Coronavirus

[Althom]

I don't see it that way at all, its not in anyone's best interests to have Melbourne's afghan community feel unfairly targeted and pissed off. Sutton could have identified them by suburb. And apologising for it doesn't hurt anyone, in fact it demonstrates humility. I don't understand why anyone would have a problem with this.

The 34 people involved aren't representative of ALL people with afghani heritage currently living in Melbourne. I don't know what the total numbers are, but wager its a lot more than 34.

Sutton said "Having been to Afghanistan a couple of times over the years, I want to be able to reflect on my cultural experiences and the fact I know that there are universal motivations that every family has to do the right thing to protect their own families and the wider community. That is absolutely the case here and I know they're motivated to get on top of this as much as anyone."

He also said the Afghan community in Casey was "a priority for engagement and priority for testing" - because 34 people in that community were infected and may well have infected others within their communities whilst breaching the rules on visits.

It was a statement of fact. There was no generalisation. There was no inference that the 34 people were representative of the overall Afghan community.
Those 34 people through their selfish behaviour made themselves a priority for testing. Nothing racist about it and no need for an apology.

 

[tigertim]

His comment was that the Afghan community in Casey was "a priority for engagement and priority for testing" - because 34 people in that community were infected and may well have infected others within their communities whilst breaching the rules on visits.

It was a statement of fact. There was no generalisation. There was no inference that the 34 people were representative of the overall Afghan community.
Those 34 people through their selfish behaviour made themselves a priority for testing. Nothing racist about it and no need for an apology.

The words that have got him into trouble are:

”Having been to Afghanistan a couple of times over the years I want to be able to reflect on my cultural experiences and the fact that I know there are universal motivations that every family has: to do the right thing, to protect their families”

 

[Althom]

The words that have got him into trouble are:

”Having been to Afghanistan a couple of times over the years I want to be able to reflect on my cultural experiences and the fact that I know there are universal motivations that every family has: to do the right thing, to protect their families”

Nothing offensive about that at all. Statement of fact.

 

[IanG]

Do I understand you correctly? so if you have coronavirus and breach the restrictions and spread it around then no penalties as having coronavirus is consequence enough? Seriously?

Nope I never meant that, my original comment was prior to the discussion about penalties

 

[Tigers of Old]

Only 14 cases overnight.

 

[Ridley]

Only 14 cases overnight.

Yep very promising result. Hopefully we will keep seeing similar or lower numbers so the authorities can be confident in their ability to trace outbreaks so we can open the economy in a safe way but sooner than indicated. We are on track for the next step next Sunday but really that does sweet FA. We need to get to step 3 currently slated for 26 October. My concern is that the targets for that are overly conservative and too stringent.

 

[Sintiger]

A needless apology for stating facts.
If it hadn't been someone who could play the race card they would have been fined and universally condemned.

Not needless at all. Some morons will condemn the whole Afghan community because of the actions of a few and if you look at social media that is exactly what was happening.

 

[DavidSSS]

2 days of low numbers, this is a good sign.

This is what it looks like:



Plus, the last 5 days:

Date	New Infections	7 Day trailing ave	5 Day centred Ave	14 Day trailing ave
15 September 2020​	42​	39.14​	36.40​	53.50​
16 September 2020​	26​	36.14​	34.60​	47.50​
17 September 2020​	45​	36.86​	29.60​	45.36​
18 September 2020​	21​	34.86​	​	41.79​
19 September 2020​	14​	31.00​	​	38.36​

You can see the variability reduce as you go to longer periods for the average. Both the 5 and 7 day averages have gone up and down a bit of late, the 14 day average has only gone down.

14 day average below 40 is great. The restrictions are working.

Other states' numbers are staying down so there is hope.

DS

 

[Baloo]

The rate the numbers have fallen is very impressive. Not sure any other country has managed that. Maybe South Korea?

From afar, I'd say the lockdown measures in Vic have been very effective so far. Going hard and going early seems to be the key to managing this pandemic.

 

[Althom]

Not needless at all. Some morons will condemn the whole Afghan community because of the actions of a few and if you look at social media that is exactly what was happening.

No one who matters was. Just a few idiots on Twitter, Facebook and no doubt Parler.
The one drawing the most attention to the fact that the families are all of Afghan background was the spokeswoman for the community who said:
1. There was only 2 families involved - False
2. There was no evidence they were in fact Afghanis - False
3. The "2" families involved had not breached the regs - False

 

[Ridley]

No one who matters was. Just a few idiots on Twitter, Facebook and no doubt Parler.
The one drawing the most attention to the fact that the families are all of Afghan background was the spokeswoman for the community who said:
1. There was only 2 families involved - False
2. There was no evidence they were in fact Afghanis - False
3. The "2" families involved had not breached the regs - False

Geez I’m over the *smile* excuses we get from people in this pandemic. If they weren’t breaching the regs then how the *smile* did they transmit the virus??

“Oh poor us we’re not being supported properly.” *smile* off. Just follow the *smile* rules

 

[Althom]

Geez I’m over the *smile* excuses we get from people in this pandemic. If they weren’t breaching the regs then how the *smile* did they transmit the virus??

“Oh poor us we’re not being supported properly.” *smile* off. Just follow the *smile* rules

Precisely could have just said "We'll work with these families to make sure they understand their obligations and by the way they'd like to apologise to the Victorian Public for breaching the rules" but no it's get the Victim Card out.

 

[Sintiger]

No one who matters was. Just a few idiots on Twitter, Facebook and no doubt Parler.
The one drawing the most attention to the fact that the families are all of Afghan background was the spokeswoman for the community who said:
1. There was only 2 families involved - False
2. There was no evidence they were in fact Afghanis - False
3. The "2" families involved had not breached the regs - False

As I said it’s the idiots and morons we need to worry about.
Right or wrong the only reason anyone in the afghan community had to respond at all is because others had drawn attention to it.
Hence the CHOs apology

 

[Ridley]

Hallam family cluster accounts for 9 of the 14 new cases today

Yet we have to tiptoe around the behaviour of these *smile* selfish arseholes. *smile* that; round them all up and put them into mandatory quarantine for a month. How can we trust these people to not keep breaking the regulations?

 

[Althom]

Hallam family cluster accounts for 9 of the 14 new cases today

Yet we have to tiptoe around the behaviour of these *smile* selfish arseholes. *smile* that; round them all up and put them into mandatory quarantine for a month. How can we trust these people to not keep breaking the regulations?

Waiting for the statement that it's all someone else's fault and COVID-19 is racist.

 

[jb03]

Getting a 14 day trailing average to the target of less than 5 is very difficult. Even NSW don't have that.

 

[Sintiger]

Hallam family cluster accounts for 9 of the 14 new cases today

Yet we have to tiptoe around the behaviour of these *smile* selfish arseholes. *smile* that; round them all up and put them into mandatory quarantine for a month. How can we trust these people to not keep breaking the regulations?

I appreciate that feeling Ridley but we have to understand that contact tracing relies on people telling the truth. If we throw people in jail for breaking the rules that is not going to encourage the next person to do so.
It's galling I get it, but to me it's the lesser of two evils. If you go back to the start of this wave a big part of the problem with the spread was that people who were spreading the virus lied or wouldn't tell contact tracers their movements.

 

[Sintiger]

11 cases and 2 deaths evidently

 

[MD Jazz]

I'd probably cop my right whack if i was caught out breaking the rules. But as i mentioned, the rules breaking in this particular case has already occurred. There is limited value in the fines if it means it results in an outbreak in another home/business. And that is likely to occur if those within a cluster don't provide accurate/truthful contact tracing.

I don't buy the notion that this somehow will result in others flaunting the rules, or a free-for-all as you put it. These people in the Hallam outbreak were pretty dumb, so unless others want to be perceived as being as dumb these people, i think the community is likely to continue following the rules.

Great. Lets reinforce the notion that you don't need to take responsibility for your actions.

 

[MD Jazz]

Tim, that's a silly analogy because its not a murder case, its a public health issue. And no one would do that.

What would the benefit be to the community of making people pay these fines? It might make you feel that justice had been served, and quite frankly, you're feelings on this are far less important than public health.

But on the flipside doesn't it encourage people to break the covid rules given you can get out of any fines by refusing to divulge info unless you are let off?