/fairlane/cortina,we now build coomodore/statesman and falcon because of hawke,s and buttons lowering of tarrifs that keating and howard failed to arrest that open us up to imports.we need to start to protect our manurfactoring ind before we are just a country of importers.antman said:
