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G20 protests/APEC
- Thread starter Liverpool
- Start date
Re: G20 protests
In over 2 months that is the best reply you can think of? While we're actively stereotyping let me ask what's upset you mate. Lentils going down the wrong way today? Did you miss your macrame class?
Whilst there are a number of people who do have legitimate views on elements of this issue it has been proven in the past that there is a substantial element that roll up to various events and look to cause trouble. It is these people to which I was referring and I stand by what I've said.
If you think mob destruction is a good thing then that's up to you.
tigersnake said:
In over 2 months that is the best reply you can think of? While we're actively stereotyping let me ask what's upset you mate. Lentils going down the wrong way today? Did you miss your macrame class?
Whilst there are a number of people who do have legitimate views on elements of this issue it has been proven in the past that there is a substantial element that roll up to various events and look to cause trouble. It is these people to which I was referring and I stand by what I've said.
If you think mob destruction is a good thing then that's up to you.
Re: G20 protests
Tigersnake - if you owned a car or property that was destroyed by this lowlife rabble rioting under the guise of protesting, would you be so congratulatory on their attention grabbing methods? If you pay tax that's exactly what happened to you, everything they damaged and destroyed was paid for with tax. Ironically most of these cowardly, cause jumping, unwashed losers live off the system they despise so much.
Talk about bizarre - I, and other decent citizens, pay tax that is used for infrastructure that is destroyed by people collecting benefits paid for from the same. Even better tax funded employees doing their job (aka police) are needed in vast numbers to try and protect both private and public property not to mention innocent bystanders.
Tigersnake - if you owned a car or property that was destroyed by this lowlife rabble rioting under the guise of protesting, would you be so congratulatory on their attention grabbing methods? If you pay tax that's exactly what happened to you, everything they damaged and destroyed was paid for with tax. Ironically most of these cowardly, cause jumping, unwashed losers live off the system they despise so much.
Talk about bizarre - I, and other decent citizens, pay tax that is used for infrastructure that is destroyed by people collecting benefits paid for from the same. Even better tax funded employees doing their job (aka police) are needed in vast numbers to try and protect both private and public property not to mention innocent bystanders.
Re: G20 protests
Macrame class, thats actually pretty funny. I'll give you that one. I haven't said anywhere that I think mob destruction is a good thing, all I've been saying is that I can see why they do it. Also its just the mindless tone of a lot of the posts that annoy me. You don't like their tactics, fine, you don't like their cause, fine. But you guff is over the top. To me 'scum' are people who rape and kill, blow up innocent people. Having a blue with the cops is as Aussie meat pies and footy, people for some bizaare reason forget that. Also, the 'their live are rubbish' type comments. How do you know? They might be kicking back in a hammock the rainforest with a homebrew, a spliff and a sexy hippy spouse for all you know.
And then there's the 'legitimate view' comment, which is the biggest pile of horseshit. Do you know what the view is? I've stated it earlier but I'll state it again, basically its about trying to get a fairer deal for poor countries. Trying to alter the way the WTO does thing so farmers in Ghana and Peurto Rico can make enough from their crop to do more than just barely feed their families. About trying to get the yanks to actually do what they said they were gunna do and rebuild Iraq and to promote local busines, rather than just give corrupt overblown multi-billion contracts to US companies like *smile* Cheney's Halibuton, things like that.
Yeah there probably are a few who are just looking for a blue, but I'd bet they aren't a majority but a minority.
When I see a protest that gets a lot of coverage, regardless of whether I agree with the cause or methods or whatever, I want to know a bit more about it.
TigerGoneNorth said:
Macrame class, thats actually pretty funny. I'll give you that one. I haven't said anywhere that I think mob destruction is a good thing, all I've been saying is that I can see why they do it. Also its just the mindless tone of a lot of the posts that annoy me. You don't like their tactics, fine, you don't like their cause, fine. But you guff is over the top. To me 'scum' are people who rape and kill, blow up innocent people. Having a blue with the cops is as Aussie meat pies and footy, people for some bizaare reason forget that. Also, the 'their live are rubbish' type comments. How do you know? They might be kicking back in a hammock the rainforest with a homebrew, a spliff and a sexy hippy spouse for all you know.
And then there's the 'legitimate view' comment, which is the biggest pile of horseshit. Do you know what the view is? I've stated it earlier but I'll state it again, basically its about trying to get a fairer deal for poor countries. Trying to alter the way the WTO does thing so farmers in Ghana and Peurto Rico can make enough from their crop to do more than just barely feed their families. About trying to get the yanks to actually do what they said they were gunna do and rebuild Iraq and to promote local busines, rather than just give corrupt overblown multi-billion contracts to US companies like *smile* Cheney's Halibuton, things like that.
Yeah there probably are a few who are just looking for a blue, but I'd bet they aren't a majority but a minority.
When I see a protest that gets a lot of coverage, regardless of whether I agree with the cause or methods or whatever, I want to know a bit more about it.
Re: G20 protests
What a ridiculous comment.
I like meat pies and footy but I've never had a blue with the Police in my life.
I may be wrong but I don't think there's anything bizarre about that whatsoever.
tigersnake said:
What a ridiculous comment.
I like meat pies and footy but I've never had a blue with the Police in my life.
I may be wrong but I don't think there's anything bizarre about that whatsoever.
Re: G20 protests
Its not a ridiculous comment TOO, look at the history, the Eureka Stockade, the general strike and riots of the late 1800s, the gang wars in inner-city Melbourne in the 1930s, the bodgies v widgies v police in the 1950s, anti-Vietnam protests, the freedom rides in the 1960s, the anti-Springbok rugby tour protests in the 1970s, endless civil rights protests in Brisbane during the Bjelke-Petersen era. The blockade of the school in Richmond that Kennett shut in the 1990s. The Patrick wharf picket-line in the late 1990s. These are just off the top of my head. I’m sure older PREnders could think of more examples. Now personally I don’t think this latest protest which we’re talking about here was much chop. But that to me isn’t the point, the point I was making there was that Australia has a rich history of violent protests where people have taken on the cops. To get noticed you have to get angry, its simple. All this bloody moral outrage and preciousness and demonising of people you don’t agree with, playing the man and not the ball, just annoys the hell out of me.
Tigers of Old said:
Its not a ridiculous comment TOO, look at the history, the Eureka Stockade, the general strike and riots of the late 1800s, the gang wars in inner-city Melbourne in the 1930s, the bodgies v widgies v police in the 1950s, anti-Vietnam protests, the freedom rides in the 1960s, the anti-Springbok rugby tour protests in the 1970s, endless civil rights protests in Brisbane during the Bjelke-Petersen era. The blockade of the school in Richmond that Kennett shut in the 1990s. The Patrick wharf picket-line in the late 1990s. These are just off the top of my head. I’m sure older PREnders could think of more examples. Now personally I don’t think this latest protest which we’re talking about here was much chop. But that to me isn’t the point, the point I was making there was that Australia has a rich history of violent protests where people have taken on the cops. To get noticed you have to get angry, its simple. All this bloody moral outrage and preciousness and demonising of people you don’t agree with, playing the man and not the ball, just annoys the hell out of me.
Re: G20 protests
You just don't get it do you?
It's not the message we are demonising. It's the way the message is being delivered. Please stop twisting what most of us are saying.
You just don't get it do you?
It's not the message we are demonising. It's the way the message is being delivered. Please stop twisting what most of us are saying.
Re: G20 protests
I agree that happens too much on political or religious threads but it's also exactly what an element of the protestors did when they attacked the police and their horses.
I can't understand how people condone anyone initiating that kind of violence.
I can't accept violence should be tolerated as a way to get attention. It's like a little kid screaming and crying and kicking their parent's shins because they want the lollies in the supermarket aisle. Should they get the lollies or should they be ignored because the behaviour shouldn't be rewarded?
Violent protestors would do their cause more harm than good.
tigersnake said:
I agree that happens too much on political or religious threads but it's also exactly what an element of the protestors did when they attacked the police and their horses.
I can't understand how people condone anyone initiating that kind of violence.
I can't accept violence should be tolerated as a way to get attention. It's like a little kid screaming and crying and kicking their parent's shins because they want the lollies in the supermarket aisle. Should they get the lollies or should they be ignored because the behaviour shouldn't be rewarded?
Violent protestors would do their cause more harm than good.
Re: G20 protests
It seems according to most I've never had the plot mb.
Rosy, I haven't condoned it. I'm just looking at what they were trying to achieve and why. I don't think they pulled if off myself. Over-the-top reactionary guff annoys me thats all. I was always taught to try and see things from the other side.
mb64 said:
It seems according to most I've never had the plot mb.
Rosy, I haven't condoned it. I'm just looking at what they were trying to achieve and why. I don't think they pulled if off myself. Over-the-top reactionary guff annoys me thats all. I was always taught to try and see things from the other side.
Re: G20 protests
Yep same here ts and I can see where you're coming from but although our history has been littered with incidents of violence towards the authorities I can't accept the behaviour as Australian. I love playing devil's advocate but violence, especially towards the police makes me angry, and cancels any sympathies I might have had if the concerns were put across in a reasonable matter.
tigersnake said:
Yep same here ts and I can see where you're coming from but although our history has been littered with incidents of violence towards the authorities I can't accept the behaviour as Australian. I love playing devil's advocate but violence, especially towards the police makes me angry, and cancels any sympathies I might have had if the concerns were put across in a reasonable matter.
Re: G20 protests
and the unprovoked violence against the police and the horses dilutes the message and gets the public off side. So what's the point?
rosy23 said:
and the unprovoked violence against the police and the horses dilutes the message and gets the public off side. So what's the point?
Re: G20 protests
so putting the g20 protest aside rosy, you reckon the protesters in historical examples I list earlier should have either allowed themselves to be dispersed or beaten up by the cops? Remember this is nothing against the cops, they are just doing their job by doing what the government tells them to. If you're a cop you take on the job knowing whats involved. I wouldn't want to be a cop, they earn their dough as far as I'm concerned. All I'm saying is that throughout history, protesters ahve had to knuckle down for a fight for a cause they believe in. It might happen in the future. As far as I'm concerned the diggers at the Eureka Stockade, the Springbok rugby protesters, were heroes.
rosy23 said:
so putting the g20 protest aside rosy, you reckon the protesters in historical examples I list earlier should have either allowed themselves to be dispersed or beaten up by the cops? Remember this is nothing against the cops, they are just doing their job by doing what the government tells them to. If you're a cop you take on the job knowing whats involved. I wouldn't want to be a cop, they earn their dough as far as I'm concerned. All I'm saying is that throughout history, protesters ahve had to knuckle down for a fight for a cause they believe in. It might happen in the future. As far as I'm concerned the diggers at the Eureka Stockade, the Springbok rugby protesters, were heroes.
Re: G20 protests
The most successful protest ever was a 100,000 strong crowd walking silently through the streets of Melbourne protesting the Vietnam War. No fights. No property damage.
That's how to do it.
The most successful protest ever was a 100,000 strong crowd walking silently through the streets of Melbourne protesting the Vietnam War. No fights. No property damage.
That's how to do it.
Re: G20 protests
ts I think it's a long straw to associate the Eureka Stockade with behaviour this century where conditions and laws are very different.
The thing with the G20 protestors is they came prepared for the violence they initiated. I feel that there are rent-a-protestors who jump on any cause whether they have a strong feelings for it or not. It would be interesting to track how many different protests the abusive people have been involved in. I suspect there is a common element that are more trouble than they're worth.
I've been within an inch of my life on more than one occasion due to another person's violent obsession and I can't tolerate people who deliberatly hurt others, other than in self defence.
I agree with poppa. The Vietnam protest in it's solemn simplicity said more than physical abuse and violence ever could. Power to a united majority rather than a handfull of people who have no respect for others' rights or well-being.
ts I think it's a long straw to associate the Eureka Stockade with behaviour this century where conditions and laws are very different.
The thing with the G20 protestors is they came prepared for the violence they initiated. I feel that there are rent-a-protestors who jump on any cause whether they have a strong feelings for it or not. It would be interesting to track how many different protests the abusive people have been involved in. I suspect there is a common element that are more trouble than they're worth.
I've been within an inch of my life on more than one occasion due to another person's violent obsession and I can't tolerate people who deliberatly hurt others, other than in self defence.
I agree with poppa. The Vietnam protest in it's solemn simplicity said more than physical abuse and violence ever could. Power to a united majority rather than a handfull of people who have no respect for others' rights or well-being.
Re: G20 protests
Like I said, put the g20 aside for a minute. The fact is, it is an Australian thing to have the occasional violent protest, whether you or I like it or not. Yes the Vietnam protest was inspirational and successful, but different times and situations may call for different things. Australianness isn’t all pavlovas and Victa lawnmowers. Personally I reckon it’s a human thing rather than an Australian thing to stand up for a cause. Re the Eureka protesters, at the time they were considered contemptible rabble who should have been wiped out by a decent chunk of the population, including all the establishment.
Like I said, I actually reckon this G20 protest was a bit of a *smile*, its not how I would have done it. But in the past, similar efforts have had an effect. The big Seattle protests really shook world leaders at the time. Clinton and some others actually said maybe we should look at the issues, and they did. Often with protesting you get an extreme vanguard, then an apparent moderate view moves in behind and gets listened to. A bit like Clokey or JJ crunching a pack for Flea or KB to swoop and kick the goal. In this case the Oxfam ‘Make Trade Fair’ campaign has done that, and is doing a great job.
rosy23 said:
Like I said, put the g20 aside for a minute. The fact is, it is an Australian thing to have the occasional violent protest, whether you or I like it or not. Yes the Vietnam protest was inspirational and successful, but different times and situations may call for different things. Australianness isn’t all pavlovas and Victa lawnmowers. Personally I reckon it’s a human thing rather than an Australian thing to stand up for a cause. Re the Eureka protesters, at the time they were considered contemptible rabble who should have been wiped out by a decent chunk of the population, including all the establishment.
Like I said, I actually reckon this G20 protest was a bit of a *smile*, its not how I would have done it. But in the past, similar efforts have had an effect. The big Seattle protests really shook world leaders at the time. Clinton and some others actually said maybe we should look at the issues, and they did. Often with protesting you get an extreme vanguard, then an apparent moderate view moves in behind and gets listened to. A bit like Clokey or JJ crunching a pack for Flea or KB to swoop and kick the goal. In this case the Oxfam ‘Make Trade Fair’ campaign has done that, and is doing a great job.
