Flood Levy Poll

[Moulded Souls]

I am finding opposition to helping the Queenslanders affected by the disasters to be bizarre. If if were us I am sure we would welcome help. And too many of the opponents of the tax are doing it maybe cos they dislike Gillard or Swan or Bligh. I can't work it out. ???

Maybe all these arguments against the levy are a smokescreen for people who are bitter and hard hearted. :-\

 

[ZeroGame]

I don't see how not wanting to pay the tax has anything to do with not wanting to rebuild Queensland or being bitter and hard hearted. Its to do with a lazy government not making the required decisions to pay for it with the hundreds of billions of dollars in revenue they get every year. 1.8 billion is a drop in the ocean compared to the total revenue, so why force the public already struggling with high cost of living expenses?

 

[mld]

I don't see how not wanting to pay the tax has anything to do with not wanting to rebuild Queensland or being bitter and hard hearted. Its to do with a lazy government not making the required decisions to pay for it with the hundreds of billions of dollars in revenue they get every year. 1.8 billion is a drop in the ocean compared to the total revenue, so why force the public already struggling with high cost of living expenses?

Yes, it should be possible to discuss the issue of how assistance is funded without accusations of not wanting to help Queensland. There is a perfectly legitimate debate over whether rebuilding of public assets and assistance to affected people could be better funded through further spending cuts or through government borrowing, but it gets lost amongst the inevitable moral posturing.

 

[Moulded Souls]

i think that you are just making excuses. You have a bee in your bonnet about the government or the tazation system. You keep bringing up the same cynical arguments. You want to blame the government for everything that you don't agree with and not give them credit when something goes right.

It's so simple. We have a responsibility to help our neighbours. They dip into their pockets during our hard times and vice versa.

the Govt is relatively unimportant in this. It's the conduit by which it happens.

 

[mld]

i think that you are just making excuses. You have a bee in your bonnet about the government or the tazation system. You keep bringing up the same cynical arguments. You want to blame the government for everything that you don't agree with and not give them credit when something goes right.

It's so simple. We have a responsibility to help our neighbours. They dip into their pockets during our hard times and vice versa.

the Govt is relatively unimportant in this. It's the conduit by which it happens.

Was that directed at me? Where did that come from? Certainly not from anything I have posted.

 

[Tigers of Old]

You have a bee in your bonnet about the government

No doubt this is the case with those against this tax.
Can't believe people could be so petty otherwise.

 

[mld]

No doubt this is the case with those against this tax.
Can't believe people could be so petty otherwise.

It is possible to not begrudge paying the levy, whilst having a discussion over whether the levy is the best way to raise revenue to pay for reconstruction. Can't believe people would be so petty as to ignore this.

 

[Tigers of Old]

It is possible to not begrudge paying the levy, whilst having a discussion over whether the levy is the best way to raise revenue to pay for reconstruction.

Meanwhile..

 

[ZeroGame]

i think that you are just making excuses. You have a bee in your bonnet about the government or the tazation system. You keep bringing up the same cynical arguments.

I'm not going to deny that I don't like the Labor party's fiscal decisions, I was against the $900 stimulus payments also. I don't think the government should be blatently handing out cheques to everyone, just like I don't think they should be demanding extra payments when there is plenty of room in the budget to cover the costs. The only reason that Labor are putting up the levy is to make sure they can meet their election promise of putting the budget into surplus in a couple of years while not cutting any real costs. I'm allowed to disagree with what they are doing and that doesn't make me a cynic for doing so.

You want to blame the government for everything that you don't agree with and not give them credit when something goes right.

I'll blame them for everything I don't agree with that they are responsible for. Why wouldn't I, who else am I going to blame for their decisions?

It's so simple. We have a responsibility to help our neighbours. They dip into their pockets during our hard times and vice versa.

That's what our tax system is for in the first place, there is easily enough already there to cover expenses of the rebuild without demanding more from taxpayers. The annual GDP for 2010-11 is $315 billion, 5.6 billion of that for the rebuild is only 1.8% if the government can't find cost cuts of that much then they shouldn't be in power.

the Govt is relatively unimportant in this. It's the conduit by which it happens.

You have to be kidding, it is their responsibility to provide, maintain and repair infrastructure. Otherwise what do we pay tax for?

 

[mld]

Dipping into the taxpayer pocket to help those in need certainly isn't an issue. Fine, dip away.

Dipping into the taxpayer pocket because the government can't bring itself to, for example, reduce protectionist payments to the automative industry is more of an issue. To me anyway, but I'm a bit of a nerd about this sort of thing.

 

[Giardiasis]

No doubt this is the case with those against this tax.
Can't believe people could be so petty otherwise.

Nice way to avoid addressing the argument.

 

[Big Cat Lover]

You don't see the difference in a one off levy due to the natural disasters that have devastated sections of our country and it's people compared to an earthquake tax for something that hasn't even happened?

Where does it stop? I would prefer the government manage the books better. For most of us if our costs go up in some areas eg food, petrol, we tighten our spending in other areas.

And I'm a little cynical about how the funds are to be spent given who is "managing" the process - see home insulation disaster, building education revolution etc.

 

[TIGEREXTRA]

Excuse my ignorance but can someone tell me who pays the levi and how much do they pay?

Sorry if already stated in the thread.

 

[mld]

Excuse my ignorance but can someone tell me who pays the levi and how much do they pay?

Sorry if already stated in the thread.

fact sheet

 

[RemoteTiger]

You have to be kidding, it is their responsibility to provide, maintain and repair infrastructure. Otherwise what do we pay tax for?

No you have to be kidding - or you have had your head in the sand for a few decades - Governments have abdicated the responsibility for infrastructure yonks ago - preferring to Tender it out and allowing private companies to levy tolls and fees on the infrastructure they build on behalf of the Government.

Who in your state is responsible for -

Gas
Electricity
Water
Telecommunications
Tollways
Highways
Roads
Footpaths

Most of this is now privately owned or built by private companies under very strict Tender conditions that place the responsibility of that infrasturcture right at the feet of the company. Australian Governments have had an all care no responsibility policy for decades.

Politicians and Bureaucrats have been talking and expousing lots in the recent past but they have never managed or completed a project - they leave it to private companies to take the burden of Risk and also profit from that project. If the project works out OK the Politicians are there to open it and announce its virtues - if it doesn't they keep at arms length and point the bone at the company.

In days of yore Australain Governments built roads and powergrides and telecommunications networks and water/sewerage networks and rail netorks and owned ports - NOT today - our taxes rarely get spent on infrastructure these days it usually is a "Pay-as-you-use" scheme that builds our infrastructure.

Then what do our taxes get used for - have a look at the last few budgets of both your State and Federal Governments - besides the ususal millions spent on Public Service Departments in Salaries and Buildings etc. most of the remainder is spent on CONSULTANTS who advise the Government on what decisions it should be making - these consultants come from the large consulting firms in Australia who obviously feather their own nests when advising the Government.

All in all Governments have not completed an infrastrucure nor been responsible for an infrastructure project since the Whitlam/Frazer years in Australia.

This is my opinion built from decades of living on the doorstep of the Australian Federal Government and watching the NSW State Government - alas Victoria and Queensland are no different.

 

[evo]

No you have to be kidding - or you have had your head in the sand for a few decades - Governments have abdicated the responsibility for infrastructure yonks ago - preferring to Tender it out and allowing private companies to levy tolls and fees on the infrastructure they build on behalf of the Government.

Who in your state is responsible for -

Gas
Electricity
Water
Telecommunications
Tollways
Highways
Roads
Footpaths

Most of this is now privately owned or built by private companies under very strict Tender conditions that place the responsibility of that infrasturcture right at the feet of the company. Australian Governments have had an all care no responsibility policy for decades.

Politicians and Bureaucrats have been talking and expousing lots in the recent past but they have never managed or completed a project - they leave it to private companies to take the burden of Risk and also profit from that project. If the project works out OK the Politicians are there to open it and announce its virtues - if it doesn't they keep at arms length and point the bone at the company.

In days of yore Australain Governments built roads and powergrides and telecommunications networks and water/sewerage networks and rail netorks and owned ports - NOT today - our taxes rarely get spent on infrastructure these days it usually is a "Pay-as-you-use" scheme that builds our infrastructure.

Then what do our taxes get used for - have a look at the last few budgets of both your State and Federal Governments - besides the ususal millions spent on Public Service Departments in Salaries and Buildings etc. most of the remainder is spent on CONSULTANTS who advise the Government on what decisions it should be making - these consultants come from the large consulting firms in Australia who obviously feather their own nests when advising the Government.

All in all Governments have not completed an infrastrucure nor been responsible for an infrastructure project since the Whitlam/Frazer years in Australia.

This is my opinion built from decades of living on the doorstep of the Australian Federal Government and watching the NSW State Government - alas Victoria and Queensland are no different.

Interestingly it was the Hawke/ Keating government who made most of these 'reforms' because the Labor Party felt they had no control over the bureaucrats; and from inside the public service itself in the 80's. It came after advise from a proffessor I have at the moment in politics Jeffrey Hawker who wrote 'Who's Servant Who's Master' and the earlier Coombes Report commissioned by Whitlam.

I don't agree with you that it's "all care no responsibility". In the end if a project ferks up it is the minister and the relevant public service department chief executive that still have to take it in the neck -Brumby for Mycki, or Garret for the Pink batts stuff ups for recent examples.

 

[Azza]

i think that you are just making excuses. You have a bee in your bonnet about the government or the tazation system. You keep bringing up the same cynical arguments. You want to blame the government for everything that you don't agree with and not give them credit when something goes right.

It's so simple. We have a responsibility to help our neighbours. They dip into their pockets during our hard times and vice versa.

the Govt is relatively unimportant in this. It's the conduit by which it happens.

It's not so simple. What IS simple is that Australia as a whole should help fix Qld. What's not simple is how it should be done.

Cynical the arguments may be, but if you think governments aren't cynical enough to take advantage of/manipulate popular feeling to improve their bottom line, you're naive.

 

[Tigers of Old]

Interesting..

Hockey admits Liberal levy donations a mistake
http://www.abc.net.au/news/stories/2011/02/07/3131820.htm?section=justin

 

[RemoteTiger]

Interestingly it was the Hawke/ Keating government who made most of these 'reforms' because the Labor Party felt they had no control over the bureaucrats; and from inside the public service itself in the 80's. It came after advise from a proffessor I have at the moment in politics Jeffrey Hawker who wrote 'Who's Servant Who's Master' and the earlier Coombes Report commissioned by Whitlam.

I don't agree with you that it's "all care no responsibility". In the end if a project ferks up it is the minister and the relevant public service department chief executive that still have to take it in the neck -Brumby for Mycki, or Garret for the Pink batts stuff ups for recent examples.

And there are many many more Minsters who dodged a bullet over the last 3 decades - and the Department Heads have taken the wrap!

 

[ssstone]

... and anyone who objects is just downright unAustralian!!!
[/quote]count me as un orstralian evo,between the dudd the swan and the duck(yes joolya your ass does look big in that)all they have done is spend,spend spend then tax tax tax ,find some savings you foolish pricks ,start with ex pm 's allowances



































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