Members' Forum 29/10/2003

[MC24]

About 90-100 members attended the Forum last night.

The mood was a lot more restrained than the previous meeting and it was easy to ask questions and have them answered honestly and as openly as was appropriate.

From memory, the following covers many of the areas discussed and questions raised by members.

Ian Campbell, Greg Hutchison, Paul Maley, Trent Jacobs and Nathan Richards ??? were in attendance from the Club.

Ian spoke about generally about the Club. We will make a small loss this season and forecasting a small profit for 2004.

Wallabies - the use of Punt Road Oval by the Wallabies is financially good for the Club and lets others know that the Oval is available for use. There are other events being looked at as well, to make use the of the oval all year round.

Marketing - Richo has been the face of the Club for virtually the past ten years, in marketing terms. But now all players will be used in marketing of the Club, so that there is no over-reliance on one or a few players.

The Club has had good feedback regarding our membership launch, from supporters, as well as other Clubs, particularly regarding the rewards system for members.

Greg filled us in on some of the goings on with the trade period and players.

Ray Hall - the Club is hopeful of retaining him.

Kelvin Moore - has OP and the Club is waiting on test results this week. Will know his situation by tomorrow.

Justin Blumfield - has had a slight setback, but will be ok. With one year on his contract, he realises 2004 is an important year for him.

Joel Bowden - is a long way back in where he needs to be and realises he has a lot of ground to make up, in the eyes of many. The question was asked why he wasn't taken from the ground more often for mistakes. Was conceded that is an area that needs to be looked at. Greg also mentioned that it is up to the Club to get the best out of the players and it is up to them to help him do that.

We may get some recycled players, in the drafts, purely because, from a financial point of view, it is less risky than going for an unproven young player.

We have recruited Johnson and Brown, so the Club is going for a balance of experience and youth. My personal spin on this is that the younger players can only benefit from the likes of Johnson and Brown, as we don't have many players with premierships to their name or the class of a Brown in the team.

There were some players offered for trade, but no Clubs were interested.

Paul Maley spoke about membership. We expect about 3,000 members to have signed up by end of October, compared to about 400 for the same time last year.

I'll post more if I remember. Or if others were in attendance they might like to add what I missed or forgot.

 

[bg25]

Thanks MC24 - very informative and much appreciated.

 

[Rosy]

Greg filled us in on some of the goings on with the trade period and players.

Thanks heaps for that MC. Can you give us any details of the trade goings on please?

 

[TigerFurious]

Joel Bowden - is a long way back in where he needs to be and realises he has a lot of ground to make up, in the eyes of many. The question was asked why he wasn't taken from the ground more often for mistakes. Was conceded that is an area that needs to be looked at. Greg also mentioned that it is up to the Club to get the best out of the players and it is up to them to help him do that.

Can you clarify this MC24? Did Joel turn up to pre-season training grossly unfit? Is it just his attitude?
I'm not sure what you meant.

 

[tigerman]

We may get some recycled players, in the drafts, purely because, from a financial point of view, it is less risky than going for an unproven young player

Thanks very much MC24.

It concerns me that we are going to recycle players again.

Last year we got Johnson, which was great.
We also picked up Schulz with the 1st round pick that we had.
We then picked up the likes of Flemming, Nicholls and Blumfield.

This year we have got Brown, which is fantastic.

Surely we need to draft a young ruckman and another tall player.

One or two recycled players would be ok I guess, but the club is not going to get recycled players the calibre of Coughlan, Newman and Zantuck.

 

[Walster]

Joel Bowden - is a long way back in where he needs to be and realises he has a lot of ground to make up, in the eyes of many. The question was asked why he wasn't taken from the ground more often for mistakes. Was conceded that is an area that needs to be looked at. Greg also mentioned that it is up to the Club to get the best out of the players and it is up to them to help him do that.

Can you clarify this MC24? Did Joel turn up to pre-season training grossly unfit? Is it just his attitude?
I'm not sure what you meant.

That sounds to me like he knows he couldve been anything at this stage of his career but realises that he is a slack mistaken ridden coodabeen. And the supprters know it too. Hope the hell he can turn it around.

 

[MC24]

Greg filled us in on some of the goings on with the trade period and players.

Thanks heaps for that MC. Can you give us any details of the trade goings on please?

It was pretty much a lot of what we have already heard about how we went about getting Nathan Brown. And about Dean Solomon saying yes and then no.

Also mentioned that by the time Solomon had said no, it was getting a bit late to go after Jacobs. But we weren't prepared to pay the price that Hawthorn are reportedly paying him anyway.

Jade Rawlings/Nick Stevens - Looks like other Clubs will come in ahead of us for these two. Will be looking at Morrison (and Copeland???).

Hope that's ok Rosy. Don't recall anything else atm.

 

[MC24]

It concerns me that we are going to recycle players again.

This year we have got Brown, which is fantastic.

Surely we need to draft a young ruckman and another tall player.

One or two recycled players would be ok I guess, but the club is not going to get recycled players the calibre of Coughlan, Newman and Zantuck.

Our lack of talls was acknowledged and we are trying to retain Hall, as well as get something in the draft.

The first three players in the draft are highly regarded. After that it's perhaps a bit of hit and miss. We have to make the most of what early picks we have, because, as you say tigerman, finding players like Coughlan, Newman and Zantuck in a 'recycled' player, with those 'very high' draft picks is very unlikely. But there's a financial burden that the Club has to be mindful of, especially in today's environment.

That's perhaps the harsh reality of the situation, because we still have to balance the books.

And when you're coming to the high picks in the draft, it's very much a lottery. Given the cost, especially now that you have to retain a young player for two years, the cost of getting an unknown quantity is a risk that you really are going to pay a high price for if it doesn't come off, compared to a 'recycled' player that you don't have to pay as much for. And generally, the recycled players we pick up are with very high draft picks.

Hope that answers your query tigerman.

 

[MC24]

Can you clarify this MC24? Did Joel turn up to pre-season training grossly unfit? Is it just his attitude?
I'm not sure what you meant.

Nothing was mentioned about attitude, TF. It was a little unclear as to what the actual problem was.

Greg did say, however, that we have used Joel in many positions on the ground and that hopefully, with a more settled line up, we will be able to put him back to a position that he is better suited to.

My guess is that it's a combination of attitude and being played out of position. Maybe they're related, who knows. Also, the fact that we haven't been hard enough on him for making mistakes hasn't helped any. This could be due to the fact that he's been asked to do jobs that he's not suited to and so given some latitude.

Joel and the Club are fully aware of where things stand now and hopefully he can turn things around.

 

[TigerFurious]

Thanks for that MC24.

Not many players can change their ways without moving clubs and with Richmond's record of player development Joel Bowden will be no different.

Its a real shame because the boy is obviously talented and could've been anything.

 

[MC24]

It's up to Joel now. I think he's aware that he's got a lot of ground to make up.

I believe many of our problems have been caused through over paying players and inflating egos in the past. The Club has recognised this and doing something about it. I think they are really working, especially with the younger players, to create a better culture and have players earn what they are paid and earn their standing within the Club.

I think you can see some signs that things are starting to change and they desperately need to.

And you can see in the attitude of the younger players coming through that there is some hope for us. And we can also see, from them, how ordinary the work ethic has been at our Club over the years and why we have the poor record that we have.

I believe things are gradually changing and that they can only get better.

I know people believe that drafting is our only hope of going anywhere and have virtually given up on the 2004 season, but I think that changing the culture can have just as dramatic an impact as the addition of any new players. What affect it has on next season, only time will tell.

 

[gustiger12]

I have an idea how we can help the club go after young kids and ease the financial Burden

Buy a Membership this year.

Good reporting people makes interesting reading. thanks to those that have contributed to this forum.

 

[MC24]

I have an idea how we can help the club go after young kids and ease the financial Burden

Buy a Membership this year.

Thanks for reminding me GT. How could I forget?

There were questions about our draw and having games scheduled at Telstra Dome. One of those being against Carlton.

To get a better run, the more members you have the better treated Clubs seem to be. At the same time, the more members Clubs have the less likely they are to have to sell home games interstate, or change the jumper for money, etc.

Basically, it's up to us supporters if we want to see our Club maintained the way we know and love it and not get pushed around by the AFL like some lightweight. No good complaining about our draw and where and when our games are played, when we have no members.

So, if you want to see us back up the top and getting a better run with our draw, etc., do as Gus suggests - get a membership.

 

[Rosy]

Basically, it's up to us supporters if we want to see our Club maintained the way we know and love it and not get pushed around by the AFL like some lightweight. No good complaining about our draw and where and when our games are played, when we have no members.

That sounds like a massive cop out to me. Like telling members to pay up and shut up. It's a catch 22 but if money paid for membership had been used more wisely over the last few years they wouldn't be in this predicament now.

As much as memberships are important everything would be a bit better if the team was compeitive on the field.

We all need to do our bit, and not lay blame on one area or another.

 

[bg25]

I have an idea how we can help the club go after young kids and ease the financial Burden

Buy a Membership this year.

Thanks for reminding me GT. How could I forget?

There were questions about our draw and having games scheduled at Telstra Dome. One of those being against Carlton.

To get a better run, the more members you have the better treated Clubs seem to be. At the same time, the more members Clubs have the less likely they are to have to sell home games interstate, or change the jumper for money, etc.

Basically, it's up to us supporters if we want to see our Club maintained the way we know and love it and not get pushed around by the AFL like some lightweight. No good complaining about our draw and where and when our games are played, when we have no members.

So, if you want to see us back up the top and getting a better run with our draw, etc., do as Gus suggests - get a membership.

Well said MC24. The only way supporters really have an influence is to get a membership. No members = no power.

Trouble is, RFC has had a massive supporter base over the years (can tell by crowd numbers) but it has never really translated into membership numbers (anout 27,00 tops). Teams like the Hawks cruise 'cause they have lots members = lots of $s, yet their crowds are never great.

I'd love to see another RFC premiership and I guess the only way I feel that I can really contribute is to buy a membership, otherwise I'm just a barracker!

 

[MC24]

That sounds like a massive cop out to me. Like telling members to pay up and shut up. It's a catch 22 but if money paid for membership had been used more wisely over the last few years they wouldn't be in this predicament now.

As much as memberships are important everything would be a bit better if the team was compeitive on the field.

We all need to do our bit, and not lay blame on one area or another.

I don't see it that anyone was blaming anyone. It's just the reality of the situation. Football today is about money and getting bums on seats and ratings.

We can't change what happened in the past, but we can do something about the future and one way to do that is by getting a membership.

 

[MC24]

No members = no power.

Pretty much seems to be the way it is these days bg25. Whether any of us like it or not.

Trouble is, RFC has had a massive supporter base over the years (can tell by crowd numbers) but it has never really translated into membership numbers (anout 27,00 tops).

I'd love to see another RFC premiership and I guess the only way I feel that I can really contribute is to buy a membership, otherwise I'm just a barracker!

There's no doubt that we have a huge supporter base. And we know that there are many supporters out there who don't become members for various reasons. Some of them have to do with financial constraints. But some are because of what has happened in the past or because the Club is not doing things the way we want them to.

We can all live in what happened in the past or think that by not buying a membership we are sending a message to the Club. But that has long since passed, they have got the message.

So we can move on and help the club go forward. Because, even though we can't influence everything that goes on at the Club, this is an area where we can have a real impact.

So it's our choice and up to us how much weight our Club carries within the AFL.

 

[Rosy]

MC I was referring to the following comment.

Basically, it's up to us supporters if we want to see our Club maintained the way we know and love it and not get pushed around by the AFL like some lightweight.
So, if you want to see us back up the top and getting a better run with our draw, etc., do as Gus suggests - get a membership.

To me that is too "basically"

If Richmond was beating the Collingwoods and Essendons and playing an exciting type of football the crowds would be massive whether people were members or not. Whether people buy a ticket or not is irrelevant to AFL scheduling.

I think memberships are vital to the club but the importance of winning games and being competitive can't be overlooked. If people saw their membership $ being used wisely I'm sure they'd be more likely to pay up.

The club need to provide an environment people want to be a part of.

There is a tendancy on this site for people to put down others for not buying a membership. I hope everyone does buy one, but I still respect their right not to.

I know people who have never even considered buying a membership and probably never will. They still go to games and support the club that way. I also know lifelong Richmond supporters who never go to games. Each to their own I reckon.

Some people have boycotted this site. They still like to read it and keep in touch with what's being said but they no longer support it.

To me that is their right. If everyone had that attitude we wouldn't have this site anymore though.

Same with Richmond. People have to be there because they want to be part of it not because other people want them to.

Let's all work together in our own ways to help make Richmond a power again. Go Tiges!

 

[MC24]

Maybe it's just my writing style :'(, but I wasn't blaming anyone for not buying a membership. I never have in the past and I don't intend to in the future. I understand that people have a choice if they want to buy a membership or not. I mentioned those who have personal issues with the Club, in my response to bg25. Maybe that clarifies things a little more.

I fully understand it's the choice of the individual. I'm just putting across my views on the issue and I hope people don't take it that I'm having a go at them. Certainly never my intention.

And I realise that the Club has got some work to do and that there are things we supporters can't control. But there are some areas that we can have an impact on, if our Club has a healthy membership level. From there, it's up to supporters if they can and want to become a member.

 

[sgloury]

[There is a tendancy on this site for people to put down others for not buying a membership.


I think you have misconstrued some of the criticism Rosy. I have been vocal with one contributor in recent times when they have come out and openly lobbied for Tiger supporters to boycott buying memberships simply because they don't like one person down at the club.

The bottom line is that if every Tiger fan had this attitude their would be no members and without members there would be no Richmond Football Club.

You are right in that this is a free country and everyone has the right to make up their own mind and to express their own opinion. However if so called supporters are going to actively lobby for other supporters not to buy memberships because they don't like such and such, then I will continue to voice my disapproval at such calls because I do not believe that this is in the best interests of the Richmond Football Club.